DPS teachers doing more for less
In response to the letter of Sept. 6, “Teacher’s demands, productivity at odds,” it is beyond belief that there is an obvious widespread opinion that lack of progress in CSAP is caused by poor teaching.
Teaching positions have been reduced, while enrollment has increased. This results in larger teacher-student ratios (my classes at East High School averaged 40 students). Shortages of textbooks and other classroom necessities add to difficulties and frustrations for the classroom teacher.
The fact that there has been improvement in CSAP scores, at all, in the past few years in Denver Public Schools is a testament to the diligent efforts of all teachers to educate our public school population.
DPS classroom teachers are educating our students for more than CSAP scores. These students are also being graded on SAT, ACT and graduation-requirement coursework.
The article also disagreed with the Denver Classroom Teachers Association’s stance on involving classroom teachers in school reform and the design of curricula, along with a much needed salary increase. Meeting the DCTA’s requests would send a strong message that the efforts to “do more with less” is valued, and greatly improve morale.
Martin Doherty, Denver
If we provide more textbooks and materials for the students and give teachers more money, where will the school administrators get the money for their yearly raises? After all the administrators are now only paid over 300% more than the teachers and take credit for school improvements, but the teachers get the blame for non-improvements in DPS
Posted by on September 21, 2007 02:05 AMif the union believes you are so over worked and underpaid here is a good reason for them to start to support vouchers. It will lighten the load off your shoulders and reduce the class sizes. maybe then the real teaching of the 3 R's could happen again and when a student turns in a paper with misspelled words they would actually be told to look up the corrrect spelling. more concern would be in teaching English and reading also.
Also please stop with the very worn out reasoning of a salary increase is what we need to do a better job. if you dont like your pay then change jobs and find one that pays what you want. dcta and nea have one thing in mind everytime they speak and its more money will provide a better education. that has been going on for over 30 years that I can remember. I started out as a teacher and after 7 years could not provide for my family the life style I wanted so I changed jobs and receive pay raises based on my work and not what some union thinks everyone should get.
Teachers have always done more with less, given extra time & bought supplies with their own money. Once they were treated with respect, & considered valuable to our children also. Now they are insulted, blamed, denigrated, & threatened as well.
The schools & teachers need support & respect from the public & that may be even more important that the money since many teachers are not in it for the money, altho like all of us would like to be able to support their families. We need a return to accountability in the schools (not from teachers & test scores) from students & parents. Students should have to do the work or repeat the grade; parents should be responsible for their childrens' work, behavior, & speaking English. Teachers should have the power of discipline.
carol said
Students should have to do the work or repeat the grade; parents should be responsible for their childrens' work, behavior, & speaking English. Teachers should have the power of discipline.
News flash its the teachers and their very liberal ideas that caused this problem to get where it is. they dont want to hurt the childs ego by holding them back. the teaching colleges continue to come up with new ideas on what students work will look like and the teaching methods dont come close to what most parents understand as it changes as the wind blows. [when did spelling become a non issue in the learning of a child?]
what teachers need to focus on is the teaching and parents can do the discipline, if a child gets out of hand have mommy or daddy come to school and sit with little johnny or sally.
Do you remember Jay Bennish?
Posted by Guess who on September 21, 2007 07:57 AMLets face it, the union asks for more money and more benefits, This is at cross- purposes with improved performance which the taxpayers are interested in. Many teachers do not even understand why they are in a union. If classes are too large; or disipline is a problem; these are called "working conditons". Thats what a union is for. Of course that may mean your pay is less.
GG
Posted by GG on September 21, 2007 08:00 AMteachrs never did me no gud but i likd it when they spanked me so i was bad all the time
Posted by Keith on September 21, 2007 08:44 AMThe customers (parents and ultimately employers) think that the product stinks and colleges offering remedial education support this position. Global testing also supports this case. If we need yet another Blue Ribbon commission to tell us that kids nead to master the 3-Rs by grade 12, then the teachers union is half-way home winninig their battle to get paid more for producing less.
VOUCHERS, choice and competition are the only way out!
Posted by Hank on September 21, 2007 10:18 AM"...but i likd it when they spanked me so i was bad all the time."
Keith, we should be in school today. Some of today's classroom hotties and blonde bombshells are more than anxious to do a lot more than just a little spanking!
VVVAAAAAAAARRRROOOOOOOOOOOM!
I blame the public shcool administrators for not allocating the funds(Which they use to pay themselves those 6 figure salaries) and that the teachers supposedly need to teach kids these days.
From the beginning of this country educators were able to teach with just a few books, paper, pencils and ink wells and of cource the chalkboard.
The parents of home schooled chidren have even less and limited supplies just the essentials and out teach the so-called professionals.
Not much different than we use in the 1960's thru the early 1970's. This B.S. has been going on since the 1980's and is getting worse every year and my Denver property taxes keep going up year after year that the majority supposedly is going to educate kids.
Let' s just scrape the whole damn disfunctional system and start over.
Posted by Teachers or Moochers on September 21, 2007 10:26 AMI don't blame the teachers entirely, nor do I blame the parents entirely. I just don't see any reason to believe that anything will change for the better. I've been hearing about educational reform for a long time and nothing gets better. It just gets worse. We keep spending more and more money on education and the students know less, and the teachers don't want us to test the students objectively to see how much they know.
If someone were to give me a reason to believe that more money would help, I'd be in favor of it.
By the way, in my class in gradeschool, there were 38 kids usually.
"The parents of home schooled chidren have even less and limited supplies just the essentials"
They certainly lack the room filled with 30 or 40 children from different families. What a handicap!
BTW, I've always wondered: who if anybody approves a home-school lesson plan?
Posted by Hans Christian Brando on September 21, 2007 12:24 PMold grouch,the hypocrite, complains about the jerks form the right (An American, Keith, etc) for being abusive, unresponsive, crude and unintelligent as they insult and dis people. Yet, when some fool from the leftest agenda that old grouch shares hijacks a name, mocks and denigrates the opposition, it's fair and to be condoned if not encouraged. A prime example of old grouch's hypocrisies is his defending the infantile impostor who's work follows.
teachrs never did me no gud but i likd it when they spanked me so i was bad all the time
Posted by Keith on September 21, 2007 08:44 AM
"BTW, I've always wondered: who if anybody approves a home-school lesson plan?"
The state. To be approved for at home study certain curriculum have to be selected and followed. The children are tested in accordance to the curriculum selected.
Most parents meet, and usually exceed, the required curriculum.
Posted by on September 21, 2007 12:40 PMHans Christian Brando
You must be a public school teacher. 30 or 40 kids in one classroom you say. Why not 75 to 100? Same results.
Less quality time spent with each student. Not to mention half of the kids come from disfunctional families and are disruptive and pass on their anti-social behaviour to the other half.
Also public schools have become dangerous places to send your kids.
Everybody who has kids and knows what really goes on in the public schools is for either home schooling or private schools.
The only supporters of the public schools are the Teachers,The Teachers Union and the Democrats and liberals.
Posted by Teachers or Moochers on September 21, 2007 12:53 PMWho cares about their curriculum when it is been proven to be a failure year after year.
This phony curriculum is and the teaching standards that the state sets are being pushed by the same people who are turning out and graduating kids that can't read or write at a 5th grade level. it's all about that head count at registration time.
The bigger the better so the can get the $7,000 to $8,000 allocated to their budget, then they could care less if they show up the rest of the school year. Thats why they fight so hard against the school voucher plan.
Do you know what kind of good private school you can send your kids with $7,000 a year?
Posted by Teachers or Moochers on September 21, 2007 01:12 PMQuick...shovel in more money! Just a little bit more will put us over the top and the quality of education will exceed all possible expectations...just need a little more money...again...again...again...again...again.
SHOW US THE MONEY!!!
Posted by CA on September 21, 2007 01:38 PMThe Denver School Board lives with it's head up in the clouds. After many failed attempts at hiring a progressive leader for DPS they bring in Bennet, who know nothing about education. Last year he was given a $40,000.00 bonus for CSAP scores that were falsely credited to him and his Denver Plan. He hires another failure out of New York who comes here with all kinds of crazy ideas since he doesn't know what do either. So, millions of dollars are poured into the creation and publication of the Denver Plan with the teachers left to teach from a scripted lesson plan with no resources. No books, no copying rights, and worse ELA S teachers have to work twice as hard. I dare any one of you bozos to seriously take the job of educating Denver's children for peanuts. I bet you wouldn't do it. Back to Bennet. Bennet is bad for DPS, and so is the puppet Board that makes all the decisions for Denver kids. Today Denver kids are at risk of being run out their neighborhoods by administrators who support Bennet's efforts to rally against public education and teacher's union. Schools are closing and families are being outcasted by DPS. Denver kids are turned away from their home schools because they're not good enough to be educated in their home schools. Denver is in more turmoil than you think. A couple more years into Bennet's and Aquino's Denver Plan and all DPS will be charter schools. This was the good ole boy Owen's dream, and Bennet is the man to make it happen. Denver teacher ought to be raging mad!!
Posted by RR on September 21, 2007 02:16 PMThe top heavy administration structure is at least half of what is wrong with public education. The unions are the other half. Just my opinion - obviously to be torn apart in future posts.
What the hell is a superintendant being paid $400,000 a year to do? How about the countless numbers of paid staff below him? Are they all neccesary? Undoubtably there is vast waste in school districts and school front offices via redundant employees and useless positions.
Image if they halfed the costs of the adminstration? All of those dollars could then go to the classroom (not all to the teachers you drooling union hawks) for books, equipment and other learning media. Gone would be the days of getting a request for more money every week for books, computers, sports, lights, air conditioning.
That would be true reform, however I doubt any school board has the balls to try something so dramatic and worthwhile.
Posted by Jack Bauer on September 21, 2007 03:55 PMHmmmmm, let's see. on average, every kid in DPS is worth $9k. possibly more, but $9k is a number I have heard repeated. That means that each class with 24 students is worth..... carry the one, divide by the hypotenuse of the square root....$214,000. Lets assume that with overhead, a teacher is making $60k.... That leaves about $150k for books, busing etc. per class......
Before we start handing more money to this system, let's account for that extra coinage. If there are 40 students in a class as claimed, then you can do the math.....well, not if you went to DPS.... If so, get someone to do it for you.
I don't know how many more administrators they need to run the schools. Do they really need the Department of Pencil Sharpening and the various other crap that we pay for that is about as useful as estrogen for the Hildabeast?
How do these alternative schools make money with only $150k in overhead per class. A Montessori school I know of, has 1 teacher and 1 assistant for every 20 kids.... There is one admin, one accountant and a secretary. They charge less than $9k per kid..... Oh, and their kids can read and write, and think....and there is a waiting list a mile long......
How do they do it? Tis a mystery.....
Posted by Dravur on September 21, 2007 04:11 PMIgnore the logical presentations above arguing against more money for the schools -- they lie. All we need is a little more money to get over the hump and are results will be superior to anything in the world...trust me.
Just a little more money...and then a little more money ...then a little more..trust me , we're getting there... just a little more...and a little more...and a little more...
Posted by on September 21, 2007 05:33 PM05:33PM: "Just a little more money...and then a little more money ...then a little more..trust me , we're getting there... just a little more...and a little more...and a little more..."
You've got the teachers confused with the Iraq war.
Posted by Truth on September 21, 2007 06:54 PM"You've got the teachers confused with the Iraq war."
Posted by Truth on September 21, 2007 06:54 PM
Better chance of winning in Iraq than having a successful public school system. Nationally, winning in Iraq will cost less in the long run, also.
Posted by on September 21, 2007 07:08 PMWhen kids graduate from high school unable to read or construct a sentence and think Wyoming is another country, public school is beyond life support. The carcass is dead, bury it. Vouchers are the only way. Let the free market decide.
Posted by on September 21, 2007 11:02 PM