ACLU should be ashamed of itself
It doesn’t make sense to me when an underfunded and overburdened judiciary honors a lawsuit filed by two Denver Democratic activists whose feelings were hurt because they were kicked out of a speech delivered by their political archenemy President Bush in March 2005.
The ACLU, which has just filed a second lawsuit tied to this “grave constitutional threat,” should be ashamed of itself for seeking court punishment for alleged political misconduct that — even if proven true — can most assuredly and appropriately be remedied at the ballot box (“Bush protesters cite manual in 2nd suit,” June 29).
The plaintiffs have this viable option, yet chose to soak the taxpayers who have to defend against their case which should have been DOA.
If insults and hurt feelings experienced in the political arena are somehow the business of the courts, then the ACLU ought to register as a partisan player in this case and file financial reports under the Fair Campaign Practices Act. My question is: Who controls the ACLU?
Percy Conarroe, Longmont
good letter Conarroe. The ACLU was formed by a student of Stalins, a Roger Baldwin who stated that "We are for SOCIALISM, disarmament, and ultimately for abolishing the state itself... We seek the social ownership of property, the abolition of the propertied class, and the SOLE CONTROL of those who produce wealth. COMMUNISM is the goal" and when you have a group that defends NAMBLA and the like but will outlaw anything that may allow a person to believe in a God, then thats what you have
Posted by Nick on July 12, 2007 12:50 AMInteresting comments and concerns regarding the ACLU, though a bit simplistic. I would suggest you go to ACLU.org. The site has many interesting actions they've taken over the years in support of our civil rights. I've had friends who felt the same as you, until they actually looked into who the ACLU are and what they have done. They were quite suprised to find that the ACLU took stands and actions that the completely supported and agreed with. Most amazing is their actions in support of faith, rather that the lies people continue to pass along that the are trying to harm it.
The ACLU is one of the few organizations willing to fight for that document we all claim to hold near and dear to our hearts: the constitution.
The so called frivolous case you are referring to is viewed as some an attack on free speech. It is sad though not suprising that in this country today, most Americans seem to view free speech and even standing up for what you believe in as frivolous and unpatriotic. The ACLU is simply there to ensure our constitution is adhered to.
Maybe a bigger question should be that at a time we claim our kids are out fighting for our freedom (and dying), why are we not here raising a little hell ourselves? If most Americans truly believed in what this country stands for (freedom) there would be more people raising hell with such groups as the ACLU instead of sitting back and condemning those who truly care, who sadly is in the minority in this country. I think that people who are in the middle of the upside down flag controversy are right, we are in distress.
So.....that's why the ACLU sued the City of San Diego and the Department of Defense over the Boy Scouts use of public lands… those mean vicious Boy Scouts were trampling on our constitutional rights.
Now I understand why the ACLU has filed so many lawsuits to block Christian and Jewish activities in public schools yet allowed Muslims to go unfettered....because the Muslim religion embodies their ideals of how a ACLU society and constitution would be. No rights accept those granted by the all powerful Taliban err....I mean ACLU.
Hope the ACLU succeeds
Posted by gadfly on July 12, 2007 06:33 AMWonderful isn't it? How all the negative diatribes against the ACLU really serve to expose the writers, and their ideas of what constitutes "Americanism".
American Civil Liberties Union is the title of the organization. And, OH! How these negative folks HATE the idea of CIVIL LIBERTIES - for anyone other than themselves, as they define them, that is.
The voices of the "True Americans" (Trade Mark Registered) come through loudly and clearly, echoing their Great Decider's pronouncement; that the Constitution is, " . . .just a damned piece of paper" - especially when it's principles are used to challenge their prejudices, fears, and blind adherance to the rant and rhetoric of racisim, relgious self-righteousness, and the reactionary regressiveism of the far right wing controlling the Republican party.
With nay sayers such as these against it, the ACLU certainly must be doing something right.
Posted by Old Grouch on July 12, 2007 07:27 AMI give regularly to the ACLU and I'm proud of it.
Posted by Charles B on July 12, 2007 07:45 AMThose of you who spew venom about the ACLU would be the first to run to it if it were YOUR civil rights that were being violated.
Posted by Docjay on July 12, 2007 08:09 AMThere is nothing American about the ACLU. They seem to be nothing more than an left wing, marxist political group trying to run under the guise of civil rights for Americans.
Once in a great while they will actually take on a legitimate civil rights case, just to throw people off of their real agenda.
Me,
Care to site any references to where the ACLU has "allowed Muslims to go unfettered" in our public school system??
Also, for all you haters of the ACLU out there, your hero, Rush Limbaugh, was DEFENDED by them when he had the 'unfortunate' incident with the doctor shopping for pills.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,108140,00.html
http://www.aclu.org/privacy/medical/14969prs20040112.html
Certainly...
Lately, there are schools putting in foot baths and changing class schedules to give a 15 minute window for "prayer". Now this was not done for the Christians or the jews, jsut for the muslims...
The ACLU Position? Oh, that's all right.
The other funny thing about the ACLU is it's picking and choosing of rights. They will defend a scumbag's right to vote, but the Boy scouts... a private organization are racist, homophobes and therefore not PC. They also seem to not come out for our second amendment rights... oh yeah, that isnt PC as well.
So, a hypocritical organization that promotes its far left agenda. Gee, who woulda thunk it.
Posted by Dravur on July 12, 2007 08:24 AMThe ACLU is a group of Lawyers, which should tell you everything you need to know about them...
Posted by Roy on July 12, 2007 08:48 AMThe ACLU began with a great purpose...then spiraled down into what it is today. They take things wayyy too far, which has killed their credibility.
Posted by on July 12, 2007 08:49 AMWhat a ridiculous diatribe!
Put the responsibility where it lies.
If the president wasn't so afraid of speaking to an audience that wasn't a bunch of nodding ditto heads, eager to believe anything he says...this whole situation never would have happened.
Bravo to the ACLU for defending the rights of Americans to be able to disagree with and question their elected leaders.
Anyone who can't understand and support this doesn't deserve to live in this country.
If you want to live in a country where everyone
agrees with the president and has the same values, etc...go live in Iran!
Good post Michelle,
The fact that the ACLU chose to defend Mr. Limbaugh, after years of his drug-induced rants against the ALCU itself speaks for itself.
There's also the pesky fact that the same Mr. Limbaugh chose NOT to vote until he was called on it also speaks for itself.
ANYONE who does not vote, in my opinion, gives up his or her right to complain about OUR government.
And Mr Limbaugh has made millions by doing NOTHING but complaining about the government.
He also was among those right-wing chickenhawks who decided to dodge the draft during the Vietnam war, claims to be a family values man despite his multiple divorces, and delights in insulting the people who HAVE voted and worked to make this country as great as it is.
Rush is a fat, cigar-chomping male version of Ann Coulter.
God bless the lawyers and staff at the ACLU.
Just one problem with your post, DMZ.
Ann Coulter is actually just one of Limbaugh's warts in a bad wig.
Posted by Thomas on July 12, 2007 09:32 AMSo we either have people spewing venom about the ACLU or about Rush Limbaugh...obviously party politics are not involved in these opinions, rather than rational thought...
Posted by Roy on July 12, 2007 09:36 AMWhy does a political party have to be involved for us to "spew venom" about Limbaugh?
Couldn't it be that we just don't like this self-absorbed, drug-addict, thinks-he-is-above-the-law hypocrite?
Limbaugh built a huge personal fortune by spewing venom. We're doing it pro bono.
Posted by Thomas on July 12, 2007 09:50 AMPosted by Thomas on July 12, 2007 09:50 AM
Spew away, i was just sayin is all...
Posted by Roy on July 12, 2007 10:20 AMPercy you should be ashamed of yourself for writing this letter. Bush has his jack-booted thugs throw people out of a public meeting because of their bumper sticker and you stand up for that behavior. You really should be ashamed.
Posted by just sayin' on July 12, 2007 10:26 AMThe ACLU is a left-wing group that takes the civil rights to far.
They want the boy scouts to be kicked off public lands and out of schools ,but the defend the rights of NAMBLA who believe it is their right to have sex with underage boys as young as they can seduce.
Civil rights?
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on July 12, 2007 10:47 AMThe ACLU takes action against a perceived wrong, a tort; it is the final arbiter whom you should rail against if you don't like the outcome.
Deicide Corner: In a diary he noted his disapproval of attempts to convert the Algonquins "from their own superstitions to new ones." In a journal he noted dryly that it is appropriate for a church to be the ugliest building in a village, "because it is the one in which human nature stoops to the lowest and is the most disgraced. One world at a time: Your church is a baby-house made of blocks.”-- Henry David Thoreau
Posted by Richard Grimes r22037@yahoo.com (ffrf.org and ask for copy of FreeThought Today) on July 12, 2007 10:52 AMThe letter writer has absorbed everything Rush etc spewed out over this event without once getting in eyesight of the facts.
The people were escorted out by fake FBI men for wearing a t-shirt and having a bumper sticker the presidents goons didn`t like.
Hurt feelings, taxpayers being soaked? Let Bush pay for the defense of his thugs.
I have always wanted to use the word goons, but I know this isn`t exactly the correct term.
If conservs can play fast and loose with terms so can we.
Posted by Sharon B. on July 12, 2007 11:04 AMAmen...
Get your facts straight.
The ACLU did not defend NAMBLA, it and of itself.
The case involved a murder trial in which a lawsuit was filed against NAMBLA for some vile content someone related to their organization posted on the internet. They were not involved in the murder but the lawsuit was trying to make the person who posted the vile comments pay for the actions of the person who read them and committed a murder.
The ACLU made it very clear that they do not advocate sexual relationships between adults and children. They were defending the group's right to freedom of speech, even though they disagreed strongly with their message. Just as they defended the rights of Nazis to have a parade in Skokie, IL back in the 70's.
I think the ACLU is an amazing organizaton that it stands so firmly on it's principle of defending free speech that it's even willing to defend it for people they personally find contemptable.
A quote that is widely attributed to Voltaire but is disputed...but is at the heart of the ACLU's philosophy...
"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I will fight to the death to defend your right to say it."
Posted by Thomas on July 12, 2007 11:13 AMLiberals are destroying this country I tell you. Just read and digest the above posts from them.
Posted by on July 12, 2007 12:50 PMthe only goal of the aclu is to destroy this country.....so thanks for supporting them
Posted by not here on July 12, 2007 01:17 PMA lot of good discussions out there. One of the most maligned organization is the ACLU. You may not agree with all the cases they take on, but they are the group out there fighting for our freedoms. Also if you look at the board members, there are liberal and conservative members.
One person was right in that there are a number of lawyers involved with the ACLU, but then that would make sense since what they do pertains to the law and constitution.
We rightly acknowlege the troops when they serve to protect our country--or the majority of the time when they're sent into conflicts we've not business being in. But it is groups like the ACLU who are here defending our rights within our own borders. Like the troops, it is often a thankless job. Without the troops or ACLU, the apathy that is so prevalent in this country today would quickly result in the end of our republic.
This country will not survive with such dedicated organizations. If the average person doesn't start speaking up instead of pleading "patriotism" as an excuse for allowing the government to act at will, this country will not survive. Our greatest threat to are freedom is no further away than a mirror.
Thank God for groups like the ACLU.
A lot of good discussions out there. One of the most maligned organizations defending our rights is the ACLU. You may not agree with all the cases they take on, but they are the group out there fighting for our freedoms. Also if you look at the board members, there are liberal and conservative members.
One person was right in that there are a number of lawyers involved with the ACLU, but then that would make sense since what they do pertain to the law and constitution.
We rightly acknowledge the troops when they serve to protect our country--or the majority of the time when they're sent into conflicts we've not business being in. But it is groups like the ACLU who are here defending our rights within our own borders. Like the troops, it is often a thankless job. Without the troops or ACLU, the apathy that is so prevalent in this country today would quickly result in the end of our republic.
This country will not survive with such dedicated organizations. If the average person doesn't start speaking up instead of pleading "patriotism" as an excuse for allowing the government to act at will, this country will not survive. Our greatest threat to are freedom is no further away than a mirror.
Thank God for groups like the ACLU.
What do you get when you cross a pig with a liar I mean lawyer??Nothing .. some things even a pig won't do.
Posted by tj on July 12, 2007 01:24 PMSo many necessarily brief diatribes about the ACLU and so few citations to support the various incendiary claims against them.
"...when you got nothin' you got
nothin' ta lose."
I think it'd be cool if the ACLU took on the smoking ban.Maybe they could start by ASKING THE HALL MONITOR OF THIS FORUM WHY THE ROCKY PUT A DEAD LINK ON THE MOST RECENT SMOKING BAN LETTER SO WE CAN'TCOMMENT.
Posted by Jimminy on July 12, 2007 02:25 PMJimminy,
Maybe the link isn't working cuz the person is out on a cigarette break?
Posted by larkspur on July 12, 2007 02:39 PMPosted by Jimminy on July 12, 2007 02:25 PM
I will believe the ACLU is fighting for freedom when they take on the smoking bans around the country...
Posted by Roy on July 12, 2007 03:53 PMAll you have to do is visit the ACLU website to see all the reasons not to support them.
Two major reasons I loathe the ACLU is because they ardently defend supposed illegal immigrants rights yet refuse to uphold the 2nd Amendment.
Here's a link to their stern opposition against letting cities or states enact their own illegal immigrant laws.
And here's a link where they think the 2nd Amendment is a collective rather than individual right so therefore they choose not to fight for it.
Posted by KW on July 12, 2007 04:12 PMKW,
Thanks for two more reasons to give them money.
Posted by Charles B on July 12, 2007 05:53 PMMr.12:50 said "Liberals are destroying this country I tell you. Just read and digest the above posts from them."
Actually liberals are what makes America a place that Conservatives can later feel proud of - it just takes a century or two for them to catch up.
I read these posts and it is the liberals here that fill me with hope.
Thanks guys.
Posted by Bango Skank on July 12, 2007 06:34 PMGerman anti-Nazi activist, Pastor Martin Niemöller:
In Germany they first came for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me —
and by that time no one was left to speak up.
THE ROCKY PUT A DEAD LINK ON THE MOST RECENT SMOKING BAN LETTER SO WE CAN'TCOMMENT.
So that's why there are zero comments for that particular letter. Damn, I was hoping it was because it was a boring, overworked subject that everybody was tired of.
Posted by Hans Christian Brando on July 12, 2007 07:50 PMTruth - Your post rings true. Unfortunately you're on the wrong side of the story.
You're the one calling for mandated participation in universal health care.
You're perfectly ok if the 2nd amendment was removed and guns were outlawed.
Your happy that property owners rights were trumped with the no smoking laws.
You're also the one who'll be standing alone when your time comes. And you probably still won't get it.
Posted by KW on July 13, 2007 09:04 AMI find myself having a true "love-hate" view of the ACLU. When they pursue a position that I have a negative stance on, I think of them as meddling lawyers without a clue. When they go after something I have a positive stance on, I love it and express how they finally got on the right side.
Love them or hate them, they do provide a vital service to this country by standing up for (their interpretation) of the constitution.
Posted by darfor on July 13, 2007 09:30 AMCharles B - For some reason, knowing you give to the ACLU does not surprise me at all.
I figured you worshiped somewhere.
Posted by KW on July 13, 2007 10:18 AMLiberals are destroying this country I tell you. Just read and digest the above posts from them.
Too late, conservatives would of already destroyed this country, like how they destroy other countries, if it was for pesky liberals getting in the way of their perceived divine right. Just look at the CIA's family jewels just released. Plots, assassinations, overthrowing of democratic elected governments so despicable dictators can take over.... All actions of so called godly conservatives when there is no one like the ACLU to hold them responsible. Yes, like it or not, it is the conservatives who seem to want a dictatorship in this country so they can eliminate their perceived enemies, like the ACLU and any one else that will not be their stooges. God help the USA if they ever succeed. I for one will not go down with out a fight. I might support the ACLU, but I also believe in my right to carry guns, and I am not afraid to use them against the real enemies of the USA, be they foreign or domestic. I do not think it will ever come to that, but you never know.... no matter where in the world you are, those religious loonies are indeed crazy.
Posted by Western Slope on July 13, 2007 12:57 PMWestern Slop -
Study the CIA revelations. Neither of the major parties, nor liberals or conservatives have clean hands when it came to assassinations or over throwing establish governments. Besides, most of it is old news; leaks of such undertakings occurred either during or right after the initial planning. If the conservatives were planning something covert, the liberals found a way to get leaked. And it worked just the same when liberals were hatching plan.
Both sides want unfettered control over the country as both believe they have THE SOLUTION. The truth falls somewhere in between. If the politicos on both sides of the aisle could ever quit fighting for absolute domination or, at least, the best self conceived public perception, and learn the art of negotiation and compromise for the overall good of the nation we might see some positive progress come out of Washington.
Posted by darfor on July 13, 2007 02:10 PMI hope the 'three' nimrods who are still kicking this dead horse view these posts. I want them to know that their actions makes me despise them for their soreloser mentality. I'd like to tell them to get a life...but they are too busy being rediculous as only leaft leaners can be. What jokes they are.
Posted by Ann on July 14, 2007 07:17 AMCharles B.
You want examples?
http://www.stoptheaclu.com/
The archives go back a couple of years and it does not take long to recognize a socialist agenda.
But that is what you and todays "progressives" are real after,isn't it?
Posted by Get Real on July 14, 2007 11:08 AM