March 19, 2008 9:27 AM
What did you think of Obama's speech on race?
Sen. Barack Obama's stirring speech on race, politics and America continues to be the country's political talking point.
Rocky columnist Bill Johnson says the speech is worth reading - and then reading again.
Whether you like him or not, whether you will vote for him or against him, I believe this speech will one day become required reading in my grandchildren's classroom.It was a treatise on where the American people are on race, written and spoken by a mainstream American politician in a way I had never heard before, a speech I fully believed not one of them would in a million years have the personal or political guts to deliver.
"Even for those blacks who did make it," the Illinois senator said deep into his speech, "questions of race and racism continue to define their worldview in fundamental ways."
It is the one line that just sticks with me.
It has challenged me, forced me to look inward to assess the roots of the views I give here, those I share with my wife and friends and often force onto my children.
"For the men and women of Rev. (Jeremiah) Wright's generation," the senator said of his controversial pastor, "the memories of humiliation and doubt and fear have not gone away; nor has the anger and bitterness of those years."
That lone passage reminded me of my father and mother, and their generation, of their intercessions that I could not just be me, but only a super-version of myself, lest the "white man" intercede and resign me to a lifetime of scrubbing his toilets.
For them, it was all that their life experiences had taught them.
The Rocky's editorial said the speech was .cool, collected and eloquent
Columnist Vincent Carroll says Obama gave what amounted to two speeches Tuesday, the one on race that sizzled and another on policy, mostly in the final minutes, that fizzled. On race, he appreciates America's dynamism and the fact that attitudes aren't "static." But the dynamism of the American economy seems to alarm him.
Does he really believe that the "shuttered mills" he evokes were universally such great places to work, or that even if they were, that equally attractive jobs haven't sprung up to replace them? Is outsourcing entirely evil?Aren't many middle class people better off today than 10 or 20 years ago, even if some aren't? Is his vision so bleak that he really believes "most working and middle-class white Americans . . . feel their dreams slipping away"? Most?
Even if the entire middle class were being squeezed, as he believes, isn't it just a tad simplistic (not to mention demagogic) to finger "the real culprits" as a corrupt corporate culture, lobbyists, special interests and "short-term greed"?
You can read the full text of Obama's speech here.
March 18, 2008
8:57 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
WSJ: SHELBY STEELE NAILS OBAMA:
"...nothing could be more dangerous to Mr. Obama's political aspirations than the revelation that he, the son of a white woman, sat Sunday after Sunday -- for 20 years -- in an Afrocentric, black nationalist church in which his own mother, not to mention other whites, could never feel comfortable. His pastor, Rev. Jeremiah Wright, is a challenger who goes far past Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson in his anti-American outrage ("God damn America").
How does one "transcend" race in this church? The fact is that Barack Obama has fellow-traveled with a hate-filled, anti-American black nationalism all his adult life, failing to stand and challenge an ideology that would have no place for his own mother. And what portent of presidential judgment is it to have exposed his two daughters for their entire lives to what is, at the very least, a subtext of anti-white vitriol?
What could he have been thinking? Of course he wasn't thinking. He was driven by insecurity, by a need to "be black" despite his biracial background. And so fellow-traveling with a little race hatred seemed a small price to pay for a more secure racial identity. And anyway, wasn't this hatred more rhetorical than real?
But now the floodlight of a presidential campaign has trained on this usually hidden corner of contemporary black life: a mindless indulgence in a rhetorical anti-Americanism as a way of bonding and of asserting one's blackness. Yet Jeremiah Wright, splashed across America's television screens, has shown us that there is no real difference between rhetorical hatred and real hatred.
No matter his ultimate political fate, there is already enough pathos in Barack Obama to make him a cautionary tale. His public persona thrives on a manipulation of whites (bargaining), and his private sense of racial identity demands both self-betrayal and duplicity. His is the story of a man who flew so high, yet neglected to become himself."
March 18, 2008
8:57 AM
Love & Darkness & my Sidearm writes:
Obama is addressing this head-on, yet the Righty media will continue to brainwash the masses by incessantly implying that Obama is in cahoots with the Pastor and is in total agreement with him.
March 18, 2008
9:04 AM
Anonymous writes:
Can you imagine Dubya Bush trying to read that speech?
It would be impossible for Dubya - it has way too may "big words" in it.
March 18, 2008
9:08 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
If BUSH claims to be a Compasionate Conservative...would that not then open the door for OBAMA to claim that he's a Compasionate NAZI?
March 18, 2008
9:08 AM
Observer writes:
Yawn, Actions speak louder than words. 20 years of his association with this church speaks volumes, no matter what type of damage control he tries.
March 18, 2008
9:17 AM
Anonymous writes:
20years of racial hatred....no we can't..no we can't...
March 18, 2008
9:22 AM
Obama can't hide his past writes:
Too little, and way too late. Obama's trying to distance himself from another inconvenient truth: He and his family have supported racist ideology against the United States and whites for more than 20 years, and suddenly, when exposed, backs off and betrays his pastor Wright and Minister of Islam Farrakhan? Obama doth protest too much--and is a hypocrite.
March 18, 2008
9:27 AM
ElliotNC writes:
Where did Drudge get the advance copy?
Oh yeah, I forgot... the Clinton Campaign feeds him Obama stuff.
March 18, 2008
9:29 AM
jim sandrin writes:
The right wing jerks will continue to assault Obama regardless of what he says or does...and that goes for the individuals who hear and read what they want to digest...hatred and bigotry...grow up you yahoos! This man is the future of this country and he WILL be elected President of the USA...regardless of what you haters say or do...you just want to spread the falsehoods about this candidate to inflame and distort...You are sick...look on the bright side...Do you really want Bushlite McCain as your leader??? Think about that....
March 18, 2008
9:30 AM
jay writes:
As we know the far right can't run on track record or policy stances, I wonder what the swiftboaters will use for ammo after obama takes this "issue" away from them?
March 18, 2008
9:34 AM
YesWeCan writes:
Slam dunk for Obama! He put everyone in their place, especially the MSM that has tried to widen the divide.
March 18, 2008
9:38 AM
Obama's actions speak louder than his words writes:
Right wing jerks can and will go after Obama, and people of all races, and creeds that support the United States (vs. anti-white, anti-Jewish radicals like Rev Wright) should too. Obama says one thing, and his actions and association with, and support of, radicals like his pastor expose quite another. Obama has shown his true colors, and should not be president.
March 18, 2008
9:43 AM
Anonymous writes:
Obamas speech was utterly pathetic...No we can't...no we can't....this guy had 20 years dissociate himself with racial groups but obviously has felt a need to be belong to a race filled hate group...He still says he has never been in the racist church when the racist Wright gave one of his racial sermons....What a liar Obama is....does he really think we are that stupid???
What an insult the flipping idiot is.
Good bye Bama.....the devil will save you spot right next to the racist Wright and the racist Farrakhan.
Good riddens..
March 18, 2008
9:44 AM
benn writes:
That was an amazing speech.
By FAR the most Presidential speech we have heard in the last 8 years, at least.
I love how he addressed the plight of every citizen. He understands the white-middle and lower classes who don't feel like they have white advantage. He touched and illustrated the mindset of nearly every racial demographic.
How course - A few trolls like Sasquatch were never going to vote for a Democrat anyway, so they will continue their ridiculous comment that "He must believe everything his pastor says".
I think you can consider Mr. Wright to be a dead issue now (unless you are one of those few, ignorant Righties who are desperate to try and wedge into the remaining election).
Now, lets watch him significantly close the gap on HRC in PA.
March 18, 2008
9:46 AM
Obama talks unity, yet walks divisiveness writes:
Obama is a master of double-speak BS. He speaks of "unity" yet supports a pastor who preaches hate and bigotry toward whites and our great country? This is the stuff that divide us, and Obama supports it? Please.
March 18, 2008
9:46 AM
Neva Stoltz writes:
Obama changes from white to black whenever his political future is in jeopardy. He should step down and forget it. He blames the Clinton for race being an issue. This man is the one that is continually using race. He is not the black person to run for president. He has betrayed both blacks and whites. He is not a uniter but a divider out to destroy this election!
March 18, 2008
9:53 AM
Stone Cold writes:
What a FANTASTIC speech... I've forgotten that Presidents can give such compelling, eloquent and honest speeches. We haven't seen that for a very long time.
Obama will be a great President - he is clearly a uniter, and is not afraid to speak openly and honestly - which is what we saw today.
His eloquence in today's speech just clinched him the nomination, and he will be our next President.
Count on it.
March 18, 2008
9:58 AM
We could use a president of color, just not Obama writes:
Obama is a study in race identity confusion, AND cultural identity confusion. Obama talks out of both sides his mouth. He's "black" when it's convenient to call upon his color, and then suddenly calls upon his white heritage when the going gets tough, and he's scrutinized for his 20-year long-standing and CURRENT support of a hate-mongering, anti-white, anti-Jew, anti-US pastor! Obama tries to separate himself from his racist associations, yet still embraces them? What will he think of next?
March 18, 2008
9:59 AM
hlc writes:
Do you support child molestation?
Have all Catholics left the church and renounced the Pope and the priesthood? The Catholic Church has sheltered and protected the child molesters among the priesthood. Does this mean that Catholics approve of child molestation? Have all Catholic women had every possible conceivable (pun intended) child they could? Have Catholic women used birth control? Are all Catholics are against birth control because the Church is? Have all Catholics had sex ONLY for procreation? Do all Catholics believe in sexual abstinence unless the sex is for making a baby? We can go on and on and not just about the Catholic Church.
Everyone picks and chooses which tenets of their church they will follow and ACTUALLY believe. Why is Barack Obama targeted because his church leader is (justifiably) angry about the racism Blacks have experienced?
March 18, 2008
10:01 AM
Anonymous writes:
9:46... guess you should have listened to the speech. Next time, try thinking before posting.
March 18, 2008
10:06 AM
Anonymous writes:
Obama can be as eloquent as he wants, it still won't help him now. Problem is, Obama STILL supports Rev Wright PUBLICLY. Big problem, and BIG difference. Obama will do no more for healthcare or for getting us out of Iraq than any other candidate. Obama won't be the next president Count on it.
March 18, 2008
10:08 AM
Vote for John McSame 2008 writes:
I'm very happy with the economy, our enormous national debt, and the war in Iraq.
That's why I want to "stay the course"
March 18, 2008
10:09 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
RACE-RIOT BREAKS OUT AMONG DEMS:
The very first citizens to inject racism into BO's presidential campaign were not white. Nor were they journalists or reporters. They were black leaders who questioned whether Barack Obama's bi-racial genetic inheritance made him legitimately "black enough" to run as a black man.
And once he started winning, they claimed him, and stood front and center to rally African-American voters to one of their own. Many switched alliances mid-stream from Hillary Clinton to Obama.
Black leaders,BO, then Wright, then HRC, WJC and then Ferraro. When does it end? Its a racial free-for-all; a race riot without any rules. I have never seen anything so offensive, pathetic and disgraceful in my entire life; hard-core lunatics and race-Nazis have captured the Dem Party that is focused on only one issue--race. Get ready for Chicago, 1968 right here in Denver. I hope that our Nation Guard is prepared.
March 18, 2008
10:15 AM
Shaggy writes:
I like how Professional McCain is by visiting our troops and foreign nations and avoiding the embarrassing chaos the Democrats keep stirring up while the world laughs at them.
The way a President should act.
Now that is someone I would proudly vote for after seeing how disgraceful the other party has become.
The Democratic party is split in two.
They are an embarrassment.
Hell they can't even raise enough money to reach their deadlines for the DNC.
March 18, 2008
10:16 AM
Luke Brady writes:
Obama Rocks!
Most pols in this position will lie and squirm and deflect, per the "Rovian" school of winning elections.
Kudos to Barack Obama for coming out and being honest about the whole thing- this kind of honesty is refreshing and it is what America needs.
Obama has earned my vote in November.
March 18, 2008
10:20 AM
jay writes:
shag, since you brought up captain combover....why don't you share with us the bush administration accomplishments that excite you enough to cast a vote for a third term under mcsame?
March 18, 2008
10:25 AM
Anonymous writes:
"Lesser minds" will say something stupid like "Obama should denounce every single person he's ever know who has said something anti-American. Obama is clearly anti-American because he has associated with people who have criticized America in speeches."
That's why people who say such things are classified as "lesser minds".
March 18, 2008
10:26 AM
Obama desperately tries damage control--won't work this time writes:
Obama eloquent? This is too little, and way too late.
Obama's trying to distance himself from a WAY BIG inconvenient truth: Obama and family have supported racist ideology against the United States and whites for more than 20 years, and suddenly, when exposed, backs off. Yet Obama still publicly supports his pastor Wright, who's buddy-buddy with none other than black supremacist, racist, white-hater Minister of Islam Louis Farrakhan?
Obama doth protest too much--and his unwillingness (or is it inability?) to separate himself from racist associates makes him a hypocrite.
March 18, 2008
10:26 AM
mosquito writes:
Finally, America has the chance to continue the American dream and embody the dream of a United States of America. A person has come forth who has the integrity and the brilliance to view the many segments as a unified whole....a person who can lead us to a future of change....A change that we need if we are to continue as a democracy.
Thank God for giving us an opportunity of a future with Barack Obama. I believe that the vast majority of Americans want the same thing and the few who are currently blinded with the old, hateful, divisive politics that keep the few in power and the many divided will eventually come around and realize that only in community with each other, respecting our differences and acknowledging our common dreams, will we ever know joy and happiness.
buzz...buzz...
March 18, 2008
10:28 AM
Obama desperately tries damage control--won't work this time writes:
Obama eloquent? This is too little, and way too late.
Obama's trying to distance himself from a WAY BIG inconvenient truth: Obama and family have supported racist ideology against the United States and whites for more than 20 years, and suddenly, when exposed, backs off. Yet Obama still publicly supports his pastor Wright, who's buddy-buddy with none other than black supremacist, racist, white-hater Minister of Islam Louis Farrakhan?
Obama doth protest too much--and his unwillingness (or is it inability?) to separate himself from racist associates makes him a hypocrite.
March 18, 2008
10:30 AM
history buff writes:
O'Bama has more cajones than the whole group of professional haters who tirelessly post here on a daily basis. The irony that the racists are crying racism shouldn't be lost on anyone with half a brain.
Meanwhile, front page headlines in the Wall Street Journal: U.S. Mulls Next Step in Crisis. And a picture of FDR on the front page, too. I guess the Neo-Cons were serious when they said regulation, including banking regulations, are socialism. We may be heading for the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression, but at least we are winning the war on socialism.
March 18, 2008
10:32 AM
snookcatcher149 writes:
Obama represents the struggle of justice and mercy against the forces if dominance and intolerance. He experienced the vulnerability of the weak and oppressed as a child of mixed parentage raised by a single mom. He explored his heritage on both sides, discovered who he is, and developed the maturity, discipline and character to succeed remarkably in school,in career, and as a family man. He has demonstrated his management skills by conducting the most successful presidential primary campaign, in terms of contributors, money raised, and volunteer participation, in history. This speech demonstrates that he indeed talks the talk. He paid his dues in the years spent organizing voter registration on the streets of Chicago. He also walks the walk. I see no inconsistencies, apart from would be seen in any normal person. Let him who is without sin cast the first stone.
March 18, 2008
10:33 AM
Shaggy writes:
jay are you still pouting about how disgraceful the Democratic party has become?
I would probably be pouting too if I were you.
March 18, 2008
10:37 AM
JW writes:
"I like how Professional McCain is by visiting our troops and foreign nations and avoiding the embarrassing chaos the Democrats keep stirring up while the world laughs at them.
The way a President should act.
Now that is someone I would proudly vote for after seeing how disgraceful the other party has become."
If the presidents job was to do nothing but look good, Id say that was not a bad idea.
As it stands, there happens to be alot more to being president.
Prom Queen though...Shaggy should be on the comittee that elects prom queens in every school in colorado. Hes got that criteria DOWN!
"jay are you still pouting about how disgraceful the Democratic party has become?
I would probably be pouting too if I were you."
Yes, the track record for Republicans over the last 7 years is so much better.
March 18, 2008
10:37 AM
jay writes:
I'm not the one ashamed to discuss my party's track record and policy stances, shaggy
still waiting on that answer...aren't you tired of avoiding it?
March 18, 2008
10:43 AM
We're all screwed writes:
Winning the war on socialism, HB? More like privatize the profits and socialize the losses.
I'd call a $30 billon buy-out of Bear-Sterns socialism for the wealthy. I'll bet the executives all get their million dollar bonuses for running the business into the ground too.
March 18, 2008
10:43 AM
benn writes:
Pouting?
We just had the most inspiring speech in a generation - whose pouting?
It's okay Shaggy - I know you're scared of change
March 18, 2008
10:45 AM
Anonymous writes:
"The church contains in full the kindness and cruelty, the fierce intelligence and the shocking ignorance, the struggles and successes, the love and yes, the bitterness and bias that make up the black experience in America."
Ok so he acknowledges there is some problems with his church
As such, Reverend Wright’s comments were not only wrong but divisive, divisive at a time when we need unity; racially charged at a time when we need to come together to solve a set of monumental "
Then he says hes wrong and divisive and raically charged.
" As imperfect as he may be, he has been like family to me. He strengthened my faith, officiated my wedding, and baptized my children. Not once in my conversations with him have I heard him talk about any ethnic group in derogatory terms, or treat whites with whom he interacted with anything but courtesy and respect"
Then he says hes family and hes never heard him talk about any ethnic group in derogatory terms....
Which is it Barack?
btw this is not an ordinary church I've seen where we talk about jesus telling Paul to spreadin the good news to include all peoples. What happened to that?
March 18, 2008
10:50 AM
DMWSinNYC writes:
To those who have never visited a predominantly black church where many if not most of the congregation is economically-challenged, this rhetoric is not uncommon.
After 9/11/01 I felt more 'patriotic' than I had ever felt before. However, soon after that, when my best friend (who is Puerto Rican) was tripped on a sidewalk and spit upon because she was accused of being muslim - as though that is a negative; then when standing on 5th avenue seeing a pickup truck with dozens of flags waving in the air with 'Kill em All' graffiti-ed on the side; when a short time after my brother was pulled over by police more than 21 times in a matter of 3 months - whether he was driving a Honda or a Mercedes-Benz; when people who can't afford college working for minimum wage with no health benefits vote for politicians because they are 'afraid of terrorism'; these all serve to remind me that this country is full of bigoted, gullible, willingly un-informed people who allow the Few to rape us of our liberties, strip us of dignity and distract us with our own fears.
These very same guinea pigs project their own anger and hatred on a group (pick one: blacks, muslims, gays, immigrants, Mexicans) they want to believe is beneath them. No where in there do you see whites, do you?
When the constitution was written someone like me was not considered a human being. Just a few decades ago someone like me could not vote, could not go to school with a white person, could not go to the same stores, and the list goes on. Laws may have banned these things but you cannot legislate the heart of a person.
And that is where the problem lies.
No matter who gets in the White House, there will still be parts of this country where I am not welcome because of the color of my skin; I will still have to deal with bigoted remarks not only from overt bigots but (my favorites) liberal whites who are 'in the know'; I will still have to deal with blacks who dismiss me for fear that socializing too much with other blacks will disqualify them from opportunities; I will still have to deal with individuals in the workplace being surprised at my competence and intelligence; I will still have to deal with stats showing that as a black woman, over 35, with no children, the chances of my never marrying is more than double of my white counterpart.
Don't give me headache if I go to a church that commiserates with my struggles. If I do not wholly agree with a comment extracted from a sermon (and you know how long black sermons can be) but agree with the message of the entire sermon, that is not a contradiction. By the way I am not religious in the least but I was aware enough as a black person to know that when the minister spoke and most of the congregation called out "Amen!", that the message spoke a truth that resonated with them - and that we cannot deny.
The real question: What is that truth that spoke to those people's hearts?
The answer: too much of America, including some blacks do not give 2 cents about answering the question, much less fixing it.
Admit the hypocrisy of this country, people!
March 18, 2008
10:51 AM
snookcatcher149 writes:
Obama represents the struggle of justice and mercy against the forces of dominance and intolerance. He has experienced the vulnerability of a bi-racial man raised by a single mom. He rose above adverse conditions to excel in school, career and as a family man. He paid his dues and learned the ropes in the years spent organizing voter registration on the streets of Chicago. He is now demonstrating his management skills by conducting the most successful presidential primary campaign - in terms of number of contributors, amount of contributions, number of volunteers, and number of votes - in history. This speech is a masterpiece of description of America's great history and present plight. Thank God for Obama - a man with insight and vision who will, I hope, replace a man with a closed mind and blind eye to the human condition.
March 18, 2008
10:56 AM
Typical Misinformed Right-Wing Tool writes:
Under Dubya and the GOP, America has been attacked by terrorists on it's own soil, the economy has tanked, the federal debt has quadrupled, we've lost world standing among other leading nations, we've spent thousands of lives and billions of tax dollars in Iraq, we've not made huge progress against al Qaida in seven years, the nation has become divided and we've learned to expect lies and deceit from our Government.
But, WHO CARES about any of that - Dubya's PASTOR has NEVER said anything that is anti-American.
That's why I'm voting Republican again - for John McSame.
March 18, 2008
10:57 AM
k00kla writes:
Wow. Twelve nasty right-wing comments right out of the gate. Holding on to this race issue is REALLY important to you guys, huh? Your over-zealous response to this speech betrays the desperation on your side. Maybe if you hadn't spent the past 7 years goose-stepping for a twisted bunch of crooks and calling your fellow countrymen traitors every chance you got, you'd have some credibility left.
March 18, 2008
11:02 AM
Me writes:
The world is laughing at the Democratic Party? So the world isn’t laughing that the right wing has destroyed the US economy, spent 3 TRILLION on a war that will in the end make us and the country we destroyed worse off, have a president who butchers the English language more than some leaders in other countries who speak it as a second language, who has a horrific healthcare system (designed by the right wing in both parties to benefit HMO’s at the expense of the general public), who is isolated on countless issues from the rest of the world, etc. The world is laughing at what amounts to the same fake outrage that we see drummed up every election cycle by the right wing here. Sorry, the world is too busy dealing with real things to worry about this garbage. The right wing has “preachers” making millions off of their faith (didn’t Jesus have a problem with this?), calling for the assassination of other country’s presidents, blaming 9/11 on freaking lesbians & gay people, has a preacher close to McCain that has done a full frontal attack on Catholicism and they think that they can get made at Obama because his pastor said something factually correct, however too bluntly (have anything to say about the fact that the US has the highest incarceration rate in the world?)…ok, this might work for people who can’t think logically & need to be lead around like children. For people who vote for candidates based on ISSUES (like things just a tiny bit more important, say healthcare, the economy, the war, etc) and not this PR created nonsense, this is just an annoying sideshow for knuckle draggers.
Do you know why the Republicans do this every election cycle? They think their base is stupid enough to ignore the issue effecting their lives (the issues in which their party has no solutions that work, but are instead created in some ideologically rigid fashion), while paying attention to this fluff, and they’re right. You right wingers would be offended, if you had brains enough to realize how little your party thinks of your intelligence. They realize that they don’t have to come up with a solution to the healthcare crisis, the war (and all future Iraq’s that they’ll start), what to do about the power Wall Street and lobbyists have on the government, the educational system, the economy & how reliant on war we are for it to function, etc. All they have to do is create this nonsense and you idiots will pull the lever for their candidate, who offers another four years of Bush. Again, they’re right. You all ARE that stupid.
You people have the right to complain only if your side doesn’t have a long line of religious nutjobs in your party. Since you do, please grow the hell up and focus on the issues. It makes no logical sense for you, of all people, to be up in arms about what a freaking pastor said. If that were such an issue with you why the hell did you vote for Bush into office TWICE? Do you want a list of wanker quotes from the right wing preachers? My god, what guided stupidity.
March 18, 2008
11:05 AM
DMWSinNYC writes:
To those who have never visited a predominantly black church where many if not most of the congregation is economically-challenged, this rhetoric is not uncommon.
After 9/11/01 I felt more 'patriotic' than I had ever felt before. However, soon after that, when my best friend (who is Puerto Rican) was tripped on a sidewalk and spit upon because she was accused of being muslim - as though that is a negative; then when standing on 5th avenue seeing a pickup truck with dozens of flags waving in the air with 'Kill em All' graffiti-ed on the side; when a short time after my brother was pulled over by police more than 21 times in a matter of 3 months - whether he was driving a Honda or a Mercedes-Benz; when people who can't afford college working for minimum wage with no health benefits vote for politicians because they are 'afraid of terrorism'; these all serve to remind me that this country is full of bigoted, gullible, willingly un-informed people who allow the Few to rape us of our liberties, strip us of dignity and distract us with our own fears.
These very same guinea pigs project their own anger and hatred on a group (pick one: blacks, muslims, gays, immigrants, Mexicans) they want to believe is beneath them. No where in there do you see whites, do you?
When the constitution was written someone like me was not considered a human being. Just a few decades ago someone like me could not vote, could not go to school with a white person, could not go to the same stores, and the list goes on. Laws may have banned these things but you cannot legislate the heart of a person.
And that is where the problem lies.
No matter who gets in the White House, there will still be parts of this country where I am not welcome because of the color of my skin; I will still have to deal with bigoted remarks not only from overt bigots but (my favorites) liberal whites who are 'in the know'; I will still have to deal with blacks who dismiss me for fear that socializing too much with other blacks will disqualify them from opportunities; I will still have to deal with individuals in the workplace being surprised at my competence and intelligence; I will still have to deal with stats showing that as a black woman, over 35, with no children, the chances of my never marrying is more than double of my white counterpart.
Don't give me headache if I go to a church that commiserates with my struggles. If I do not wholly agree with a comment extracted from a sermon (and you know how long black sermons can be) but agree with the message of the entire sermon, that is not a contradiction. By the way I am not religious in the least but I was aware enough as a black person to know that when the minister spoke and most of the congregation called out "Amen!", that the message spoke a truth that resonated strongly with them - and that we cannot deny.
The real question: What is that truth that spoke to those people's hearts?
The answer: too much of America, including some blacks do not give 2 cents about answering the question, much less helping to find ways to fix it.
Admit the hypocrisy of this country, people!
March 18, 2008
11:05 AM
Wilber writes:
The world is laughing at the Democratic Party? So the world isn’t laughing that the right wing has destroyed the US economy, spent 3 TRILLION on a war that will in the end make us and the country we destroyed worse off, have a president who butchers the English language more than some leaders in other countries who speak it as a second language, who has a horrific healthcare system (designed by the right wing in both parties to benefit HMO’s at the expense of the general public), who is isolated on countless issues from the rest of the world, etc. The world is laughing at what amounts to the same fake outrage that we see drummed up every election cycle by the right wing here. Sorry, the world is too busy dealing with real things to worry about this garbage. The right wing has “preachers” making millions off of their faith (didn’t Jesus have a problem with this?), calling for the assassination of other country’s presidents, blaming 9/11 on freaking lesbians & gay people, has a preacher close to McCain that has done a full frontal attack on Catholicism and they think that they can get made at Obama because his pastor said something factually correct, however too bluntly (have anything to say about the fact that the US has the highest incarceration rate in the world?)…ok, this might work for people who can’t think logically & need to be lead around like children. For people who vote for candidates based on ISSUES (like things just a tiny bit more important, say healthcare, the economy, the war, etc) and not this PR created nonsense, this is just an annoying sideshow for knuckle draggers.
Do you know why the Republicans do this every election cycle? They think their base is stupid enough to ignore the issue effecting their lives (the issues in which their party has no solutions that work, but are instead created in some ideologically rigid fashion), while paying attention to this fluff, and they’re right. You right wingers would be offended, if you had brains enough to realize how little your party thinks of your intelligence. They realize that they don’t have to come up with a solution to the healthcare crisis, the war (and all future Iraq’s that they’ll start), what to do about the power Wall Street and lobbyists have on the government, the educational system, the economy & how reliant on war we are for it to function, etc. All they have to do is create this nonsense and you idiots will pull the lever for their candidate, who offers another four years of Bush. Again, they’re right. You all ARE that stupid.
You people have the right to complain only if your side doesn’t have a long line of religious nutjobs in your party. Since you do, please grow the hell up and focus on the issues. It makes no logical sense for you, of all people, to be up in arms about what a freaking pastor said. If that were such an issue with you why the hell did you vote for Bush into office TWICE? Do you want a list of wanker quotes from the right wing preachers? My god, what guided stupidity.
March 18, 2008
11:08 AM
dmwsNYC writes:
To those who have never visited a predominantly black church where many if not most of the congregation is economically-challenged, this rhetoric is not uncommon.
After 9/11/01 I felt more 'patriotic' than I had ever felt before. However, soon after that, when my best friend (who is Puerto Rican) was tripped on a sidewalk and spit upon because she was accused of being muslim - as though that is a negative; then when standing on 5th avenue seeing a pickup truck with dozens of flags waving in the air with 'Kill em All' graffiti-ed on the side; when a short time after my brother was pulled over by police more than 21 times in a matter of 3 months - whether he was driving a Honda or a Mercedes-Benz; when people who can't afford college working for minimum wage with no health benefits vote for politicians because they are 'afraid of terrorism'; these all serve to remind me that this country is full of bigoted, gullible, willingly un-informed people who allow the Few to rape us of our liberties, strip us of dignity and distract us with our own fears.
These very same guinea pigs project their own anger and hatred on a group (pick one: blacks, muslims, gays, immigrants, Mexicans) they want to believe is beneath them. No where in there do you see whites, do you?
When the constitution was written someone like me was not considered a human being. Just a few decades ago someone like me could not vote, could not go to school with a white person, could not go to the same stores, and the list goes on. Laws may have banned these things but you cannot legislate the heart of a person.
And that is where the problem lies.
No matter who gets in the White House, there will still be parts of this country where I am not welcome because of the color of my skin; I will still have to deal with bigoted remarks not only from overt bigots but (my favorites) liberal whites who are 'in the know'; I will still have to deal with blacks who dismiss me for fear that socializing too much with other blacks will disqualify them from opportunities; I will still have to deal with individuals in the workplace being surprised at my competence and intelligence; I will still have to deal with stats showing that as a black woman, over 35, with no children, the chances of my never marrying is more than double of my white counterpart.
Don't give me headache if I go to a church that commiserates with my struggles. If I do not wholly agree with a comment extracted from a sermon (and you know how long black sermons can be) but agree with the message of the entire sermon, that is not a contradiction. By the way I am not religious in the least but I was aware enough as a black person to know that when the minister spoke and most of the congregation called out "Amen!", that the message spoke a truth that resonated strongly with them - and that we cannot deny.
The real question: What is that truth that spoke to those people's hearts?
The answer: too much of America, including some blacks do not give 2 cents about answering the question, much less helping to find ways to fix it.
Admit the hypocrisy of this country, people!
March 18, 2008
11:11 AM
Devlin writes:
Obama's speech today was monumental - he is clearly destined for greatness.
No other Presidential candidate of the past 20 years is capable of delivering such a substantial, powerful and honest speech.
America needs a change from the same old tired liars that have littered government for the past couple of decades, and Barrack Obama is clearly the man to bring it.
March 18, 2008
11:25 AM
Shaggy writes:
JW,
I'm not voting for prom queen.
You guys are voting for a plastic rock star..
March 18, 2008
11:30 AM
Obama must be known for the company he keeps writes:
Obama's speech was the most manipulative, more of the same, shuckin', jivin' baloney he's put out all along--only in "mainstream, appeal to the media" terms. And no excuses will work for him this time. Do not be fooled. Obama is not the person for president. Believe it.
March 18, 2008
11:32 AM
jay writes:
shaggy, on the contrary, jw has established that he uses the candidate's policy stances/track record to make his voting decision.
you, on the other hand have consistently proven time and time again that you do not.
stop running and answer the question and prove us wrong
what accomplishments of the bush administration excited you enough to warrant a vote for a third term under mccain?
but hey....at least you're signing a name instead of using far right wing slogans
March 18, 2008
11:38 AM
Martin Flagler writes:
Prominant African American pundits from all sides of the political spectrum have debunked the "Liberation Gospel" otherwise known as racist hatespeach for which The Most Rev. Wridiculous is best known.
We are all sad to see that Obama tried to defend that bigoted ideology in a vain effort to rehabilitate his failing candidacy. His motivations now are entirely self-serving, despite his protestations to the contrary.
Empty, dishonest suit.
March 18, 2008
11:43 AM
primafacie writes:
This isn't just about what the Rev. Wright spews (apparently only when Barack Obama isn't in attendance, since he's claimed not to have heard his bile). It's about a 20-year association with a church whose stated purpose is to provide a "Black worship service and ministries which address the Black Community," which "unashamedly" promotes a "black theology" in the pastor's own words.
Interesting. There would be no question of bigotry in a church that advertised a "White worship service" and "white theology" to "address the White Community." The videos making the rounds show a congregation that clearly has heard Wright's bilge before, cheering in the aisles and in agreement. That's fine. They aren't running for president.
Barack Obama is. As long as he's associated with a church that promotes racial separatism and hatred, what does that say about his values? Tf he's not in agreement with it, what is he getting out of that relationship? And if it's merely a political advantage, doesn't that tell us something?
March 18, 2008
11:45 AM
KW writes:
-- Barack Obama, Huffington Post, March 14, 2008:
-- Barack Obama, Today's Speach, March 18, 2008:
March 18, 2008
11:48 AM
Shelby Steele Nails Obama writes:
Here we go: Shelby Steele, himself, like Obama--of "mixed racial heritage" gets it on about Obama:
Shelby Steele Wall Street Journal March 18, 2008
...nothing could be more dangerous to Mr. Obama's political aspirations than the revelation that he, the son of a white woman, sat Sunday after Sunday -- for 20 years -- in an Afrocentric, black nationalist church in which his own mother, not to mention other whites, could never feel comfortable. His pastor, Rev. Jeremiah Wright, is a challenger who goes far past Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson in his anti-American outrage ("God damn America").
How does one "transcend" race in this church? The fact is that Barack Obama has fellow-traveled with a hate-filled, anti-American black nationalism all his adult life, failing to stand and challenge an ideology that would have no place for his own mother. And what portent of presidential judgment is it to have exposed his two daughters for their entire lives to what is, at the very least, a subtext of anti-white vitriol?
What could he have been thinking? Of course he wasn't thinking. He was driven by insecurity, by a need to "be black" despite his biracial background. And so fellow-traveling with a little race hatred seemed a small price to pay for a more secure racial identity. And anyway, wasn't this hatred more rhetorical than real?
But now the floodlight of a presidential campaign has trained on this usually hidden corner of contemporary black life: a mindless indulgence in a rhetorical anti-Americanism as a way of bonding and of asserting one's blackness. Yet Jeremiah Wright, splashed across America's television screens, has shown us that there is no real difference between rhetorical hatred and real hatred.
No matter his ultimate political fate, there is already enough pathos in Barack Obama to make him a cautionary tale. His public persona thrives on a manipulation of whites (bargaining), and his private sense of racial identity demands both self-betrayal and duplicity. His is the story of a man who flew so high, yet neglected to become himself.
March 18, 2008
11:50 AM
benn writes:
Those aren't contradictory comments KW. The first is a reference to specific comments by Wright, the second is a reference to 'controversial comments' by Wright.
March 18, 2008
11:50 AM
Stone Cold writes:
Obama's speech gives the Conservative Media something to dwell on today... something to focus on OTHER than the failing economy.
How important is the economy? Ask the 44,000 people who are employed at either Bear Sterns or Delta Airlines.
Of course, we'll hear far MORE about what "Barack Obama's pastor said or did not say" than we will about the very serious signs of the failure of the GOP economy.
And of couurse, at the end of the day, the Right-Wingers will cap it off by complaining about how "liberal" the media is.
It's really very pathetic....
March 18, 2008
11:52 AM
Anonymous writes:
Duplicity, self-aggrandizement, win at all costs, and LieLieLie when cornered.
These are Democratic Ideals.
(burp)
Any more Cheetos?
March 18, 2008
12:00 PM
Anonymous writes:
Duplicity, self-aggrandizement, win at all costs, and LieLieLie when cornered.
These are Republican Ideals.
(burp)
Any more Cheetos?
March 18, 2008
12:00 PM
am 760 writes:
To the 3 or 4 right wingers who keep posting the same tired old shit, WAKE UP.
The posts from the left are very well thought out and reflect some critical thinking abilities.
The posts from the right are the same old emotional rants that have driving the repub party for 50 years.
God will you people every learn.
That speech was incredible. The man is brilliant beyond his years. Its scary to those on the right I guess to have someone of color who is smarter than them.
Go john mcsame.
March 18, 2008
12:05 PM
J Marvin is an idiot writes:
Will jay please stop posting his cheerleader snippets under random names to give the impression that real people support what Obama has done?
Morning talk radio is a failed enterprise - remember Air America?
Liberal talk radio hosts are spoiled children who can't take the heat they are so famous for giving.
Those bunions are obviously very painful now that the shoe is on the other foot.
Morons.
March 18, 2008
12:05 PM
am 760 writes:
Shag, you know what would be really presidential on mccains part.
First visit the vets in Walter Reid.
Second, have a clue about the economy.
Did anyone see Saturday Night Live this last saturday. Loved the Breaking News part where they stated, Mccain is Old, hilarious. Maybe tree or someone can post if from Youtube.
March 18, 2008
12:07 PM
KW writes:
benn - You forget that before Obama made the first statement, the media had been airing a multitude of various quotes from many different sermons. They weren't just playing the same sermon over and over.
So exactly now which "specific" comments was Obama referring to?
March 18, 2008
12:09 PM
benn writes:
I don't think Jay is 'Jay Marvin.... unless 'Jay Marvin' is also a recruiter...
March 18, 2008
12:11 PM
Anonymous writes:
Jay=Benn=StoneCold=am666, and so on.
Same garbage, same trashcan.
March 18, 2008
12:11 PM
jay writes:
idiot, yes....you're absolutely right...we're all involved in a conspiracy put together to make you look like an uneducated dunce.
funny that the one thing i don't see from the far right today is any mention whatsoever of policy stances of obama's that would prove their tinfoil hat conspiracy theories about his "racism". I could be wrong, but i'm pretty sure the far right is done talking about track records and policy stances for the rest of the year....it's just not good for their team.
kw, benn's right...he's talking about two different things....but i'm sure Rush didn't mention that...
March 18, 2008
12:22 PM
Shaggy writes:
jay,
Doesn't matter what Bush's track record is.
He's the best out of the three for Americas future...
If Romney is his side ticket, I will gladly jump on board because he is the most educated and experienced on economy issues.
I still encourage Obama and Hillary to continue the dog and pony show though...Maybe they will continue it until they get here.....
March 18, 2008
12:32 PM
JW writes:
Just four days ago, Petraeus, the top U.S. commander in Iraq, said that “no one” in the U.S. and Iraqi governments “feels that there has been sufficient progress by any means in the area of national reconciliation,” or in the provision of basic public services.
As it turns out, “no one” doesn’t include John McCain, who feels there’s been plenty of progress…
“Anybody who believes the surge has not succeeded, militarily, politically and in most other ways, frankly, does not know the facts on the ground.”
… nor does it include Dick Cheney, who apparently sees political progress Petraeus doesn’t.
U.S. Vice President Dick Cheney on Monday declared the 2003 U.S.-led invasion of Iraq a “successful endeavor,” pointing to security and political progress on a visit ahead of the fifth anniversary of the war.
March 18, 2008
12:33 PM
Reggie writes:
I'm black and old enough to have lived through the ugliest flash-points of the Civil Rights ere while residing in the South. I remember being told by my mother and grandmother to NEVER look white folks in the eyes too long, to NEVER say anything to a white person unless they speak to you, to get off the sidewalk if white folks needed to pass, I drank from colored only water fountains, I was taught early in life that my black skin was a problem and I had to fear white reactions to it.
As the generations have passed people who've never had those types of firsthand experiences lost context with the realities of overt and often violent racism to the extent that black grievances were treated as nothing more than bellyaching and/or wanting special treatment just for nothing.
We live in a dysfunctional family environment here in America where some of the offspring have endured the most inhumane treatment imaginable. It should not surprise any of the family members that lingering feelings of hurt and anger remain, and until we give a damn enough to listen without a critical ear, open to the grievances of others, we'll remain stuck blaming and denying.
Rev. Wright's passion spoke truthfully to my generations painful experiences, they call it black rage as if anyone who endures a lifetime in a dysfunctional family needs to have their rage marginalized and pigeon holed as something outside normal behavior.
To my white friends, stop treating racism as something you want to simply go away, as though if blacks would just stop bringing it up things wouldn't be so bad. LISTEN with openness and trust that what you hear is real and not the machinations of people too thin skinned for their own good.
To my black friends, blaming the white man is old news, recognizing the legacy of racism in America and that it's still alive and well is no excuse for self-defeatism, self-degradation and nihilism.
Let's talk about race as if our very survival depends on arriving at a place where we can put to rest the old.
March 18, 2008
12:34 PM
Tbone writes:
Actually, guys, I am jay.
I've been posting as him for over a year now and you still havent caught on.
I'm also JW. See how there a similar letter? That was a clue. I'm also JMH.
I'm also JHM. And am760. And Old_Grouch. And Richard Grimes. And Charles B.
Maybe its time to loosen the tinfoil hats a bit. The 19%'ers sure are getting desperate.
March 18, 2008
12:36 PM
Shaggy writes:
Funny how Ohhhhhbama chose to deliver his speech in the town holding the next round of votes.
He was using this time for more exposer..it worked too...now even more people woke up to the fact he kept this racist bastard in his life for 20 years.
Keep talking about it Ohhhhbama...keep your racist, anti-America, hate whitey hand selected spiritual adviser of 20 years in the spotlight....
March 18, 2008
12:37 PM
benn writes:
To my white friends, stop treating racism as something you want to simply go away, as though if blacks would just stop bringing it up things wouldn't be so bad. LISTEN with openness and trust that what you hear is real and not the machinations of people too thin skinned for their own good.
To my black friends, blaming the white man is old news, recognizing the legacy of racism in America and that it's still alive and well is no excuse for self-defeatism, self-degradation and nihilism.
Very well put Reggie
March 18, 2008
12:43 PM
JW writes:
New poll out today says both Hillary and Obama are statistically tied against McCain.
Reasons to support this guy over Hillary are disappearing because of this non issue, simply because we dont know how many non issues there are about him. Its really too bad it got nasty between them. Clinton/Obama would smash McCain in my opinion, though there are no poll numbers to support that as of yet.
March 18, 2008
12:55 PM
jayisanidiot writes:
What took you so long to generate a timely first person accord of the relevant topic of the day?
Try to keep up jayhole, we all wait with baited breath for your "I'm a black preacher" post any time now.
March 18, 2008
1:00 PM
Chris writes:
The real issue is that Obama has Swiftboated HIMSELF with the help of Mrs. Racist and their lobotomized preacher.
No wonder the libbies are uppity today. The deja-vu is overwhelming.
March 18, 2008
1:00 PM
Jana writes:
This speech contains the most intelligent and realistic portrayal of racial problems in America today that I have ever heard articulated by a major living political figure. This man, Barack Obama, loves his country, not in a "love it or leave it" way, but in a deeper, more accepting way. He wants to challenge us Americans to form the "more perfect union" our Constitution promises, not just close their eyes and see no evil.
The stories of his family, his community and his church are familiar to those of us who have had parents say things about blacks and Jews and Italians and gays and others that reflect an anger and bitterness that we do not have. Yet, we still love them and they us.
This is the America I want to live in. One that faces up to its contradictions and tries its best to work together to make a more perfect country for everyone.
March 18, 2008
1:04 PM
JMH writes:
Wow, the right-wing nuts are out in full force today (though I suspect that most of the posts are from just a few people using multiple names)... Ya know what is funny, the people who are crying about Obama's church's "hatred" are the same people who support the right-wing evangical hatred of gays, liberals, blacks ,etc., etc.
The truth is, Obama showed more balls and intelligence in this one speech than we have gotten from every GOP politician for the last 20 years. I for one would be very proud to have this man leading our country, he gets it...
I can give a hoot about the nonsense coming from the 19%ers on this site. They are all scared little girls afraid of anything differenet than them. They are the racists. That is why they want to keep picking at this. They have nothing else... no good leaders with any real ideas, no accomplishemnets to run on, they have given us nothing but failure with EVERY policy they have supported the last 7 years.
So Neo-Cons, keep trying to "swift-boat" Obama, it isn't going to work this time. This is no John Kerry. Obama just confronted this whole thing head on and hit it out of the park. This man didn't run and hide, he didn't suger coat anything, he stood up and told it like it was. Must scare the hell out of the Neo-Cons as they know know they are facing a fighter and a man of integrity. I can tell by some of the posts that the Neo-Con America haters are wetting themselves right now. Your dirty tricks will work no more!
P.S.
Shaggy, quit being a wuss and answer jay's question. I know you don't have anything but do us all a favor and try to spin some BS out. I need a laugh today!
March 18, 2008
1:07 PM
Anonymous writes:
You were not on the list Tbone. But you chose a phrase that only jay uses to make your point.
Thanks for the update. Next time read a little more carefully.
March 18, 2008
1:10 PM
Anonymous writes:
Today is a very Rough day for Obama-hating Racists, Bigots and neoCONs.
Today's speech pretty much clinched the elction for Obama, and the Haters know it.
March 18, 2008
1:15 PM
Shaggy writes:
jayisanidiot,
Be nice to jay...he is one the mentally challenged among us.....I wished they had a handi-cap icon on his keyboard that he could put next to his name so everyone would know.
March 18, 2008
1:15 PM
Chris writes:
Too funny. Left Loons are circling the wagons big time now that the cat is out of the bag. The base is splitting, the national committee is in a mexican standoff with two state delegations, Hillary has positioned snipers and is ready to repeat her offer to let Obama be No.2.
This is much better than HBO.
March 18, 2008
1:16 PM
OH writes:
Pastor Wright served his country in the US Marines, period.
March 18, 2008
1:17 PM
Hogar De Vuelta (العودة) aka ignorant strawman warmonger racist withsome friends writes:
I have no tolerance for racism of any kind. Obama and Wright are racists who ignore real problems, while trying to take advantage of white guilt for their own benefit. The following link shows a statistic that is largely ignored by the black community, or like Obama and Wright, they try to twist the statistic to say something that only a crazy person could believe.
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/tables/ovracetab.htm
March 18, 2008
1:20 PM
Miss Kay writes:
I depair for us all when an intelligent, humble call for reason and love results in such acrimony.
March 18, 2008
1:20 PM
R writes:
When Obama is elected it could give me the first geniune feeling of mature pride for this country that I've felt in my lifetime.
I was born after World War II, after the moon landings, I've lived in an America that has been complacent, that has slept at the world table all while many of us have rested on the laurels our fathers and grandfathers.
Obama represents a new America one that transcends black and white, Democrat or Republican, right or left.
We are at a pivotal crossroads, the time is now.
March 18, 2008
1:26 PM
history buff writes:
I just read Shelby Steele's article in the WSJ. What a pile of crap. Mr. Steele sees Mr. Obama as nothing more than a manipulator of white guilt. Here is how it works, according to Steele, who works for the Hoover think tank, apparently an organization that pays people to invent new lies.
White people feel guilty about America's racist past, so they look for black people who tell them they are not guilty of the past. In exchange for assuring whites of their innocence, whites will reward the black person who rids them of guilt by electing him president, or a making him a movie star, or a celebrity. I'm surprised he didn't say that Michael Jordan and Tiger Woods also are in the same class of manipulators.
The sad part about Mr. Steele, like Clarence Thomas and Linda Chavez, he wouldn't be a success if it wasn't for his ethnic identity. Unlike Mr. Obama, an authentic political candidate who has been elected by the people of Illinois to the Senate, it is Mr. Steele who is being used by reactionaries to assure white people that there are no racial problems in this country.
Mr. Steele is talking about himself, not Mr. Obama.
March 18, 2008
1:30 PM
JW writes:
Hogar,
There is no evidence that Obama himself is a racist. If you read his speech, hes pretty damn clear about that.
Additionally, I think at this point hes damn well PROVEN he doesnt 'ignore issues'.
Now, you can disagree with his policies and what not, and that is legit. But this "Guilt by association" crap dont fly. Its just another way for you to justify your hatred of any Democrat, without having to face the fact that you just...hate...Democrats.
Not because they lie.
Not because of who they associate with.
Not because they "tax and spend".
Not because they do all the ear marks.
Not because they are weak on defense.
These are the EXCUSES you use. You write a pass for any Republican guilty of the same things, which means these things are NOT what really makes you mad.
What really makes you mad is, quite simple....
(D)
Thats all it takes. One letter denoting party. After that, its all just rhetoric.
BTW, I would encourage you to read the text of his speech above. It was...impressive.
March 18, 2008
1:32 PM
Anonymous writes:
Pastor Wright is a Christian who served America by being a Marine - which is FAR more than we can say about George W. Bush or Dick Cheney.
March 18, 2008
1:37 PM
It's Duck Season writes:
I'm not buying into Obamas spew.....this was all just a political move, nothing more, nothing less.
He fooled the less intelligent people while the more intelligent people saw right through his BS.
Maybe this is why his numbers are so high among Liberals...the less intelligent ones.
If it walks like a Duck and Quacks like a Duck it is probably a Duck....
March 18, 2008
1:39 PM
jay writes:
"He's the best out of the three for Americas future..."
but what accomplishments of the bush administration record leads you to believe that a third term is "the best...for america's future"?
be careful shaggy, you're close to actually answering the question you've dodged for over a week now
March 18, 2008
1:42 PM
JW writes:
"If it walks like a Duck and Quacks like a Duck it is probably a Duck...."
Unless of course its a friend of Dick Cheney. Then you shoot it in the face.
March 18, 2008
1:43 PM
Anonymous writes:
Oh, yea, 1:37. You're a regular rocket scientist. NOT!
March 18, 2008
2:08 PM
jay writes:
don't feed the trolls people...you'll just encourage them
March 18, 2008
2:14 PM
Shaggy writes:
You know what jay...your right...I'm gonna vote for who ever wins the Democratic nomination instead of voting for who I think will be the best leader.....would that be better?
I think Obama would do a fine job pleading with Iran after they take over Iraq and control the middle east and it's oil while they stock pile Nukes in the mean time.
Maybe he could make a speech and have them throw away their nukes, lower our gas prices and become our friends.
Then we all could put diapers on our heads like Obama.
March 18, 2008
2:14 PM
Ardie writes:
"to form a more perfect union" (President Abraham Lincoln) entails that our original union was imperfect; that we were a tenuous union at best but that, hopefully, over time the union would grow stronger. This is what President Lincoln saw whereas the majority of Americans were not yet prepared for the long struggle of perfecting a union for all. Only a few understood the heroic task.
After the Civil War, slaves were no longer slaves--like their poor white counterparts they became wage slaves. Women couldn't vote. They were slaves to their husbands. And many died during childbirth.
Immigrants poured into America during the 19th century to work in America's sweat shops. It was brutally hard work. If a worker hurt himself he was fired. Older workers used shoe polish to hide their graying hair. If they had gray hair often they were fired. This was life in America as her people struggled to form a more perfect union waging a battle against those who saw the many as the vanquished and themselves as conquerors--and the fittest few.
The core of this struggle has not changed--we all want a more perfect union. And right now we see Wall Street getting its needs met while the rest of America faces an economic crisis as never before. Obama's words were visionary and insightful. We still must struggle against those who would make us slaves if they could.
March 18, 2008
2:17 PM
Jane writes:
Obama's words make me proud to a citizen of this country.
March 18, 2008
2:18 PM
Anonymous writes:
It really means we need Bill Clinton and his Cigars back in the whitehouse.
Bill from Harlem who can balance the budget. Fix Iraq and bring back Ruben.
lets get Bill back
March 18, 2008
2:20 PM
Hogar De Vuelta (العودة) aka ignorant strawman warmonger racist withsome friends writes:
JW,
Here is the written vision that Obama's church is committed to you.
A congregation committed to ADORATION.
Sounds good, but who do they adore?
A congregation preaching SALVATION.
Sounds good, but what do they mean?
A congregation actively seeking RECONCILIATION.
Sounds good, but who is being reconciled to whom?
A congregation with a non-negotiable COMMITMENT TO AFRICA.
If any church made a statement that they had a non-negotiable committment to Europe, they would be instantly crucified by the media. This a statement of division, not reconciliation.
A congregation committed to BIBLICAL EDUCATION.
Sounds good, but Jeremiah Wright sure could use some Biblical education to replace his fiery racist rhetoric.
A congregation committed to CULTURAL EDUCATION.
The Bible claims to transcend all culture, so cultural education is anti-Biblical.
A congregation committed to the HISTORICAL EDUCATION OF AFRICAN PEOPLE IN DIASPORA.
So everyone else is on their own, is that part of the plan for reconciliation?
A congregation committed to LIBERATION.
Sounds good, but what do they mean?
A congregation committed to RESTORATION.
Sounds good, but what do they mean?
A congregation working towards ECONOMIC PARITY.
Sounds like communism to me.
Obama's church has a stated vision that is vectoring toward segregation not reconciliation. His rhetoric does not correspond with some of the stated vision of his church of twenty years, and his "I never heard Jeremiah say any bad words, reeks of the "I did not inhale" line. I could and never would attend a church with a vision like Obama's and for Obama to try to distance himself from an intimate 20 year relationship is just fraud.
A short little speach no matter how flowery does not erase a 20 year association with a racist whacko who thinks the goverment released the AIDS virus to kill black men and the government knew the Japanese were coming on December 7 and did nothing about it.
Where are your critical thinking skills today?
March 18, 2008
2:24 PM
Shaggy writes:
HaHaHA...This just in...New Yorks NEW Governor of ONE day, Yes ONE day has come out and said he has had several affairs on his wife....OMG...You Democrats sure like to follow in Clintons coat tails....
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2008/mar/18/ny-guv-divulges-extramarital-affairs/
March 18, 2008
2:26 PM
Where's Harry Truman Now That We Really Need Him? writes:
Obama's main claim to fame in today's speech thus far--spoken in somber phony sincerity: "I am married to a black woman, and my father is black". . .well duh. So we should vote for him just because he's. . .black? THAT's audacity, folks. What's even more audacious is that Obama hangs tough with his racist pastor, and thinks nobody cares? That's audacity, folks.
March 18, 2008
2:27 PM
jay writes:
still dodging the question shag?
"You know what jay...your right...I'm gonna vote for who ever wins the Democratic nomination instead of voting for who I think will be the best leader.....would that be better?"
no, i want you to consider the policy stances of each candidate and make your decision based on the best information available. why would you choose your candidate any other way?
"I think Obama would do a fine job pleading with Iran after they take over Iraq and control the middle east and it's oil while they stock pile Nukes in the mean time."
well if you're upset that iran is jostling for a piece of the iraq pie (like every other nation of consequence on the planet) then you should be more interested in someone besides the republicans running the show...for it was their incompetence and strategic mistakes that allowed the widely predicted power vacuum to take place that has put us in this clusterfuck. furthermore, the current and future republican method of dealing with iran, syria, north korea, etc (disengagement) has been a proven failure...so again...what about that track record excites you enough to see it continued under mcbush?
"Maybe he could make a speech and have them throw away their nukes, lower our gas prices and become our friends.
Then we all could put diapers on our heads like Obama."
or maybe we could for once listen to the experts in our own military, intelligence and diplomatic communities instead of failing horribly because of myopic group think...gee...that would be a welcome change, no?
again shaggy...stop running and answer the question....what accomplishments of the bush regime excites you enough to warrant a vote for a third term under capt combover?
this isn't a trick question or anything...and it really isn't that hard...but it does happen to be the best way to get you to understand that up to this point in your life, you just might be a partisan hack.
March 18, 2008
2:28 PM
Tough Week for Righty writes:
A tough week for Rightys is about to get worse - the smart money says that the Justices will render a verdict that will re-interpret the "right to bear arms", restricting the right to "militias" only.
Rednecks in the Appalachian States, and the gangbangers of LA are going to go crazy.
March 18, 2008
2:31 PM
Anonymous writes:
The support and backing of Barrack Hussein Obama is proof positive of mental retardation.
March 18, 2008
2:35 PM
Chris writes:
The predictable implosion of the Democratic Party is right on schedule.
The internal split in the party of tolerance (what a supreme joke) is widening. The racist back and forth is ramping up to a frenzy. The Convention fracas promises to be nothing less than a free for all flail, with voter disenfranchisement elevated to an art form by the folks who invented it.
And all of this - all of this mayhem is self-induced. That is what amazes me. Nowhere on the liberal radar is the "vast right wing conspiracy" because there never has been one. It has been the schizophrenic lefty lunatics all along, feigning indignation at the scrutiny they have brought upon themselves for being so incredibly stupid and sloppy.
This will only get better.... stay tuned.
March 18, 2008
2:35 PM
Anonymous writes:
2:31... you spelled "George W Bush' wrong.
March 18, 2008
2:36 PM
We shall know Obama by the company he keeps writes:
So we should ignore the fact that Obama's hate-filled, racist friend, confidant, advisor, and pastor, for crying out loud, is someone Obama is very close to? No, No, No! It's in the bible! We need to KNOW Obama BY THE COMPANY HE KEEPS! We need to be aware that Obama is a great speaker, and can do well in the pulpit, which is where he belongs, not president of the United States.
March 18, 2008
2:37 PM
history buff writes:
2:28
I read an analysis of the right to bear arms case and it said the court will hold that individuals have a constitutional right to possess firearms subject to reasonable police power of government, then they will kick the back to the lower court to decide how to balance the legitimate rights of individuals vs. communities based on the guidelines established by the Supreme Court.
March 18, 2008
2:41 PM
We shall know Obama by the company he keeps writes:
So we should ignore the fact that Obama's hate-filled, racist friend, confidant, advisor, and pastor, for crying out loud, is someone Obama is very close to? No, No, No! It's in the bible! We need to KNOW Obama BY THE COMPANY HE KEEPS! We need to be aware that Obama is a great speaker, and can do well in the pulpit, which is where he belongs, not as president of the United States.
March 18, 2008
2:41 PM
Ben -Former Democrat writes:
Tough Week, You must be pretty naive to stereotype Appalachian Americans and gangbangers as the only gunowners in America. Gun ownership transcends all classes and races and an indiviudal's right to have and own guns is as fundamental free speech. The Amendments all refer to individual rights. So suddenly there was a hiccup when our forefathers wrote them and the 2nd suddenly turned into a collective right? I don't think so.
March 18, 2008
2:44 PM
Shaggy writes:
LoL jay,
Should we have just left Saddam so he could continue his mass genocide with weapons of mass destruction?
Oh I forgot that you don't consider these people worthy of saving like you do illegals pilfering America.
Who is best to handle foreign affairs---McCain
Who is best to fight terrorism---McCain
Who is best to fix our economy---Romney
Who is best to secure victory in Iraq--McCain
Who is the least experienced---Obama
Who has the least experience on foreign matters---Obama
Who would the terrorists like to see as the next President---Obama
March 18, 2008
2:48 PM
Stone Cold writes:
Today is the most entertaining day in politics I've seen in years.
You can always measure how truly scared the Right is by turning on the radio. Since virtually every AM "talk" station is owned and controlled by the Right, AM radio is the voice of the Right.
And today, that voice is truly terrified.
On the heels of our sobering economic news - which was already a death blow for the Right and it's failed economic agenda - Obama's brilliant speech this morning was the figurative pile of dirt on top of their grave.
The Rightys will get smoked - badly - in November. That's not news, it's been known for some time- but the past 48 hours have cemented the deal.
Turn on your AM radio - you'll see what I mean. Every talk host today is soiling themself, possibly literally. It's nothing but hate, hate, hate, hate. Rush is going to neeed to double his illicit Narcotics dosage. Laura Ingraham is ready to jump off a bridge. Anne Colter is undoubtedly torturing small animals in some room, then eating them.
It's a VERY entertaining day, and I cannot stop smiling!
GOD BLESS AMERICA!
March 18, 2008
2:49 PM
Obama can buffalo the media, not the American people writes:
Shelby Steele, a black intellectual, writes in the Wall Street Journal today of Obama:
"...nothing could be more dangerous to Mr. Obama's political aspirations than the revelation that he, the son of a white woman, sat Sunday after Sunday -- for 20 years -- in an Afrocentric, black nationalist church in which his own mother, not to mention other whites, could never feel comfortable.
His pastor, Rev. Jeremiah Wright, is a challenger who goes far past Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson in his anti-American outrage ("God damn America").
How does one "transcend" race in this church? The fact is that Barack Obama has fellow-traveled with a hate-filled, anti-American black nationalism all his adult life, failing to stand and challenge an ideology that would have no place for his own mother. And what portent of presidential judgment is it to have exposed his two daughters for their entire lives to what is, at the very least, a subtext of anti-white vitriol?
What could he have been thinking? Of course he wasn't thinking. He was driven by insecurity, by a need to "be black" despite his biracial background. And so fellow-traveling with a little race hatred seemed a small price to pay for a more secure racial identity. And anyway, wasn't this hatred more rhetorical than real?"
March 18, 2008
2:51 PM
jay writes:
shaggy...we've debunked that right wing myth a thousand times...why would you think it would still fly here?
so are you going to tell us what accomplishments of the bush administration excite you enough to vote for a third term or are you going to continue to run from me like a little girl?
March 18, 2008
2:58 PM
Funny writes:
Ben,
Honestly, did you have the same outrage when McCain's priest buddy slammed Catholics? How about when Robertson called for killing another president? When that triple chinned, and now in hell, Falwell blamed 9/11 on gay people and, gulp, "liberals"? Maybe you winced but you surely didn't act like the world was being turned upside down like now. What's the difference? Well, whoever you listen to (whatever AM radio simpleton tells you what to think) wasn't creating a PR campaign for you then. See, they know that they don't have to come up with things like HEALTHCARE policy for you to back their candidate. Or an economic policy that is realistic and will change some of the structural problems with the economy (there are many), or that can benefit the general public and not the corporate elite. They don't have to come up with a sound foreign policy (other than promising you they'll bomb a bunch of people they claim are a danger to you, PLEASE don’t read up if they actually are or what root causes do exist, trust them).
Simple question: Do you hold the candidates and each party to the same standards? If so, which third party are you voting for this election?
What you are doing, well not you since someone else is thinking FOR you, is making a huge deal out of a relatively minor issue. Again, nothing he said was racist. It was a harsh critique against US domestic policy, factually based, and you as a Republican have no leg to stand on in regards to religious preachers attacking a group of people. Period, you fake outrage doesn’t work like it did ten years ago, the issues this country are facing are too big to let children like you ignore them for this PR created nonsense.
You are either stupid (because you’d waste all this energy not on actual issues but campaign fluff like this) and are being taken advantage of by the Limbaugh’s of the world or you’re hoping everyone else is and can fall for your fake outrage.
March 18, 2008
3:00 PM
Shaggy writes:
Did you read the list I just posted as to my reasons for voting for McCain?
Bush isn't running for a third term..
March 18, 2008
3:02 PM
Anonymous writes:
Some of the comments here are just downright horrible. Or is this just the American way, to express venomous points of view with a snarl in the lip and unnecessary sarcasm? The 'ugly American' rears it's head. Reading some of these comments leaves one under no illusion as to where this expression stemmed from. Good luck, I used to respect your country but the last 6 years has given me cause to re-evaluate my position.
March 18, 2008
3:03 PM
just sayin' writes:
another good reason not to go to church
March 18, 2008
3:04 PM
Anonymous writes:
Some of the comments here are just downright horrible. Or is this just the American way, to express venomous points of view with a snarl in the lip and unnecessary sarcasm? The 'ugly American' rears it's head. Reading some of these comments leaves one under no illusion as to where this expression stemmed from. Good luck, I used to respect your country but the last 6 years has given me cause to re-evaluate my position.
March 18, 2008
3:07 PM
jay writes:
"Did you read the list I just posted as to my reasons for voting for McCain?
Bush isn't running for a third term.."
shaggy we've already debunked that right wing myth too....dude...give it up...you're cornered. mccain's policy stances dovetail EXACTLY into a third bush term....now...are you going to continue to run from me like the nerd in gym class or are you just going to give us those bush accomplishments that make you want more of the same under mccain?
March 18, 2008
3:14 PM
just sayin' writes:
another good reason not to go to church
March 18, 2008
3:14 PM
Wilber writes:
“Should we have just left Saddam so he could continue his mass genocide with weapons of mass destruction?”
Do you know that every single WMD & bio agent he had was given to him by the US? This isn’t an “anti-American”, leftist conspiracy theory, it’s a fact acknowledged by our own government. We actually INCREASED our funding to him after his worse atrocities. We also brought his scientists to Oregon in 1989 to TEACH them how to make WMD. Who did this? The right wing under Reagan. I’m sorry, you were in the middle of a fact less, mindless, stupid talking point.
“Who is best to handle foreign affairs---McCain
Who is best to fight terrorism---McCain
Who is best to fix our economy---Romney
Who is best to secure victory in Iraq--McCain
Who is the least experienced---Obama
Who has the least experience on foreign matters---Obama
Who would the terrorists like to see as the next President---Obama”
Now this is gold. “Best to handle foreign affairs – McCain”. Solid argument, you said his name. Forget the fact that every single policy he’s backed since Bush took over has been a disaster. Forget that Iraq will be much worse off when we leave then when we invaded, killed over a million Iraqis, steal their oil and drops thousands of pounds of depleted uranium on them. Looking at the effects of Bush’s policies on the standing of the US worldwide, what do you think McCain would do to correct that? What policies, that are OBVIOUS losers, do you see him changing once he takes power?
Best to fix our economy – Romney. Again, solid argument. You can type TWO people’s names. You should give a speech about the economy, it would be one word, after which you can ask for questions. “I’m here to talk about the economy…Romney. Any questions?” Articulate what makes Romney qualified to handle the lions share of the US economy? Also explain how a VP, and not the Federal Reserve, would control the economy anyway. The Fed is what determines what governmental policies are possible in the first place.
You can’t be as stupid as your posts indicate. Then again, you’re voting for McCain after 8 years of Bush, so you can’t be THAT bright.
March 18, 2008
3:22 PM
Not from Wyoming writes:
Shaggy-
I don't know why you have been calling Obama a racist for the last month.
Have you looked in the mirror? I'm calling you out.
You hate all minorities Shaggy. And I think this whole blog community would agree. Your post are hateful and demeaning. It's the majority people like you that have ruined this country, especially the public school systems.
Hey Shagman, if you want to say Bullshit. Feel free to start life over as a black man in this country and take a little what you dish out.
March 18, 2008
3:27 PM
John McSame 2008 writes:
I've never been to church, er, I've never been to a church where the pastor condemns America with his words.
So, vote for me.
Signed, John McSame
March 18, 2008
3:27 PM
am 760 writes:
The posts from the left make me proud to be an american. The posts from the right make me ashamed to be an american. So much hate and ignorance from our brothers and sisters on the right.
Wasn't there a study awhile back that actually showed that conservatives brains are wired differently and thats why they can't critically think or comprehend basic concepts.
http://www.latimes.com/news/science/la-sci-politics10sep10,0,5982337.story?coll=la-home-center
March 18, 2008
3:33 PM
am 760 writes:
Wilbur, great post, but that is way to complicated for shag and the othe