Immigration & Cinco de Mayo
We are blessed with several family members who are from Mexico and they too get upset that they follow the rules and so many refuse to put the effort forward to be here legally. My uncle, from Mexico, stated that they deserve the capture and deportation that they get and they should have their whole family go with them. While growing up, my family was extremely insistent that we, my siblings and I, learn English well in all it’s aspects, speaking, listening, reading and writing. Even in my later years, I still hear my elders primarily speak Spanish, but they also state that knowing the American language, English, is extremely helpful in life.
Last year my family took a trip to Mexico during the Cinco de Mayo week and we discovered something that was both sad and astonishing. They, the Mexican Citizens in Mexico, DO NOT celebrate Cinco de Mayo. They call it the Cake War that was not a war but a resistance to France over the closing of a Bakery. The skirmish didn’t last more than a week and as such didn’t warrant even a flag waving ceremony of any kind. They are amazed that this minor issue is so highly celebrated in the U.S. As a taxi driver stated to us, “It can’t be more than a money making party that has no significance".
We were surprised to hear this. The Independence Day that is celebrated to the same degree as our 4th of July is their 16th of September.
For those immigrants who are here legally. Welcome. For those who break our laws, Adios.
This letter has not been edited.
Watch out, Ricardo! You've just opened yourself up for attack from the frothing open-borders crowd.
Posted by Bumpskier on May 8, 2007 02:41 PMThere is, of course, no open-border crowd, but that won't prevent bumpskier from setting up his strawman. Gives him something he can easily knock down. And then can have the satisfaction of tearing out his guts.
I see Sean Hannity has huge billboards for his radio program now on Federal and Colfax in Lakewood. I wonder if anyone is listening?
Posted by anderson on May 8, 2007 03:55 PM
Actually we are listening.
Posted by 10,000,000 listeners on May 8, 2007 06:24 PMAnd, of course, the first one to show up to attack is none other than Anerson. Predictable. And predictably stupid in his comment.
No open border crowd? Put down the pipe, dude.
Posted by RU Serious on May 8, 2007 06:41 PMMake it a personal issue. That way you don't have to respond to my assertion. Just keep blowing smoke, dude.
Posted by anderson on May 8, 2007 06:45 PMAnderson-
There is an open borders crowd and I found this excellent post by a guy named Dingler
DESCRIBING THEIR SUPPORTERS PLAYBOOK:
If you support an Open Border, a number of groups will help you with "talking points" The Open Border lobby is much more organized than the "Redneck throw the illegals out" lobby who are fighting so called illegal immigration. Here is a few ideas from our playbook:
1) Describe illegal immigrants (or Illegal Aliens) as Immigrants. Blurr the line between illegal and legal immigrants so as to confuse the majority of voters who do not really understand current events.
2) Call Illegal Immigrants "undocumented workers" America love people who work and if they use the word "workers" then these illegal immigrants will seem OK. Also the word Undocumented leaves a vague impression. Most people do not understand that term and assume they are in the process of getting documents or lost them at home, not really in a status that will never get a legal document.
3) Call anyone who fights against illegal immigrants-- one of the following negative words: racist, bigot, redneck, anti immigrant, right wing nut case, a member of the radical right, right wing, or outside of the mainstream.
4) Promote Immigrant Rights as a form of Civil Rights. Give the impression that anyone who is anti illegal immigrant is against civil rights for all immigrants and no better than a bigot from the 1950s. Link the civil rights movement of the 50s and 60s to a movement for the immigrant community.
5) Promote Hispanic people who are more Spanish (European) in appearance as role models for the Hispanic community instead of Indian based Hispanics who are more likely to be an illegal immigrant. Or use the word Latino, it sounds better than Hispanic.
6) Get the Catholic Church involved.
7) Use slogans like "no one is illegal" "everyone in America is an immigrant" or "America is a land of immigrants" "they came for the American dream"--- to sell people that illegal immigrants are no different than they are.
8) Use the mainstream media to promote stories about illegal immigrants who did well and helped America. Most of the mainstream media support the illegal immigration movement and have very hidden bias in their stories. The average person is not bright enough to hear the bias.
9) Use term like "comprehensive immigration reform" or "earned legalization" These are positive sounding words.
The PR war is being won by the side supporting the illegal immigrant community.
Posted by GET REAL on May 8, 2007 08:14 PMTHANK YOU, GET REAL, THANK YOU,THANK YOU THANK YOU, VERY, VERY, MUCH!!! Soooooo TRUE!!!!
Posted by A on May 8, 2007 08:27 PMPriceless GET REAL!!!
Ricardo, Glad to have another citizen on the side of LEGAL immigrant's and against ILLEGAL immigrants!
Posted by A on May 8, 2007 08:35 PMGet Real, I didnt' see anything about open border proposals in your cut and paste job. Open borders means open borders--you know, like we used to have until the 1920s. It has nothing to do with any of the current proposals on the table. WHAT PART OF PLAIN ENGLISH DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND? But keep on lying about it. It exposes your thoughts in an unflattering way.
Posted by anderson on May 8, 2007 08:54 PMAnderson- I understand English just fine ,thanks.
My response was in regards to your statement,
"There is, of course, no open-border crowd".
Ever hear of LA RAZA UNIDA ? http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/groupProfile.asp?grpid=6781
I'm sure you have witnessed the tactics from the list posted at 8:14
Maybe you could point out to me what I'm "lying about" ?
Also-Why so testy?
Posted by GET REAL on May 8, 2007 09:34 PMMany thanks to T and A -
Sorry about the double entendre.
Posted by GET REAL on May 8, 2007 10:23 PMRicardo..As a fourth generation -Spanish american (New Mex) and lived here in Denver all my life,..We used to celebrate Cinco De Mayo at the Civic center for many years,mainly to congregate and see people we had't seen in years.Not that we really cared about the history.It was spanish -americans..Mexican -americans we were all generational families..the real "hispanics",
"chicanos" "mestizos"....Then on Sept 16th..the "Mexicans" would celebrate their
"MEXICAN INDEPENDANCE DAY" on 32nd Ave. North Denver. With the whole works boots, hats music,etc.
So...What happen to that day for them?
Now these recent illegals..Legals ..took over
the day 'chicanos' had...And they celebrate.
the war they won against the french----spaniards. Our ancestors..(spanish-americans) Now they're Hispanics?
Thats two different nationalities.
Ricardo..As a fourth generation -Spanish american (New Mex) and lived here in Denver all my life,..We used to celebrate Cinco De Mayo at the Civic center for many years,mainly to congregate and see people we had't seen in years.Not that we really cared about the history.It was spanish -americans..Mexican -americans we were all generational families..the real "hispanics",
"chicanos" "mestizos"....Then on Sept 16th..the "Mexicans" would celebrate their
"MEXICAN INDEPENDANCE DAY" on 32nd Ave. North Denver. With the whole works boots, hats music,etc.
So...What happen to that day for them?
Now these recent illegals..Legals ..took over
the day 'chicanos' had...And they celebrate.
the war they won against the french----spaniards. Our ancestors..(spanish-americans) Now they're Hispanics?
Thats two different nationalities.
Ricardo..As a fourth generation -Spanish american (New Mex) and lived here in Denver all my life,..We used to celebrate Cinco De Mayo at the Civic center for many years,mainly to congregate and see people we had't seen in years.Not that we really cared about the history.It was spanish -americans..Mexican -americans we were all generational families..the real "hispanics",
"chicanos" "mestizos"....Then on Sept 16th..the "Mexicans" would celebrate their
"MEXICAN INDEPENDANCE DAY" on 32nd Ave. North Denver. With the whole works boots, hats music,etc.
So...What happen to that day for them?
Now these recent illegals..Legals ..took over
the day 'chicanos' had...And they celebrate.
the war they won against the french----spaniards. Our ancestors..(spanish-americans) Now they're Hispanics?
Thats two different nationalities.
Posted by QBT on May 9, 2007 12:04 AM
Get Real, get real. The fact that you can trot out someone somewhere from the 70s who advocated open borders, does not make for an open border movement today. You use the term to anyone who disagrees with your black and white view of the issue, not because there's an open border movement. Plainly, there isn't. Thus, you and the rest of your fellow travelers are being patently dishonest. Obviously, you use the term "open borders" to scare people, and just as obviously you are not interested in the truth.
Posted by anderson on May 9, 2007 09:54 AMWe don't need immigration reform, we need immigration enforcement reform.
No new laws until you figure out how to enforce the laws you already have.
Posted by KW on May 9, 2007 10:20 AMAnderson,
You need to stay out of these discussions because you quote statistics and a bunch of other BS when the fact of the matter is....THEY ARE BREAKING THE LAW. Can you argue that point???? Can You??? I didn't think so.
You ruin this format for a lot of others because you cut and paste for the confusion it causes.
You aren't debating, you are BAITING. And I, for one am sick of you and your cronies who take over these discussions like you are inciting a frickin' war.
As Americans, YOU should be upset about this issue,too. But, again, it's not a problem in white-bread country. Move to the city and try to get along. Americans aren't filling those jobs such as the ones at Swift because we don't want to live with a bunch of Mexicans so we won't move to Greeley, and support their educations (in Spanish) or feed them, or provide health care for them, GOT IT.
THAT is what the issue is......
I see the Snews technology failed to print my post.
Anyway, what I said was Ricardo and his relatives will be called racist by the pro illegal alien crowd for wanting to enforce our existing and workable immigration laws.
Ricardo also represents the segment of brown America that realizes illegal entry hurts brown people just as much if not more as it does every other segment of American society regardless of color.
Had I met more people like Ricardo in my lifetime, I may not have my current dislike for Mexicans and other brown Americans.
Posted by QBT on May 9, 2007 11:52 AMAnderson-
Quit kidding yourself.You seem to be a somewhat sharp guy but you are being intellectually dishonest if you think there is only one guy advocating open borders .
How we label this mess really doesn't matter-does it?
There is an ongoing effort by the dem party and their willing accomplishes in the MSM to legitimize who knows how many MILLIONS of ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS. Read my 8:14 post carefully.
We have a front row seat especially here in Denver-
It is now "OK" to not be able to speak English as a high school requirement for graduation ;
Requiring schools to teach bilingually;
Enabling illegals to easily obtain Colorado driver licenses with documentation that is less stringent than your local video rental store demands;
Sanctuary policies that handcuffs law enforcement and essentially creates two sets of law.
Which party backs THESE initiatives?
Which party consistently promotes illegal immigration WITHOUT assimilation?
Before your anticipated rabid response let me say this- For whatever his reasons,Bush
has refused to follow his constituency and deserves a major portion of blame, as do employers (who are not all repubs) that hire illegals,but the ongoing dem legeslation reeks with an undeserved legitimacy for illegals.
Posted by GET REAL on May 9, 2007 07:38 PM
Please take THE BLUE OFF MY NAME> I don't have a web site. THANKS!
Posted by on May 9, 2007 08:01 PMAnderson - With all due respect for your freedom of speech - I'm not attacking you - what exactly would you like to see done about illegal immigration? How do you think the problem should be solved?
Posted by Pamela on May 10, 2007 08:46 AMGet Real, words have meaning. The plain meaning of "open borders" means "no restriction on immigration" and it has nothing to do with any of the concerns you identified. I know when someone is being dishonest when they resort to rhetorical garbage like "open borders". As I said, it means someone is trying to scare the pants off you and/or they don't give a d__n about the truth.
Pamela, If I'm not mistaken you asked me that very question a month or so ago, and I gave a longer answer which I'm not going to try to recreate here. In short, I think the original McCain-Kennedy proposal was the best of the ones I've seen on the table.
Posted by anderson on May 10, 2007 12:05 PMAnderson,
McCain-Kennedy proposal is AMENSTY!!! So you want to reward all illegal aliens who broke the every immigration law sneaking into this country, is that what you are trying to say? If the answer is yes, please don't run for any political office, we already have enough government stupidity going on.
Posted by Pam on May 10, 2007 12:16 PMWhatever, Pam. You asked my opinion but I guess you didn't really want to hear the answer. The next time a cop stops you for breaking our traffic laws, and says you can go without a ticket, tell him or her that you never want to be "rewarded" like that for breaking the law.
Posted by anderson on May 10, 2007 12:35 PMActually Anderson you're mistaking me for another of the same name. I have never posted here before, and thought I might join the discussion but most of you folks are way too nasty to each other for any respectful exchange of ideas to take place.
Posted by Pamela on May 10, 2007 01:04 PMPamela, I welcome your comments. Unfortunately it does tend to get nasty at times, especially on this topic. If the entire debate were more civil, we might actually get something done.
Posted by anderson on May 10, 2007 01:10 PM