August 2, 2007 7:04 PM

Back Roads Interview with Mitt Romney

CLICK HERE to listen to the interview

By M.E. Sprengelmeyer
ROCKY MOUNTAIN NEWS

URBANDALE, Iowa -- Not so long ago, religion was more of a lighthearted topic for former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney.

The first time I saw him in person, Romney was stealing the show at the annual Gridiron Club dinner in Washington, D.C., by joking about his membership in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in front of a room full of well-dressed, mostly well-behaved journalists.

"It's hard being a conservative in Massachusetts," Romney told the audience that night. "It's a lot like being a Mormon in a room full of alcoholics -- like here."

That was this spring -- but in political terms, it was almost a lifetime ago.

Since then, as Romney's Republican presidential campaign has kicked into high gear, so has the scrutiny over his Mormon faith.

Romney got in a high-profile fight with the Rev. Al Sharpton later in the spring after the one-time Democratic presidential candidate appeared to question the tenets of Romney's church. And since then, Romney has faced persistent questions at campaign stops -- from average voters and from reporters -- about how his religion might affect his chances of becoming president.

The topic came up again Thursday, when Romney let us hitch a ride in his SUV for a rolling interview between suburban Urbandale and downtown Des Moines, Iowa.

Romney was asked if he was surprised that religion has turned into such a big issue -- not only for himself, but for a rival reportedly facing a "whisper campaign" because of his Catholic beliefs.

Said Romney:

"Not really surprised. The campaigns, and of course the American citizens, are free to look at what they'd like to. I fundamentally believe in the final analysis, people don't decide who to vote for based on where they go to church. That's what you see in countries in the Middle East, where we're trying very hard to encourage principles of plurality and tolerance. And I don't think you'll see that being a factor in the final analysis for who is our nominee."

The interview also touched on the Iraq war and what he would do if he were commander in chief today.

He talked about abortion and the "political realities" that prevent him from using it as a litmus test for would-be U.S. Supreme Court picks.

He talked of building a cabinet filled with divergent views -- promising "many stories about people in my administration disagreeing with each other."

He spoke about Colorado land-use issues, and much more.

Below is the COMPLETE TRANSCRIPT of the latest in our series...

M.E. SPRENGELMEYER of the Rocky Mountain News: So thanks for mentioning your Colorado Springs visit in your speech today. So tell me more about that. And I'm also curious about specific things you think that you offer to Colorado voters that set you apart on issues from some of your Republican competition, because that's where the competition is now. It's not with the Democrats yet.

Former Massachusetts Gov. MITT ROMNEY: First, I'll give you the background just on the event. We had a town meeting style event in Colorado Springs, and one of the individuals there explained that he had a son that had been serving in Iraq, or was currently serving... and said he was encouraged by the progress, but now and then the morale suffered by virtue of the criticism that they read in the U.S. media of what they were doing there.

And so we chatted during the session privately, as it was over. And I've heard that. He's not alone. I've heard that from time to time that a number of our soldiers sometimes a little get dispirited as they see the discussions here in this country, and comments such as that by Sen. Reid (Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada) that the surge has failed. While they're just getting started and while they believe they're making progress, to hear people say that it has failed clearly has to be a bit of a surprise and a dispiriting comment.

And so after that discussion, I was with my nephew, Doug Robinson from Denver. We were just driving in the car, and he said, 'You know, Mitt, you ought to call for a surge of support.' He said there are a lot of families making a huge sacrifice to support this military surge in Iraq, but the rest of us just go about our daily activities without much thought about what other families are sacrificing. He said, 'You ought to call for a surge of support on the part of all Americans.' And he was the one who suggested, you know, like, encouraging folks to make contributions to groups like the USO and others that are supporting our soldiers and their families. I thought it was a pretty interesting idea, so when I came back I asked my team about it and said let's see if there are groups we could support. Can we get the names and we do a little vetting on some of the groups to make sure we don't suggest contributions to a group that turns out not to be a highly reliable entity. But we then put the names of the kinds of groups that people can contribute to on my web site and I've called for that surge of support.

Photo by M.E. Sprengelmeyer

SPRENGELMEYER: I wonder -- I've seen you several times... I've seen Rudy Giuliani. And one thing that you guys have in common -- maybe there are things that separate you, but one thing you have in common is that you both argue, or state, that you led areas of the country where Democrats hold sway, and both of you were able to win in parts of the country where Republicans are endangered species. And I wanted to ask you, whether you're the nominee or anyone else is the nominee, do you think that the Republican Party this year has to nominate somebody who has proven they can win in Democratic areas?

ROMNEY: No, I think it's one measure of the potential of an individual to be successful in a general election campaign, but not the only one. I think far more important is the character and vision of the candidate. Far more important is their plan for solving the problems that America faces. So there are many features that will come together to suggest who might be able to beat whoever the Democrats put up. But I think the most important element of my having been successful in Massachusetts is not just showing that I was able to win a Democrat state, but that I was able to work with Democrat legislators, and to find enough common ground to balance their budget every four years without raising taxes, to put in place a health care system that is private, market based, to make important reforms to our education system, to make important reforms to our transportation system...that I was able to work across the aisle. And I think Americans are looking for people who can get the job done and can do it in a setting where there are two parties. Governors know how to do that.

SPRENGELMEYER: You know, former Governor (George W.) Bush used to say almost the same thing. He had a record in Texas where he would talk about working with Democrats across the aisle -- "a uniter not a divider." Do you think that he lived up to all the dreams and hopes for that same type of thing during his first 6 1/2 years of presidency?

ROMNEY: You know, I think he has to be disappointed in the level of rancor and partisan divide that exists in Washington. There's no question but that state after state is able to work effectively across the aisle, to balance budgets, to get the job done. And Washington is the outlier that seems incapable of overcoming partisanship. And that doesn't mean it's not an effort that's worth fighting for and trying to change the culture of Washington. It's something that I will fight for and believe that as America faces greater and greater challenges, and as the consequences of our over-spending and our over-borrowing, and our failure in so many schools, and our failure to insure 45 million people...as those consequences become more and more stark, people are going to insist on action, and I believe that we'll see a change in Washington and that Washington will change course. And I believe I can be part of that.

Photo by M.E. Sprengelmeyer

SPRENGELMEYER: One of your opponents in the race, Sen. Brownback, on the abortion issue he goes pretty far in saying 'I want to be the person that nominates the judge, or Justice, that overturns Roe v. Wade.' Do you go that far in your commitment on the abortion issue, or do you take a different approach?

ROMNEY: I would hope to see the Supreme Court overturn Roe v. Wade and allow the states to have the freedom to develop their own policies and become 'pro-life' if they wish to do so. That is something which I feel should occur. I think the Roe v. Wade decision was improperly decided, and that states should be the place where 'pro-life' positions are possible.

SPRENGELMEYER: Do you feel strongly enough about that that you would make that the test for your first Supreme Court nominee?

ROMNEY: Well, I don't think a litmus test on a particular issue, if it were applied, would then allow that individual to be confirmed to the court.

SPRENGELMEYER: Because of political realities?

ROMNEY: The political reality is that if you apply a litmus test, that's going to be a non-starter for the opposition party. It would be sufficient to scuttle that nominee. The president was able to nominate two very effective, strict-constructionists, Justice (Samuel) Alito and (Chief) Justice (John) Roberts, who I think represent the precise type of individual I would want to appoint to the court, but he did not in either case insist on applying a litmus test with regards to abortion, and I'm afraid had he done so, neither one would have been confirmed.

View image Photo by M.E. Sprengelmeyer

SPRENGELMEYER: This week, there was a controversy in the paper where a supporter of (former Arkansas Gov.) Mike Huckabee had written a letter referencing the religion of (Sen.) Sam Brownback. Have you been surprised that that conflict -- which was reported in some circles as a "whispering campaign" -- as well as the issues that you've faced (over the Mormon faith)... Are you surprised that religion has been such an issue, at least behind the scenes, at least among reporters, at least among some people? Are you surprised by all that?

ROMNEY: Not really surprised. The campaigns, and of course the American citizens are free to look at what they'd like to. I fundamentally believe in the final analysis, people don't decide who to vote for based on where they go to church. That's what you see in countries in the Middle East, where we're trying very hard to encourage principles of plurality and tolerance. And I don't think you'll see that being a factor in the final analysis for who is our nominee.

SPRENGELMEYER: Do you see yourself at all as a role model, in a sense, for your faith, to disspell notions that are out there about your faith, and to face the religious prejudice on whatever level it exists?

ROMNEY: My campaign is about running for a secular position. As Dr. Richard Land of the Southern Baptist Convention said, 'We're not electing a pastor in chief.' People will look at me as they will. It's not something I can shape or form. And I hope they're able to evaluate me based on my ability to strengthen America -- to give us a stronger military and a stronger economy and stronger families. And that's the nature of my campaign.

Photo by M.E. Sprengelmeyer

SPRENGELMEYER: If you were president today... I'm going to have the power of the hypothetical and declare you president today...

ROMNEY: You know I won't respond to hypotheticals, but that one I might respond to.

SPRENGELMEYER: So, Mr. President, how is your Iraq policy, immediately, going to look any different than President Bush's current, today, Iraq policy?

ROMNEY: Well, as you know, my policy would have looked very different over the last three to four years following the collapse of Saddam Hussein. Today, the troop surge policy is in my opinion the best course we have available to us. And I can't predict exactly how that's going to develop. I do not believe it's a certainty that it'll be successful. I am encouraged by the report that we saw from Brookings over the weekend -- a nonpartisan group that weighed in and said that their perception was that the surge is working. I certainly hope that's the case. But I can tell you that I will make decisions based on thorough analysis of data. Not just opinion but cold, hard facts, and based upon the input of people who disagree with me. I like debate and disagreement. I want to have people who have very different views sit at the table...

SPRENGELMEYER: Is that a problem in the current administration?

ROMNEY: ...promote their positions with the benefit of data and use those views and that data to make decisions. I'm not inside the current administration, so I can't make an assessment of how decisions are made, but in my own life I have been one who has benefited from what Doris Kearns Goodwin has called the 'team of rivals.' I like having people of differing viewpoints. I love having debate. I remember early on in this administration, there were stories about how certain members of the administration disagreed. And there was a great deal of surprise and dismay that there was disagreement. I love disagreement. If I'm president there will be many stories about people in my administration disagreeing with each other, because I hope they do. I need disagreement to make good decisions.

SPRENGELMEYER: A big Red Sox fan she is (Goodwin), as well, isn't she?

ROMNEY: There are a lot of things that bring liberals and conservatives together. Perhaps none higher in Massachusetts than the Red Sox.

Photo by M.E. Sprengelmeyer

SPRENGELMEYER: On the Iraq war, sometimes you see polls -- and it all depends how the question is phrased -- sometimes you see polls where the public is very dispirited, and that might lead a majority of the public to take an opinion that goes against what you might feel in your heart is the right strategy. How are you going to confront public opinion sometimes, when public opinion might say, 'Let's withdraw every troop immediately' but you might think something different? Are you afraid of the pressures of public opinion -- not just media, not just your opposing party, but public opinion. Do you sometimes have to go against popular opinion?

ROMNEY: You know, if I had grown up in politics and my whole life were politics and all I cared about was winning elections, then in that setting I could see how an individual might be very concerned about public opinion. I'm not in this for politics. I've only spent four years in political office. My life has been in the private sector, and the love of my life is my wife and my family. I'm in this to make a difference for America. And if I find that the American people significantly disagree with me, that means there are two things I have to do. Number one, understand why they think the way they do, and see if there's something that I may be missing. But number two, if I'm convinced that I'm right and they're not right, then I need to do the job of educating and communicating why I believe what I believe. I believe that the job of the president is not just commander in chief but also educator in chief. And in some cases, the president knows a lot that the American public doesn't know. And if that's the case and if that's the reason for a difference in opinion, then the president is going to have to do a great job of educating and communicating what it is he knows that would shape the public's mood and perception on a particular issue.

Photo by M.E. Sprengelmeyer

SPRENGELMEYER: Any last thoughts on Colorado-specific issues that you'd like to add?

ROMNEY: Well, you know, I've spent a few years in the West, as you know, and am very concerned about issues of federalism, allowing states to have responsibility for issues that they care about, rather than having the federal government step in and mandate which lands are going to be taken over, how you can develop certain lands, and the whole range of issues that relate to federal usurpation of states' authorities. And that is something which I think people of Colorado care about. But Coloradans, based upon my experience with the number I've met with, care about some of the issues that the rest of the country cares about, but in some cases with a little more passion and energy, such as great education, excellent health care for all citizens, cleaning up the environment, and reducing the impact of human activity on the global environment. These are elements that my campaign will focus on, and I think that's why I'll be able to connect with Colorado voters.

SPRENGELMEYER: Last question. Do you always keep the air conditioning so high?

ROMNEY: No, we blow it on you so you freeze.

View image Photo by M.E. Sprengelmeyer