Public schools are best hope for social justice
I followed the Rocky Mountain News series on DPS, “Leaving to Learn,” and I feel that one important voice is missing — the voice of parents like me who are thrilled with their Denver public school.
I would challenge any parent who has enrolled their child in a private school to show me a teacher who is more skilled and caring than the teachers my daughter has at our community public school. It is the staff at her school that makes it great, but following close behind is the parental involvement.
Parents who say they “would like” to enroll their children in public school should get involved. If you think there is too much emphasis on state tests, talk with administrators. If you think there should be more resources for the arts, start fundraising.
Public schools offer our best hope for social justice, but it takes the public’s support to make it work.
Erica Stetson, Denver
ericka wrote
'Public schools offer our best hope for social justice, but it takes the public’s support to make it work.'
and here I thought schools were to educate.
dont worry about the support part, my taxes are there every year.
"Public schools offer our best hope for social justice,"
With this type of indoctrination inferences, no wonder people are pulling out of public schools.
As an involved parent for many years in another district, I have to say that their comes a point when you get tired of being used and being their "yes" man.
As far as social justice ,that's not what schools are here for.
Education is the best hope for social justice. If the educational profeindeed sssionals (teachers) would educate all students so that they had the skills and knowledge to live a successful life, then they would be self-reliant capable effective citizens. Instead teachers take poor and minority students, reinforce their lack of success and turn them into permanently dependent societal members. Educate them and they will take care of themselves, do what is being done today and we can pay for them forever.
Posted by on May 14, 2007 08:39 AMEducation is the best hope for social justice. If the educational profeindeed sssionals (teachers) would educate all students so that they had the skills and knowledge to live a successful life, then they would be self-reliant capable effective citizens. Instead teachers take poor and minority students, reinforce their lack of success and turn them into permanently dependent societal members. Educate them and they will take care of themselves, do what is being done today and we can pay for them forever.
Posted by on May 14, 2007 08:39 AM[ ]
Posted by shaupeen on May 14, 2007 08:48 AMI'm still trying to figure out what "educational profeindeed sssionals" are.
Posted by miss beadle on May 14, 2007 08:53 AMI am curious as to what grade the letter writers children are in. Is this an elementary school? I too found some excellent DPS elementary school teachers. I, too, volunteered and tried to make a difference by supporting the school, students and faculty.
Unfortunately, kids grow up and out of elementary school. Our “neighborhood” middle school had a national reputation! Unfortunately, it was not a positive one……trash cans being set on fire, parents not notified of issues, bullying. Yes, I still believe that parent involvement is important at the upper years. And yes, I participated in board meetings and school improvement meetings long before my kids were to reach middle school age. The only changes I saw were in the name. It was changed from MLK Middle School, to MLK Academy and now I think it is called. Early College Middle School. All these name changes do not change the schools behavior. There were many times I would be at the middle school when the morning bell rang only to see groups of kids LEAVING the school. I called the school, I called DPS, I called the police, I even followed a couple of groups of these kids…..it continued. I was worried about my child’s safety. Yes, I could have walked them to school and followed them around….not quite the attention a middle schooler wants or needs.
So to attend a DPS middle school that wasn’t know nationally as a troubled school, we had two choices, put our kids on a bus for an hour+ commute to attend an average ranked school, or move so my husband would have a 45 minute commute but our kids could safely walk to GREAT schools.
Children are the cannon fodder in the school competition war for dollars.
Posted by Bob on May 14, 2007 10:24 AMToo bad the public school monopoly is not the best hope for EDUCATION.
Let's have the vouchers and watch education and justice follow!
Posted by Hank on May 14, 2007 10:48 AM"social justice" = indoctrination
Colleges of Education around the country are instituting "indoctrination litmus tests" for proposed teaching candidates. If a student doesn't answer their queries with an "appropriate" (political) view, they are denied teaching credentials.
Another reason for choice in education. The Dems are for choice, except in this area. Wonder why? Maybe they lose their captive audience.
This is not about educating students. It is about indoctrinating them into a particular world view. No wonder our students can't read, write, do math or science or think critically.
Posted by RU Serious on May 14, 2007 11:01 AMKeith: You have been labeled as follows by the commentator. You need to clean up your act. We do not want to lose you. I will remain anonymous.
The insufferable Keith (can he be more than 14 years old?) has included you among the commenters he accuses of being prostitutes -- as long as he keeps his language clean, I'm leaving those comments, but if you think it is worth objecting to, let me know.
1. .Which Colleges of Education are doing this?
2. What is he naure of this infamous "indoctrination litmus test" that would deny teaching credentials from the College.
3. What are these "right answers" you are talking about?
4. Aren't teaching credentials still a matter of meeting State Board (or Department) of Education requirements?
5. If not, when did the College take over from State Certification?
6. When did these "indoctrination" processes begin?
7. How are they preventing the teaching of reading, writing, math, science, or critical thinking?
8. What is the source for your assertions?
Okay here we go again. Another politically correct phrase describing something.
So what the hell is social justice?
I'm falling behind on the politically correct catch phrases. This one slipped through.
Anyone want to update me?
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on May 14, 2007 01:30 PMGrouch
I have no time to do the research for you and don't have specific sources in hand to answer your Q. This has been creeping in for the past five years. While the State Boards may set the criteria for certification of teachers, it is the Universities which award the degrees and certifications.
I you doubt it, do a simple Google search under terms like "education", "social justice" and "credentials" and you will see over a million pages. If you look, many are from the Universities who are pushing this nonsense.
If you want to dispute the sources critical of this, remember that for the most part, the education establishment is dominated by those on the left side of the spectrum. Therefore, why would they be critical of it? They love it. You do too, I know.
Posted by RU Serious on May 14, 2007 03:00 PMRUS,
If I had "loved" it, I would have stayed with it. But that aside.
Colleges and Universities give Degrees; and they also - usually, but not always - belong to Accreditation Associations (Regional), which indicate the subjects, or areas, the prospective Teacher is accredited to teach. However, I have yet to learn of any State that permits the school to issue the Teaching Certificate (license) as such, as different States have different requirements in several areas of the applicant's educational background; and very few, if any, schools offer such a comprehensive number of courses as to allow the student to qualify just anywhere for Certification.
Curriculum proposals - even outrageous ones - are nothing new. And Degree requirements, as well as Departmental requirements, are changable - and changing as tools and methods change - as well. I remember the days when Kansas required a course in "How to Teach the Kittle Method of Penmanship" before one could complete the requirements for enough hours in Education to become State Certified. I doubt if many even remember the Kittle Method today, what with computer keyboards in the classrooms of the early grades.
The fact that there are Universities proposing what you call, "this nonsense", is far from reason to suppose that I would dispute those who would criticize the idea; and certainly does not lay any foundation for your assertion that the "education establishment is dominated by those on the left side of the spectrum". There are quite a good many who do not identify themselves with either "side"; and who would criticize the idea of any such "litmus test" very readily and freely.
Indeed, I myself would most roundly criticize any attempt to enforce any "side", or any "litmus test" of that, or other nature. I asked the questions, because I had never before heard of the idea, not because I had taken any "side" already.
And, just to keep the record straight, I have previously been quite outspoken on the subject of Kansas, and its adoption of text books offering "Creationism", and/or "Intelligent Design", as scientific, and/or as required in the schools. There are areas in which I have a very low tolerance for damn foolishness. And education is one of them.
Unlike several who are regulars on this forum, I happen to value critical THINKING rather highly.
Posted by Old Grouch on May 14, 2007 03:59 PMAmen, which word gives you the most trouble, social or justice? Or perhaps you don't believe in people being social, that is, associating with each other? Or is it that you simply don't believe in justice? Given your penchant for autobiographical disgression, please keep your answers to twenty-five words or less.
Am I remembering wrong about you being a Catholic? If you are, how is it that you have missed out on the great emphasis the Catholic Church has placed on social justice?
Your assigned reading for this evening is at http://www.vatican.net/archive/catechism/p3s1c2a3.htm
There will be a test on it tomorrow. Please, no coffee breaks during your study period.
Amen, is my impression that you are Catholic wrong? If it is correct, how is it that you are unfamiliar with the strong emphasis of the Catholic Church on social justice? Whether you are a Catholic or not, I have gone to the trouble of providing you with a sort of primer on social justice from the Catholic catechism.
http://www.vatican.net/archive/catechism/p3s1c2a3.htm
There is no charge for this service, although tipping in allowed, provided it is not advice but is in the coin of the realm.
Posted by Truth on May 14, 2007 07:21 PMThe original letter writer is idealistic but naive. And many of the subsequent posters are brutally honest contemporary Americans.
Justice is part of the creed Americans tend to profess, going back to the foundational documents for our country. Efforts to ensure equal opportunity, treatment and freedom for our citizens ebbs and flows, as American society variously aspires or retreats from this creed. In theory, schools would be great places to teach students American history and inspire them to fulfill the ideal by learning the story of the founding principles and specifically when, how and why America has fallen short of those ideals at different times over the past 230 years.
But as should be clear by most of these posts, 'justice' is not currently an active value of our society, especially when compared with consumerism and physical comfort.
To the letter writer: don't give up, but don't expect much in the short term from society regarding social justice.
I missed out on the last Correct Speak class, Amen, but I think "social justice" has to do with equality of outcome, as opposed to equality of opportunity.
And if equality of outcome is the goal, what's the point in playing?
Posted by prima facie on May 14, 2007 11:31 PMThank goodness for letters like 11:10 PM. Forums like this typically draw a pretty jaundiced crowd and it's nice to have a real thinking person come abroad once in a while who doesn't speak in sound bytes, has something significant to say, and says it eloquently.
Posted by Truth on May 15, 2007 06:56 AMPeople like truth (What a joke of a name for that nutjob!) want our schools to be indocrination centers for their little ajendas of liberal ideals to be taught. But hey, you used the word "jaundiced" to describe anyone who disagrees with you, so you MUST be smarter than the rest of us.
I KNOW you think you are.
Posted by truthy on May 15, 2007 07:02 AMprima facie,
The phrase is derived from the concept of "equal justice", or "equality under the Law".
Unfortunately, the history of our country gives evidence of altogether too many times and places where that fundamental concept has either been ignored, or absolutely violated; both in the Courts and in the Legislative systems, State and Federal. Perhaps the whole matter of segregation would best serve to illustrate here.
Other groups - whole classes - of people have been, or are presently, denied this principle as well; and the matter has become one of concern not only to them, but to society as a whole. Here, the phrase really does mean "equal opportunity", as a societal, "social", ideal, and practice.
That the idea can also be seen as a form of speaking about "equal outcome", is - again unfortunately - a problem of expression; and one which does manage to muddy up the waters a great deal. Vide, the posting in answer to "Truth" immediately above.
Posted by Old Grouch on May 15, 2007 07:31 AMTruth,I am not Catholic and I resent you calling me one.To me that's like using the "N" word.So you can skip the catholic websites.
As far as my question,what is social justice mean,it's just what I thought the answers would be. Nobody knows what it means. It evidently is a new buzz phrase and I was just trying to figure out what it really meant.
With so many words and phrases being changed to be politically correct, it's hard to keep up.
There was no reason to call me names like Catholic. So please refrain from the name calling.
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on May 15, 2007 07:49 AMThe Colorado Childrens' report yesterday said 1 out of 3 Colorado high school students do not graduate -- that is the definition of "scoial injustice". Educators should be subject to malpractice suits the same as most other professionals that teachers claim to be. If the medical profession operated like educational professionals, they would still be using ether for anesthesia.
Posted by on May 15, 2007 08:26 AMThe parents need to be held accountable so their children graduate.Stop blaming it on the schools.
If the parents aren't involved the kids aren't involved.
Parents need to start parenting.They can no longer dump their little spoiled brats in school and expect the teachers to deal with their problems. The teachers are there to teach,the parents are there to parent.
Go to your child's school and meet the teachers for the next school year. Choose the teacher you think will be best suited for your child and write a written request asking that your child get the teacher or teachers you think are best.
Make sure you know the homework standards and make your children do their homework right after school.
It is harmful to wait until 9:p.m. to start homework and the child doesn't get enough sleep for the next day.
Ask your child's teachers to keep an open line of communication with you. Give them phone numbers and ask them to call at the first sign of trouble with a subject or behavior.
Go to parent teacher conferences.
There are bad teachers,good teachers and great teachers.You as a parent should make the time and effort to find the best teacher for your childs needs.You can always request a teacher.All it takes is writing it down on paper and giving it to the office.
I had such a horrible experience with my daughter's kindergarten teacher I had to go to the school board.Now the Principal calls me every year to discuss what teacher would be best for my youngest.She will be starting 2nd grade in the fall. I have already interviewed her teacher and stated my goals and my child's needs. She explained the way she teaches and what she can do to help my daughter to keep progressing. Yesterday my daughter had end of the year assessments and she tested at a fifth grade reading and 100% accurancy in math. Though the math test was limited to what the teacher taught this year,it was too easy for my daughter.She already has taught herself multiplication and fractions.That is 3rd and 4th material.
So it is important that parents get involved in choosing your children's teacher, If your child is behind ,you have the right to demand that the district come up with a comprehensive plan to bring you child up to speed.You are also entitled to special tutoring.The district pays extra for students who need tutoring,so take advantage of it , if needed.
Also if your child needs help consider summer school classes.I don't know if all districts offer it but use that as a resource.
These are all small things that do not take much time ,but make huge differences in your child's education.Also supplement your child's education at home by reading and using workbooks to challenge them.
In the summer require them to take a half hour to an hour a day to work on reading,writing,math,arts and crafts and science experiments.All these can be downloaded,or bought at walmart.Keep your child learning year round.
It's up to parent's to make sure your child's school needs are being met.Working with teacher's instead of against them benefits your child.If you get a bad teacher like my child had in kindergarten ,it is within your rights to move your child to another class.
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on May 15, 2007 09:14 AMPUBLIC education is about the PUBLIC. Every kid that walks into kindergarten wants to BE something. Not one of them wants to BE adropout. And yet, 13 years later, 1 out of 3 is a DROPOUT. Until educators accept the depth and breath of their failur to EDUCATE the PUBLIC, nothing will change. If you want to blame the parents, then you have the parents the credits for the educationally successful students. NO educator is willing to do that. The numbers are overwhlming -- 1out of 3 do not graduate. That is NOT acceptable. That is a huge waste of human potential. That is the definition of social INjustince. The pictures of each of those kids should be on the mirror of each educators bathorrom so it would the be first thing they see in the morning and the last thing at night. NO other profession accpets a 33% failiure rate. Even your car mechanic would be out of work at that rate. It is time for many an educator to be out of work. And the worst part is that there are scattered districts and even more schools with the most challenged of students from the most challenging of family situations who do get the job done for all students. If the educaitonal professionals want it to happen, it will happen. In too many situations they have developed the attitude that they don't care, so improvement is just a figment of the imagination. Leadership, focus, beliefs and accountability makes it happen. Most schools lack all four. Precious few have all four.
Posted by on May 15, 2007 09:34 AMThe other day I recieved a call from the principal. He informed me that a boy in my child's class has taken her lunchbox from her and banged it up against the concrete over and over until it busted.He said he couldn't tell me the name of the child because of privacy issues. He said he had called the parents and told them they had to replace the lunchbox.I said I would find one and bring a receipt in. When I was reimbursed the only thing that was in the envelope was the money. There was no apology and I'm sure this kid got away with another one of his stunts.I knew who the kid was as soon as the principal told me about the incedent.This child disrupts the class everyday.I do mean everyday. There are 4 other students that disrupt class also.On the same day as the lunchbox thing,my daughter came home and told me a boy had wet his pants ,took off his underwear in class and put it on his desk.Also the same day my daughter was punched in the back by another trouble maker in the class.He was told to say he was sorry. I told my daughter since this wasn't the first time he hit her,the next time she is to ball her fist up real tight turn around and punch him in the face as hard as she can. I'll be up at school to defend her right ti fight back if someone keeps hitting and getting away with bullying her.
This is what the teachers go through everyday.Taking care of people's children who have not learned discipline,manners and proper behavior.Are you going to blame that on the teachers too?
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on May 15, 2007 10:33 AMSo the problem is "those other kids". They are all bad and misbehave and no one can teach them. That is pure BS. Data from large groups of kids PROVES that kids from identical backgrounds perform markedly differently due to ONE thing -- the quality of the teacher in front of the classroom. That is why "Can...Amen" suggests picking your student's teacher; a practice afforded to few parents by schools. Why--because they know a large percentage of their teachers would have NO ONE in the classroom if parents or students were given a choice of teachers. Improve the quality of the teacher in front of the classroom and there will be markedly few stories about "lunchbox villians".
Posted by on May 15, 2007 01:52 PMAmen: "The parents need to be held accountable so their children graduate.Stop blaming it on the schools.
If the parents aren't involved the kids aren't involved."
I totally agree with Amen. I do think that the school systems could do a better job of encouraging parents to be more involved and of providing parents with the tools they need for this. I problem I have had with tutoring is that customarily students are not permitted to being home the books they are using in school, a practice quite the opposite of my schooling experience in the thirties and forties. And typically the parent cannot even buy the books because the school book companies, at least in my experience, can sell books only to schools.
Another problem I have encountered is that of not being informed of what projects the students are working on at school, until the report comes out with how well they did. Most often, again in my experience, most of the time the main homework the student brings home is a math workbook, but not the textbook showing how to do the problems. So at times I've had to go online to see how to do the different methods of multiplication, for example. In one class, for example, the students have a math reference book that does quite a good job of explaining the different math methods, but the student can't bring it home, although sometimes a person can buy a used copy online. And then, at times there is no way to know which of the different methods the teacher wants to be used and I might end up helping the student learn to use a different method than the teacher is using.
The school system could do quite a bit more to make the school experience parent friendly.
The school system could also do more to encourage the teachers to use parent volunteers and to help them to know the most effective way to use them. Some teachers are great; with others, the volunteers mainly stand around waiting for something to do.
I'm sure this post will garner a great deal of interest. But at least I will read it.
Posted by Truth on May 15, 2007 02:37 PMSorry, OG was away for awhile. Here's some background on my last post.
NCATE, The National Council for Accreditation of Teacher Education had, as recently as last year been pushing the idea that Colleges of Education determine prospective teaching candidates' "disposition" on the issue of Social Justice.
They backed off somewhat last June in a discussion before a U.S. Dept. of Education panel.
http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2006/06/06/disposition
(Read the comments if you have time to see how contentious the issue is in Higher Ed).
The issue had been sparked, in part by a complaint filed by the National Association of Scholars in late 2005.
"The concept of social justice plays a major role in the conceptual frameworks at many colleges, including at Brooklyn College's School of Education, which is accredited by the agency. Thus, the complaint argues, the accrediting agency in effect mandates the evaluation of students' commitment to social justice at these schools.
To illustrate the danger of dispositions, the complaint points to a case involving the teacher training program at the College of Education at Washington State University in Pullman. A 42-year-old student, Edward Swan, after expressing conservative views to his teacher, was ordered to a sign a contract forcing him to adhere to the college's disposition standards, which measure commitment to social justice, or face expulsion.
After receiving a complaint from the Foundation for Individual Rights in Education, a higher-education civil liberties group, the university said the student was not required to sign the contract and said it would uphold speech rights of its students."
http://www.nysun.com/article/22552?page_no=1
Linda Seebach wrote about the disposition issue in September, 2005.
"(NCATE)... in 2002 moved further into politics by making student "dispositions" a part of its accreditation process. To earn accreditation, teacher-preparation programs were evaluated on how well their graduates demonstrate a disposition toward social justice.
That's in addition to demonstrating that their graduates know their subject matter well and are effective in presenting it in the classroom, two essential matters that most ed schools are notoriously unable to accomplish.
The problem with "social justice" as a goal is that it is something everybody can be for as long as they don't have to agree on what it means."
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/news_columnists/article/0,1299,DRMN_86_4069669,00.html
Posted by RU Serious on May 15, 2007 03:31 PM"The problem with "social justice" as a goal is that it is something everybody can be for as long as they don't have to agree on what it means.""
But we have the same problem with peace, love, truth, justice (without the social), and just about any other virtue or vice. Surely that doesn't mean that we should abandon them as a goal.
Posted by Truth on May 16, 2007 06:39 AMTruth , You mentioned not recieving math books to bring home to help your child. My children's school uses a math book called Everyday Math. At the beginning of the year I request a copy of the book so I can help my kids learn the new way to do math.The school makes copies of these books and they are in a folder like binder. They do not give the original. At the end of the year you give them back to the school.
It has been a great help with my 4th grader this year.
The school system has a new way to teach addition,subtraction,division,multiplication and other types of math. It is no longer taught the easy way we were taught.It is now alot more steps to get to a simple answer.
I don't know what school district your in ,but I have been getting copies of their math books for years.
My husband is a Mensa and he looks at the way they teach math and shakes his head.He thinks it's a assinine way to teach new math. Everyday Math is not used like the way they teach it. So how can they call it everyday math?
As far as workbooks I go to Walmart and buy workbooks for the summer months. My children love them and often are ahead of what the teacher is teaching the next year. They are inexpensive and also keeps their skills up during the summer when kids lose alot they were taught.We also do the book mobile every week.
It sounds like you care about your child getting an education. Unfortunately we parents have to keep our children learning.My daughter went into 4th grade knowing her multiplication tables. She was the only one in her class. It was supposed to be taught in 3rd grade, but some how it was never covered. So I figured it was time to learn them and taught her last summer before school. Her teacher wrote me a thank you note for teaching her multiplication,because no one else new it.Her teacher was quite disgusted by what her 4th grade class didn't know,but should have.I also taught her cursive handwriting.
You have to take a proactive role in what your child is learning. Teach him or her at home a stepped up program.Read and writing over the summer is important. Get him or her a notebook and at least every other day have them write a short story or what ever they want to write about.Keep it light and fun over the summer.
I have been teaching my children since they were 2 years of age. Even though they went to a great preschool, I taught them alot at home. That is why they are ahead of their peers.Learning is fun to them and they want to be challenged. It is like pulling teeth to get the school to teach them at their level.I don't care how many teeth I've got to pull. I'm going to make sure my kids get an education.
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on May 16, 2007 07:22 AMTruth , You mentioned not recieving math books to bring home to help your child. My children's school uses a math book called Everyday Math. At the beginning of the year I request a copy of the book so I can help my kids learn the new way to do math.The school makes copies of these books and they are in a folder like binder. They do not give the original. At the end of the year you give them back to the school.
It has been a great help with my 4th grader this year.
The school system has a new way to teach addition,subtraction,division,multiplication and other types of math. It is no longer taught the easy way we were taught.It is now alot more steps to get to a simple answer.
I don't know what school district your in ,but I have been getting copies of their math books for years.
My husband is a Mensa and he looks at the way they teach math and shakes his head.He thinks it's a assinine way to teach new math. Everyday Math is not used like the way they teach it. So how can they call it everyday math?
As far as workbooks I go to Walmart and buy workbooks for the summer months. My children love them and often are ahead of what the teacher is teaching the next year. They are inexpensive and also keeps their skills up during the summer when kids lose alot they were taught.We also do the book mobile every week.
It sounds like you care about your child getting an education. Unfortunately we parents have to keep our children learning.My daughter went into 4th grade knowing her multiplication tables. She was the only one in her class. It was supposed to be taught in 3rd grade, but some how it was never covered. So I figured it was time to learn them and taught her last summer before school. Her teacher wrote me a thank you note for teaching her multiplication,because no one else new it.Her teacher was quite disgusted by what her 4th grade class didn't know,but should have.I also taught her cursive handwriting.
You have to take a proactive role in what your child is learning. Teach him or her at home a stepped up program.Read and writing over the summer is important. Get him or her a notebook and at least every other day have them write a short story or what ever they want to write about.Keep it light and fun over the summer.
I have been teaching my children since they were 2 years of age. Even though they went to a great preschool, I taught them alot at home. That is why they are ahead of their peers.Learning is fun to them and they want to be challenged. It is like pulling teeth to get the school to teach them at their level.I don't care how many teeth I've got to pull. I'm going to make sure my kids get an education.
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on May 16, 2007 07:22 AMSorry for the double post.My computer screwed up.
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on May 16, 2007 07:24 AMRU Serious,
Sorry, business all afternoon and evening. Got home after 10:30 PM; and wasn't "computer minded".
You have cited instances, at least one of which seems to have ended in a Court decision that eliminated the practice. I have never challenged the fact that controversial ideas - or perhaps more to the point, controversial titles for ideas - have been a part of higher education. I just don't feel that this particular one warranted the argument in the original posting, that because of "social justice" our children don't learn how to read, write, etc. Nor that it really amounted to "indoctrination", or was sufficient reason to leave the public schools for the real indoctrination of others, such as religious of any type.
If I may refer to AMEN's postings for a moment: Back when, it was the "pick the little word out of the big one" method of "teaching reading" that was all the "flavor of the day". No more phonics, of course. And, way in the background, something called "New Math" lurked also, though that was mostly an East Coast notion at the time.
Well, I'll spare you much more on the reading theory, except to say that where it had been applied, reading itself had become a lost art. And comprehension and spelling were so far gone as to be non-existent.
Down in the basement, by the furnace room, there were a few boxes of old texts. That now "useless" phonics based kind, of course. Fortunately, I had a District Board that had become very disenchanted with the "new" form. So, my classroom went through some basic drills. Surprise! Surprise! One of my pupils even managed to win the County Wide Spelling Bee, and come in 2nd in State. (Sorry; But I've always felt that even teachers are allowed to take pride in the success of those they taught.)
The Parents caught on to the fact that their children were actually even going to the library from time to time.
Next year's classes were not using the "new" idea of "teaching reading".
Of course, this was a small District in comparison to metro-Denver's Districts; but it can happen even there, if Parents are concerned enough to make it happen. "New Math" by any other name smells just as bad - to throroughly abuse Shakespeare.
Posted by Old Grouch on May 16, 2007 09:40 AMOld Grouch , I actually agree with you. I taught my children to read the phonics way. They learned to read before kindergarten. I am just a lowly ex-preschool teacher, so what do I know right? I taught everyone of my former students to read before kindergarten. It is not rocket science. Today they come up with a new and improved reading program every few years. None of them have worked.
The new everyday math is crap. They teach four steps to get to a one step answer.It's insane. The so called everyday math would not be used by anyone everyday.They should have named it stupid math you'll never use.
My 1st grader was just assessed at 5th grade reading level .My 4th grader read the entire Lord Of The Rings Trilogy in 3rd grade, so I know she's way ahead. I taught both of them to read.
Right now in the schools they are teaching by sight. You look at the sight words and reconize them and learn them. They do not teach sounds and letter patterns etc...
That is why there are so many children behind in reading.
I supplement my children's curriculum at home ,because I know they are going to be dumbed down if I don't. I have to keep on teachers constantly to make sure they are teaching my child at her level not the class level.
I also made a big mistake with my oldest. When she was in 1st grade the teacher sent a note home asking the parents not to correct the spelling or grammar of our children's writings. The theory was let them sound out the words the best they can and do not correct them so they would blossom into writers. Well I thought they knew what they were doing and made a huge mistake by not disreguarding this policy.I thought if my child was getting straight A's everything was alright. Well my 4th grader is a horrible speller.That is something I am going to work on in the summer with her.
My 1st grader recieved the same note this year and I told her teacher I would not abide by that policy.My 1st grader can spell the 1st ,2nd and 3rd grade 100 word lists.
I now have to really look at what my children are achieving in school. Both are straight A students. Now however I question is that good enough,do you know what I mean?
Any advice you can give me to keep my children learning and ahead of the watered down curriculum the are getting in school would be greatly appreciated,Old Grouch. Thank You
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on May 16, 2007 12:35 PMAMEN
You did the right thing in teaching your children to read the phonics way. As an ex-teacher, I watched with great displeasure as one instructional (reading) fad after another came and went and our students' abilities plummeted. What had been discarded along the way? Phonics. Good for you!
OG
My comments about our students not being able to demonstrate basic skills have to do with many teachers in K-12 schools using class time talking about their political beliefs rather than teaching science, math, writing, etc. Where does this come from? Why do they feel justified in doing this? It comes from these concepts being shoved at them in the College of Education that "prepared them" for a career as a teacher.
I know. I was on the front lines for several decades and watched some of my colleagues engage in this stuff. I never did. My job was to teach the subject matter which I did. It is disgusting to me and I believe it is a form of child abuse.
Amen, I sure would like to know the name of this school so I could tell my school district, Adams 12, about it. It's really great to hear of a school that goes to that trouble: :
"Truth , You mentioned not recieving math books to bring home to help your child. My children's school uses a math book called Everyday Math. At the beginning of the year I request a copy of the book so I can help my kids learn the new way to do math.The school makes copies of these books and they are in a folder like binder. They do not give the original. At the end of the year you give them back to the school."
Posted by Truth on May 18, 2007 02:49 PM