Glenn Morris should start moving forward
Extremist Glenn Morris’ bullying and name-calling of Italian-Americans who support the Columbus Day national holiday, has now expanded to include state leaders who dare to disagree with his opinions (“‘Cowardice’ cited in Columbus fight,” May 9).
Rather than rise to the bait, the governor’s office responds in a positive and progressive way that is focused on legitimate issues of health care, education, civil rights, etc.
Morris should adopt a similar perspective, moving forward rather than backward. Rewriting history to suit a political agenda has a certain allure (see Ward Churchill), but the truth is that Columbus was a navigator and an explorer. He was not in the military, not a soldier, and not in command of soldiers. Accusations to the contrary are not only unfounded and defamatory of a brave historical explorer, but, here in the present, are an unnecessary destructive and divisive force that threatens the constitutional rights of Americans.
Richard SaBell, Denver
While Richard is grossly incorrect in trying to exonerate Columbus from the mistreatment of Indians that he has been accused of, I agree with him that Glenn Morris would be well advised to adopt a more positive approach to his campaign. As for Columbus, he was only doing what was standard in those times. That doesn't excuse the conduct, but it does mitigate the seriousness of it. In fact, it would have been quite extraordinary for him to have acted otherwise. However, I do not consider him a hero for having discovered the new land since he was simply trying to find a way to enrich himself. The history that followed was not something he considered or anticipated. If he is considered a hero, he is an accidental one.
Posted by Truth on May 18, 2007 08:45 AMColumbus may not have been a hero but he was one of the most significant persons in history.
Certainly his discovery of America was not good news to the native people who were already here, but most of the ills that occured were bound to have occured when the west and the new world would finally meet.
The dominance of Western Civilization from the discovery of America to the present is something to celebrate. Western Civilization was to evolve to banning slavery, instituting democratic governments, establishing rights for women, creating modern medicine and sanitation, industrializing the world and raising the majority of people out of abject poverty, etc.
So should we celebrate Columbus? It's a free country and certainly Glenn Morris should be able to speak his views, but should his right of free speech override the rights of the people who plan to celebrate Columbus Day? I don't think so.
Posted by Jim on May 18, 2007 09:45 AMI recall reading a lot of positive good Chris' venture did but he is mostly famous for his genocide activity which put into perspective is not any different than what Indian tribes did to each other. Torture:
They yanked the heart out of a living person and fed it to their god and they ate the arms and legs; Chris exchanged their blood thirsty deity for his blood thirsty deity of human sacrifice. Me, your friendly deicide who would slay all deities.
Posted by Richard Grimes Risen Ape r22037@yahoo.com (ffrf.org) on May 18, 2007 11:00 AMJim, well said. That last paragraph was directly on the money.
Posted by shaupeen on May 18, 2007 01:12 PMRichard,
"Chris is mostly famous for his genocide activity which put into perspective is not any different than what Indian tribes did to each other. Torture."
Rich, even with what all the American Indians did to eachother over the span of thousands of years, there isn't a national holiday celebrating their viciousness towards one another, now is there? There is certainly a Columbus Day though.
Posted by Peter on May 18, 2007 01:43 PMRichard,
"Chris is mostly famous for his genocide activity which put into perspective is not any different than what Indian tribes did to each other. Torture."
Rich, even with what all the American Indians did to eachother over the span of thousands of years, there isn't a national holiday celebrating their viciousness towards one another, now is there? There is certainly a Columbus Day though.
Posted by Peter on May 18, 2007 01:43 PM"So should we celebrate Columbus? It's a free country and certainly Glenn Morris should be able to speak his views, but should his right of free speech override the rights of the people who plan to celebrate Columbus Day? I don't think so."
So should we celebrate Jeff Davis day? John Chevington day? Charles Manson day? If not, why not? Is Columbus Day *only* a question of free speech, or are you just presenting half the picture?
Posted by anderson on May 18, 2007 02:02 PMAnderson I see what you are saying and agree to a point with you. ( I know you are marking calendar right now :-)) With this thread and the other similar ones, it brings up great points of history. I am going to go you 1 further in the discussion here. I am not trying to take things over the edge but bring historical thought to our holiday structure and how we should truly celebrate based upon the situations of our holidays minus Columbus day.
4th of July - How many signers of our Constitution were slave owners? Are we being true to African Americans by celebrating this holiday
Presidents Day - GW was a slave owner
Thanksgiving - Plenty of History of Puritan pilgrams starting the atrocities of North American Indians.
Christmas - Christian Holiday. Has great debate every year on the Separation of Church and State. History going back to the beginning of history has defined atrocities to multiple races from the Christian sword.
Each year there are a few that bring these points out about the above holidays. What is the difference between them and Columbus day? How many employees get Columbus day off compare to the others (some get multiple days off like TGiving and Xmas) I think there would be less people wanting to get rid of Columbus day if they were given a holiday day(not just a floating holiday)
To your point, there would be people willing to grant Manson Day if it meant 1 more holiday vacation day :-)
bwr, holidays are all symbolic. The 4th of July stands for the celebration of a new nation, not for whether there was slavery. Thanksgiving stands for sharing a bountiful land, not for whether Uncle Sam later was nasty to certain members of our community. And so we get down to the question of what the specific holiday means. Sometimes there are contested meanings. You suggest there is a darker side to the 4th of July, but I don't think you'd really get anyone to agree. On the other hand, Morris and opponents of Columbus Day, tell us that Columbus symbolizes the conquer and subjugation of Indians. You can argue, as I was taught in school, that he "discovered" the new world, but that too implicates our history of conquer. Is the Morris view of history valid? I think it is. Others may disagree. However, I think there is at least reasonable doubt as to whether Columbus represents an honorable symbol, and for that reason, it should not be a holiday.
Posted by anderson on May 20, 2007 11:41 AMYes they are symbolic. To you the 4th of July stands for the celebration of a new nation. I agree with that point. But there are those that did not get to benefit from the freedoms of that new nation. That was my point. History is frought with highs and lows throughout.. You had made reference to Manson day, so I put forth the low side of our most popular holidays. I did not create or make up those ideas, but rather repeat them for this thread. Something defined as good for some is not good for others.
Again if we defined a mandatory day off from work for Columbus day, I doubt the support for removing it would persist