Dire consequences foreseen in pullout
Recently, my cousins Richard and Bob and I were having a little chitchat.
“What do you think about the war in Iraq, Rich?”
“Bring the troops home and the sooner the better!”
“Well, Rich,” I replied, “I saw a general on TV a few days ago and he said that if we pull out now, the limited and fragile stability we provide might corrode and then there would be a conflagration. Saudi Arabia might jump in and then Syria and Jordan and Lebanon and Kuwait. Then, of course, there’s Iran. And Afghanistan. And Pakistan. And God knows how many other Muslim-populated countries.”
“What if they started blowing up each other’s oil wells and fields?” my cousin Bob countered.
Bob looked at Richard. Richard looked at Bob. Then they both looked at me.
“If that happens,” I interjected, “We’re all in trouble ... deep trouble.”
My cousins and I are not intellectuals or military strategists or politicians. We’re just ordinary citizens. But we wonder how many other people are thinking along these lines?
Dianne G. Norris, Denver
None that have titles of Senators or Representatives.
Posted by legal on September 4, 2007 03:13 AM"My cousins and I are not intellectuals or military strategists.."
You didn't need to tell us...
Posted by on September 4, 2007 06:47 AMHow many lives will it cost to make something that might not happen not happen? Does anybody have any idea whatsoever what "winning" in Iraq will even look like? If the US keeps doing what it's doing will Iraq look any different in a year...5 years...or 10 years? Would you want to give _your_ life for the "cause" if these questions remain unanswered?
Posted by joe_hill on September 4, 2007 09:00 AMHow many lives will it cost to make something that might not happen not happen? Does anybody have any idea whatsoever what "winning" in Iraq will even look like? If the US keeps doing what it's doing will Iraq look any different in a year...5 years...or 10 years? Would you want to give _your_ life for the "cause" if these questions remain unanswered?
Posted by joe_hill on September 4, 2007 09:00 AMHow many lives will it cost to make something that might not happen not happen? Does anybody have any idea whatsoever what "winning" in Iraq will even look like? If the US keeps doing what it's doing will Iraq look any different in a year...5 years...or 10 years? Would you want to give _your_ life for the "cause" if these questions remain unanswered?
Posted by joe_hill on September 4, 2007 09:01 AMHow many lives will it cost to make something that might not happen not happen? Does anybody have any idea whatsoever what "winning" in Iraq will even look like? If the US keeps doing what it's doing will Iraq look any different in a year...5 years...or 10 years? Would you want to give _your_ life for the "cause" if these questions remain unanswered?
Posted by joe_hill on September 4, 2007 09:01 AMHow many lives will it cost to make something that might not happen not happen? Does anybody have any idea whatsoever what "winning" in Iraq will even look like? If the US keeps doing what it's doing will Iraq look any different in a year...5 years...or 10 years? Would you want to give _your_ life for the "cause" if these questions remain unanswered?
Posted by joe_hill on September 4, 2007 09:01 AMAmerica isn't at war. Her poor and working class families are funding this barbaric effort and supplying the targets/sitting ducks (troops). Since the endof WWII, our rich families have been great at starting senseless wars, however, when these wars actually break-out, their blood and treasure break for college, shopping malls, ski slopes, etc.
We need to initiate a military draft. A real draft this time. During the Vietnam War, rich kids like Chips Barry (VISTA) Bush (racially segregated Guard country-club), Mitt (racially segregated Mormon mission), Lott (Ole Miss football cheerleader), etc., proved they loved themselves, more than America. Because these draft dodgers created severe manning shortfalls, criminal court judges became army recruiters. Often times, kids from poor families would minor scrapes with the law (speeding tixs, DUI, etc.), across all racial lines, and the judges would give them very stiff jail sentences or a "tix" to Vietnam. In other words, some of the 58K killed in Vietnam, died because a judge gave them capital punishment for a minor infraction.
Blacks like me, were generally excluded from these recruiting efforts, because 55% of "soldier-draftees" killed in Vietnam, were black, while we only comprised 12% of the nations population. The black culling process that exists and persists, even today.
Posted by 40acresandmymuleandNAMvetbennies on September 4, 2007 09:08 AM40 acres - do your homework a little better. 87% of those killed in Viet Nam were white, 12% black, reflecting the general population.
Posted by coco on September 4, 2007 09:12 AMThanks Joe, and Everybody
A tip here, when you get an error message after clicking the post button, that means the message is posted. I've done this too, we all have. So please just take that error message as confirmation of a posted reply.
Posted by on September 4, 2007 09:14 AM40 acres,How can one person be so stupid?But again that was the only way Johnson could put blacks to work.It would be a good way to get all these non-contributers to society to do something producted.
Posted by Keith on September 4, 2007 09:18 AMKeith said:
"But again that was the only way Johnson could put blacks to work.It would be a good way to get all these non-contributers to society to do something producted."
Who on this forum would like to claim that Keith is not a racist?
Along with all his other traits, that makes Keith pretty much worthless no?
He asked: "How can one person be so stupid?"
Well, Keith, if you weren't so stupid, maybe you could tell us..
Posted by Charles B on September 4, 2007 10:02 AM40 acres and coco make sense; however, a final arbiter is needed to which such position Keith sought (must duel to the death all who seek Keith's banter silenced).
Deicide Corner: “The God of the Christians is a father who is a great deal more concerned about his apples than he is about his children.”
-- Diderot
Isn't this the blackmail excuse? We can't leave because things will get worse. Our troops are being held hostage to a foreign government which is exactly what George Bush said he wouldn't allow.
The Surge is given credit for the supposed improvement in security in Baghdad but ethnic cleansing of mixed neighborhoods is also partly responsible for the supposed decline is civilian deaths. Biden has the right idea to partition the country into ethnic regions like India and Pakistan did. The Kurds don't even fly the Iraqi flag in their provinces. Quit trying to believe that there will be unity government if we just stay another six months, six years, six decades.
It is one of great hoaxes of our time that the same people who told how terrible it would be if we didn't invade are the EXACT same people who are telling us how terrible it will be if we leave. Frauds one and all. Puppets for the war profiteers.
Posted by Wes on September 4, 2007 10:58 AMIf we leave Iraq it will be a disaster.
If we stay in Iraq it will be a disaster.
It already is a disaster.
The disaster began when Bush invaded Iraq under fraudulent pretenses.
Unfortunately, Bush is too insulated from reality and too stupid to ever really comprehend the gravity of his treason, and so are his remaining loyalists.
The disaster remains, while Republican "morale is low."
Hmm. I'll bet if they were to face the fact that they've bungled a fraudulent war that has strengthened the enemy, while gutting our treasury and making the United States into a world-pariah, their morale would be even lower.
But as usual, 'Cons don't care a whit about that stuff - their main concern is staying in power so they can give tax cuts to Paris Hilton, no-bid contracts to Halliburton, and defecate on the Bill of Rights.
40acres:--
You lying sack of sh**. Once again you make up facts to support your weak little pity me profile. How can anyone believe anything you say when you fabricate facts out of whole cloth. You truly are a pathetic little whiner.
Facts on deaths in Vietnam By, including percentage by race who served:
RACE AND ETHNIC BACKGROUND
* 88.4% of the men who actually served in Vietnam were Caucasian; 10.6% (275,000) were black; 1% belonged to other races.
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* 86.3% of the men who died in Vietnam were Caucasian (includes Hispanics); 12.5% (7,241) were black; 1.2% belonged to other races.
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* 170,000 Hispanics served in Vietnam; 3,070 (5.2% of total) died there.
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* 70% of enlisted men killed were of Northwest European descent.
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* 86.8% of the men who were killed as a result of hostile action were Caucasian; 12.1% (5,711) were black; 1.1% belonged to other races.
****************************************************
* 14.6% (1,530) of non-combat deaths were among blacks.
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* 34% of blacks who enlisted volunteered for the combat arms.
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* Overall, blacks suffered 12.5% of the deaths in Vietnam at a time when the percentage of blacks of military age was 13.5% of the total population.
***************************************************
* Religion of Dead: Protestant (64.4%); Catholic (28.9%); Other/None (6.7%).
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
12.5% is a heck of a lot lower that your 55%
It's bad enough any of the above died -- but, it's a tragedy when racist entitlement seeking babies like you distort the facts to justify your personal whining.
Mr. Tenant, or 40 acres
My former CO in Nam "recruited me to this board before he returned to Iraq to work. Besides selling me on some of the interesting and intellectually stimulating individuals that can be found here, he showed me some of your posts and asked me to straighten out your dubious fabricated facts about matters concerning the military whenever possible.
Since the poster at 12:51 PM already straightened this obvious exaggeration attempting to portray a disproportionate amount of black KIA in Viet Nam to elicit sympathy for your cries for entitlements, this posting is only to assure you that I will be monitoring your "facts" concerning the military in the future.
Keep your "facts" factual, Ret. Lt. Cmdr. Tenant, and I will not be bothering you.
Posted by mongoose on September 4, 2007 01:03 PMThanks for the analysis Daryll, and your brother Daryll.
Posted by HistoryRepeats on September 4, 2007 01:05 PMDianne: I'm thinking along the lines of Bush's sentiment by taking you to the chess table:
Bruce and Jake become embroiled over a game and are about to come to blows. Both can put me away with one blow. I shout at them: "Chill out or I'll take the both of you to the woodshed. Sit down! Begin another game."
Had it been Bruce and Bush, my mandate would have fallen on deaf ears and Bruce would have been assassinated. Today, Bruce and Jake play the game.
Dianne: The way I see it ~~~ Vietnam won the war and the domino theory did not happen. Your Richard and Bob are discussing a hypothetical analogous to the domino theory re. Vietnam.
If only the war-mongering Bush is kept at bay until someone lacking his mentality takes over and only Ron Paul fits the bill: All the other Republican candidates and the bulk of Republican Senators and Representatives align themselves with America's bushwhacker.
Dianne: Republicans and Democrats persuade me to become an Independent where I don't have to listen to their chortle resulting in prayer when they mouth what was once America's Pledge of Allegiance created by Rev. Belamy without the words "under God In it. For now, I side with whomever says "enough is enough."
Posted by RG r22037yahoo Deicide/Risen Ape www.geocities.com/r22037/think.html on September 4, 2007 01:18 PMI like your analogy RG. This is the domino theory resurrected. If we pulled out of Vietnam all of South East Asia would fall under communist rule and we would be fighting those filthy commies on the beaches of Hawaii. Their precious domino argument never happened. The fact is Vietnam did fall and it has a communist government to this day but that doesn't stop the globalist from outsourcing American jobs to them.
The current argument about not pulling out because it would trigger a domino effect of unimaginable horror is more hooey that the is used to frighten the already terrified conservatives. Domino shomino it is all phony baloney. The only people who really believe this BS also believed we could never live in peace with the commies. Check your shirt label folks. It was probably made in Vietnam.
Posted by Wes on September 4, 2007 03:54 PMFascinating! Consistent with American foreign policy and conduct for 60 years, ordinary citizens do NOT care AT ALL about other people, they care about oil and how the lack of supply might affect them.
I hope this stops all the phony concern for the Iraqi people (same people we starved from 1991 to 2003 and allowed our golden haired dictator, Saddam, to "rule" from 1979 to 1991).
This subjugation of Iraq and the installation of the puppt government is being done to advance the agendas of Big Oil, the New World Order and Zionist Israel. Are you supporters of the this war/atrocity getting paid for spewing your disinformation or are you truly so stupid as to belive your blather?
Posted by Dave on September 4, 2007 04:03 PMPaid trolls for $300 Alex
I'm thinking they are true believing pro-war Christians Dave except for Keith who really needs to attend an anger management class. Burning oil wells are more terrifying to these folks than burning human beings.
Posted by Wes on September 4, 2007 05:32 PMI'd like to say welcome and thanks for the laughs to the following certified pseudo intellectual members of the Looney Left Liberals of America:
Wes (one of the leaders; or at least, most smug)
Dave (able to totally ignore reality)
Morris (great at false hypothesis of doom and gloom)
Thanks, guys. A little humor goes a long way.
Posted by on September 4, 2007 06:11 PMHow about we wipe out everyone in the whole region, THEN pull out? No worries about what happens after we leave, right?
Posted by Whaddya think? on September 4, 2007 09:22 PMThanks for the anonymous post 6:11 but your slipping dude. You forgot to add islamo-fascist terrorist sympathizer traitor to add to your list of compliments.
What I didn't see was any reference to how scared you are that the Domino effect in the Middle East is going to cause you to stop driving your ATV on the weekend.
Oh and how about throwing in something about how we can spread Democracy around the world with overwhelming violence. I like it so much when pro-war Christians lecture me about how logical it is to destroy our way to peace. That makes about as much sense as a unity government between Sunni, Shia and Kurds.
Hey let's spend twelve (12) BILLION dollars every month for the next twenty years proving that we can get people who have considered each other apostates for seven centuries to come together and sing kumbaya around the fire. Thats really great fiscal responsibility because heck whats ten (10) trillion dollars in debt to fiscally responsible Republicans. Shoot what would we do with that twelve (12) BILLION dollars except develop alternative energy or a comprehensive health care system. Better to flush it away in the desert so George Bush doesn't have to say he's a loser. If you say we won't be there twenty years from now then you're setting one of those nasty timelines. Shame on you you bad boys. We know you really want endless wars and a stripped bare economy. What wonderfully fiscally responsible conservatives.
Posted by Wes on September 4, 2007 09:50 PMwes,I see you are a member of the village idiots.
Posted by Keith on September 6, 2007 09:47 PMI am sure that Diane and her cousins (I assume she is married to one if no both) then bolted down to the Recruiting Office to enlist and help prevent the horror they invisioned. Richard & Bob? More like Bubba and Cletus.
Posted by The Army Wants YOU on September 7, 2007 07:27 AMYep sounds like the same old Domino Theory used to keep the Vietnam war going... check your historybook Diane, Bob & Rich... SouthEast Asia didnt fall, neither will Iraq...or what is left of it by the time we leave.
Posted by LBJ on September 7, 2007 07:30 AM