Mr. Bush, get a clue
President Bush’s criticism of Myanmar’s human rights abuses (“‘Keep terrorists on run,’ president urges summit,” Sept. 7) is hysterically funny — this coming from a man who maintains secret prisons, supports torture, suspends Geneva Conventions in treatment of prisoners, etc.
Mr. Bush, get a clue. The whole world is laughing at you.
Larry Walsh, Conifer
The whole world is laughing at all of us larry. bush is our leader and he was ELECTED by us. so actually we are the stupid ones. ( even if you didnt vote for him ) our congress is just as stupid and corrupt for not listening to our demands that things be resolved either.
the entire government is full of sht!
Posted by Fresh on September 14, 2007 01:06 AMlarry,Lets add you to the list of the village idiots.Get a clue,quit listening to the lying liberals.
Posted by Keith on September 14, 2007 01:19 AMlarry,Lets add you to the list of the village idiots.Get a clue,quit listening to the lying liberals.
Posted by Keith on September 14, 2007 01:19 AMKeith, so who do you suggest people listen to instead?
Keith obviously wants us to listen to the lying neocons
Posted by Mary on September 14, 2007 04:08 AMI suggest we listen to Bango Skank. In his own mind, he is always the smartest guy in the room!
Posted by Guess who on September 14, 2007 06:36 AMKeith listens to the 'voices' in his head. He is typical of the type of folks who blindly sit by and assume whatever their government says or does must be right. He would have made a great German. Hitler would have loved him.
Posted by anti-keith on September 14, 2007 06:39 AMAnti-Keith,
In Keith's defense, listening blindly to a moderately conservative regime is probably a little less dangerous than being one of millions of sheep, herded by Hollywood, the liberal media, and acadamia, all of whom march onward blindly and ignorantly for the cause of socialism and large government interfering in our lives.
Posted by on September 14, 2007 06:50 AMListening to Hollywood? Isnt that where the best and brightest GOP candidates ciome from? Reagan, Arnold and now laxy Fred? I think Hollywood is a breeding ground for the GOP.
And the media is pretty much owned by the conservatives, so if their press is bad now...imagine ow an unbiased press would report on Bush.
Seig Heil Keith!
The "liberal media" is nothing more than a myth pushed by the conservative media.
Posted by GK on September 14, 2007 07:11 AMIf your impression is that most Hollywood political "thinkers" are Republicans and that the media is conservative, you are more radical than anyone I have yet met. Anti-Keith, I would venture to say that you are probably a pinco! Remember that Stalin was a mass-murderer on the same level as Hitler, not to mention that all the communistic regimes have either failed (USSR, North Korea), are currently failing (Venezuela, Cuba) miserably, or are adapting to capitalism (Chicoms and Vietnamese). Yeah, we should listen to you (facetiously).
Posted by on September 14, 2007 07:16 AMGK is a feable-minded sheep too!
Posted by on September 14, 2007 07:19 AMBush should put away his crack pipe and break out his peace pipe.
Posted by 40acresandmymuleandNAMvetbennies on September 14, 2007 07:31 AMYeah, look what it did for France at the beginning of WWII! Maybe we should have busted out the peace pipes during the Civil War too, then everybody south of the Mason Dixon line could be happily whistling Dixie. Peace is always the answer! Everything can be accomplished through peace.
Posted by on September 14, 2007 07:35 AMMr. Walsh,
In your mind, the world may be laughing at Bush, but most of the reasonable News readers this morning are laughing at you.
40acres...,
But Bush's peace pipe is cracked...
Well, I don't think Bush even knows what peace is, let alone smokes it.
(What he IS smoking sure smells vile, however.)
As for Larry Walsh's letter, he's correct, in my opinion. The US is in NO position to dictate to anyone about human-rights. America used to be in that position. And, god knows, there are certainly countries around the world that need to have a finger wagged at them.
But the US is no longer is a place where such finger-wagging has any meaning, given that America does not live up to its once-charished ideals any more.
Yep, the world is laughing at us - and that's why 50% of the 6 billion are scrambling to come to the USA.
Can't wait to see how the liberals "make things better" when they again have both houses and the presidency. Lets see, unemployment at all time lows, personal income at all time highs, But the libs are gonna take us in a NEW direction.
Posted by crusty on September 14, 2007 08:33 AMAmen crusty! They don't care about low unemployment or high income though. All they care about is that we are all equal, even if it means that we are all equally friggin' miserable.
Posted by vk on September 14, 2007 08:46 AMLarry Walsh is a typical bleeding heart-"Less"
liberal who always is more concerned with our enemies well being than the soldiers and citizens of this country. His ilk are the same who worry more about the rights of the crimminal than the victim.
He is nothing more than a traitor and a subversive to America and needs to be hung as such. Mr. aid and comfort to the enemy like his pal John Kerry. One of those "Secret" prisons is too good for this lowlife.
He's worse than the terrorists at Guantanamo Bay because he hides behind the Constitution and abuses his rights as a citizen of this country he in reality despises.
.
Uh, Crusty: the figure you gave, 50% of 6 billion' is false. Not even close.
Posted by Sheila on September 14, 2007 09:30 AMAs long as I got some O2 burners like Keith and Crusty on my side I can say and do whatever I want. Sure we're torturing terrists but I cin still complain about what other countries are doin'. I got nuclar weapons.
Posted by Chimpy McFlightsuit on September 14, 2007 09:35 AM50% of 6 billion is exaggerated, but the number is still in the hundreds of millions, which is still significant.
Posted by on September 14, 2007 09:50 AMI'll tell you who is not laughing. The people in Iraq who have to deal with terrorists everyday,the people in Great Britian who have even less rights than we do ,so their intelligence agency can break up terrorists cells,the Germans who just arrested a terrorist cell plotting to blow up American interests,the millions of dead and refugee people of Darfur who have been slaughtered in the name of Allah,people in Afghanistan who are again fighting against the Taliban,the people of Israel who are in danger everyday from bombs and morters shot at them from Hezbollah and Hamas, the people of Lebanon who's country has been destroyed by the actions of Hezbollah backed and armed by Iran and Syria.
The many other countries around the world who are being infiltrated by Al Qeada and other Muslim extremists groups.
Peace is not in their hearts or minds.Their mission and it has been stated many times is, to turn every man , woman and child into their kind of Muslim extremist. How many times do they have to say it before it sinks into people's thick heads.
That is their new world order! Turn everyone into a Muslim. How many times do you have to hear it? Anyone who does not convert to the Muslim religion should be killed! How many times do you have to be told that?
Peace can only be achieved through strength.
Iran is going to test us and we need a strong leader to get us through it.Why do you think Iran has been so quiet?They are pulling their terrorists out of Iraq to help the surge. They are waiting for a Democratic White House.
Knowing that the Democrats are weak and are beholden to groups like Moveon.org, Iraq is just waiting to strike.
If Democrats get complete control,this country will be in anarchy,just what the far left has been waiting for.
People have such hate for Bush they are not looking at the whole picture and into the future.
When the Democrats take office,and they probably will, our country will have open borders.all illegals will have amnesty,even criminals,No Homeland Security,Our troops will be pulled out of Iraq,( just what Iran is waiting for),we will have forced government healthcare,which huge tax increases will cover, our taxes will be sky high to pay for the people in this country that don't make what the democrats deem enough money, it's called steal from the rich and give to the poor,unfortunately they consider the middle class the rich and we will get hosed,there will be no more middle class.
People who hate George Bush so much have tunnel vision. They are not seeing the big picture. If you can just get past the hate ,he will be out of office soon,and look at the big picture and what is really going on,maybe our country can recover from the great divide that has drove a wedge so deep it is going to take a miracle to right our country.
Until the elections put aside your hatred for George Bush so you can make an informed decision on who should run this country,not based on hate or revenge that didn't work when a Democratic Congress was elected,but based on who can keep our contry safe,help our troops get out of Iraq with honor and fix the illegal alien problem in this country.
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on September 14, 2007 09:52 AMAMEN!
Posted by TIRED OF ENTITLEMENTS on September 14, 2007 10:00 AMI will second that AMEN!
Posted by jgd777 on September 14, 2007 10:14 AMI heard a person from somewhere in the Middle East say one time a few years back that all they have to do is wait until America kills itself from within and then they come in and take over. We are well on the way. When we all don't have George Bush to hate anymore (I'm not crazy about him either believe it or not) then we will have to decide what to do to bring America back. Why don't we start on that right now instead of bashing Bush. That sure would be a better way to use our energy don't you all think?
Posted by Anti Lib on September 14, 2007 10:26 AMMy point exactly, Anti Lib.Our country is being torn apart by peoples hatred of George Bush and Government in general.
He is going to be out of office soon. Put aside the hate people so we can try to put the country back together and choose a leader not out of revenge or hatred ,but because that leader is going to pull us out of this black hole we are in.
This country needs a hero to stand up and help America not play politics. We are in serious trouble people.
When you have far left hate groups like Moveon.org running the entire Democratic party,we are in trouble.
Do you want these crazy hate filled nutjobs pulling the strings in Washington?
Stop the hate and start making informed decisions on who is going to lead this country out of the chaos we are in right now.
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on September 14, 2007 10:40 AMAs opposed to the crazy hatefilled nutjobs we currently have?
Posted by Larry on September 14, 2007 10:45 AMI agree with Amen. We all have to put our heads together and try to figure out who would be the best president not what party. I want to elect someone that is not dictated to by moveon.org and the elite Hollywood or the big corporations and is not anti military but is also not a war monger. I imagine there is nobody that is running for president with all the above but we have to do the best we can.
Posted by Anti Lib on September 14, 2007 10:55 AMCan't you guys see that now that the Republican party is in shambles it's time for bi-partisanship? Despite everything that's gone on for the last 7 years, the politicization of every aspect of government, the "if you're not with us you're against us" mentality, and complete disregard for 49% of the population, now is the time for compromise.
Give me a break. Don't spend 7 years doing one thing and then 3 months preaching another when it becomes apparent that you didn't know what the hell you were doing all along.
Republicans have spent the entire Bush presidency making EVERYTHING about the R or the D next to a candidates name. Now that the country is finally starting to realize what's going on, hypocrites like Anti Lib and Amen can't take their own medicine.
BTW, I still haven't heard anybody refute Larry's claims. Can anyone explain how torturing people while decrying against torture is not hypocrisy?
Posted by Grog on September 14, 2007 11:14 AMTerrorists are not governed by the geneva convention, so neither are they covered by it. They are not traditional combatants. They are criminals and murderers. The American Brass has also been nailing our soldiers who think murder and rape is okay, not to mention those from the prison scandal who were found treating their prisoners poorly. The cloak and dagger CIA stuff is just the means to an end. It certainly has nothing to do with hypocracy, just protecting soldiers and allies.
Posted by on September 14, 2007 11:32 AMGrog 11:14 said-
"BTW, I still haven't heard anybody refute Larry's claims. Can anyone explain how torturing people while decrying against torture is not hypocrisy?"
It is how you define torture.
Do you think putting panties on peoples heads is comparable to this?
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2007/0524072torture1.html
Well, there you are...maybe the American lib. version of torture is an ant on an anthill compared to the conventional version of torture.
Posted by on September 14, 2007 11:52 AMIt's the letter writer who needs the clue.
1) If people knew of secret prisons that Gorge Bush was maintaining, those prisons wouldn't be secret.
2) The Geneva Protocols do not apply to illegal combatants.
3) The definition of "torture" has itself been tortured out of its original meaning. It now includes such things as interrogation by a woman, having a dog in the vicinity, taunting, splashing water in the face and playing music by the Red Hot Chili Peppers.
4) As to "the whole world is laughing at" Bush, the elections we've seen in places like Australia, Japan, Mexico, Canada, Germany and France say otherwise. In each of those cases, it was the pro-Bush candidate that won; the anti-Bush candidate lost.
There is nothing wrong with torturing terrorists. they deserve it. We are in a whole new world now. Terrorists are allowed to behead people and show it to the world on the internet but we can't waterboard or play loud music? Who is the hypocrite now?
The rules of war have changed and the battlefield is everywhere.Let's stop with the pity party for the people who want us dead and start getting down and dirty on their level. This is the only way we can defeat the enemy of Islamic Jihadists.
I'd rather see a few terrorists tortured and have them kill themselves ,than to watch over 3,000 Americans lose their lives and have another 9/11.
Who's side are you on anyway.
Posted by Can I get an AMEN! on September 14, 2007 11:58 AMLeroy wrote" The US is in NO position to dictate to anyone about human-rights. America used to be in that position."
Would you please cite any time in history when the US was in that position? And could you cite anyone in the world who paid it any heed?
I disagree with Can I get an AMEN. It is not America's place to torture anyone. Any torturous act is beneath us as a country, a democracy and a civilized nation.
However, the use of the word "torture" has become a catch all expression by those of the left that includes any method of tough interrogation for unlawful enemy combatants. The idea that we must give habeous corpus rights, geneva convention protections and rights reserved under our constitution to these terrorists is ludicrous.
We should not artificially tie our hands in battling this extreme group of religious fanatics who are out to fundamentally change our way of life. I'd rather error on the side of too aggressive interogation than suffer the severe consequences of not getting information to prevent the next terrorist attack.
Posted by Nostra Damus on September 14, 2007 12:41 PMWith the exception of a few people who choose to adhere to strict party allegiance "come hell or high water", most of this discussion seems to indicate a strong desire for not just a change in the direction the country is currently going, but a change in the "politics as usual" system entrenched in DC.
I find that very encouraging and healthy. People on this forum from both the right and left side of the political spectrum are both condemning the system of political expediency and the professional politicians, in both parties, who thrive on that bartering to maintain their own power and influence.
Cleaning those types and the corrupt system currently operating in DC would go a long way in turning this country back toward the positive. This can be done in both parties if the party faithful would evaluate actual accomplishments by the office holders instead of the promises or idealism presented, but not followed by the elected officials.
Democrats can replace those in their party, and Republicans can replace theirs. The two party system can stay, but the politicians, if reelection is contingent on accomplishments, will work harder on constructive legislation, whether it be partisan or bipartisan, in order to establish a record they can point to in defense of holding office. New promises (soon to be forgotten after the polls close) and flowing idealogical rhetoric which is usually meaningless in the long run, will become a thing of the past.
Assuming that this forum is somewhat indicative of public sentiment around the country, we may slowly see a change in the status quo.
I think you overcomplicate things. For the average partisan issue that comes to vote, the majority party generally overwhelms the minority party. It is important to polarize and vote for one party if that party generally takes up your issues because if you don't, you put the vote in the hands of the other guy. It would be a mistake to vote for a Democrat who gets things done if you depend on Republican votes to (fill in the blank). For instance, it would be stupid for me to vote for a Democrat who is busy on and generally does good things for the armed forces committee if he is going to turn around and vote to socialize healthcare, which I vehemently disagree with.
Posted by on September 14, 2007 01:02 PMAMEN wrote:
People have such hate for Bush they are not looking at the whole picture and into the future.
When the Democrats take office,and they probably will, our country will have open borders.all illegals will have amnesty
**********************************************
Bush himself is advocating for amnesty, perhaps its biggest proponent at that!
AMEN also wrote:
People who hate George Bush so much have tunnel vision. They are not seeing the big picture. If you can just get past the hate ,he will be out of office soon,and look at the big picture and what is really going on,maybe our country can recover from the great divide that has drove a wedge so deep it is going to take a miracle to right our country
************************************************
Bush is largely the reason this country is so divided. He had nearly all of us behind him after 9-11, behind him for the invasion of Afghanistan, but his 'my way or the highway' policy and political smearing and fearmongering and coercion into forcing the war with Iraq has divided that support. (the congress is not blameless in this fiasco, for sure)...but Bush is 'the leader' and his leadership split the nation.
For my part, its not partisan to hate on bush...he brought that on hisself...i don't necessarily paint his party with that brush...but his supporters are nearly as ignorant as he...
but, you're right, we need some sort of reconcilliation here at home...the only way we will be defeated is if we collapse from within...and bush played right into bin ladin's hand by engaging our forces in a ground war in the middle east, the long term prospects do not favor our sucess (if you know your history of that region)...now our fine fighting forces are little more that ideal targets for extremists and radicals...
there are now two options: pull out...or deploy a half million troops to utterly supress the entire populace...
which seems more likely?
Posted by Grim Reefer on September 14, 2007 01:03 PMAmen,
You said, "Terrorists are allowed to behead people and show it to the world on the internet." You cannot possibly be this stupid. Terrorists do that, and that is why THE REST OF THE WORLD HATES THEM. That is why you feel no regret saying, "There is nothing wrong with torturing terrorists."
Nobody who tortures people ever thinks they are doing something wrong, because they imagine themselves to be fighting some sort of Overwhelming Evil, but history has shown again and again and again and again and again that those who torture are always wrong. Always. From the Nazis to the Spanish Inquisition, slave holders to the Stalinist Russians, Imperialist Britain to the Viet Cong, those who torture are always, always wrong.
If you can't comprehend that basic aspect of civilized humanity, I shudder to think of the wretched offspring you're continually squawking about.
Posted by Grog on September 14, 2007 01:04 PMWho supports term limits for both houses of federal government?
Say 'aye'!!
One mans torture is another mans pleasure.
That word is the liberals latest buzz word to over exaggerate and try inflame Americans feelings. Sure their were some cases of despicable behaviour by some of our soldiers but not on the grand scale they contend. They don't call it being on the "Left" and wrong side for nothing.
I'd like to drop all of these bleeding hearts in the middle of the Triangle of Death in Iraq so they can explain how they feel their pain just before the terrorists be-head them.
This is something that always happens during war and conflicts.
These exaggerated cases of "Torture is the liberals pleasure and a pain in the you know what, to "Real" Americans who know better.
Lousy lying leftist traitors!
Posted by Just a Suggestion on September 14, 2007 01:09 PMDefeating your enemies does not mean stooping to their level.
Posted by Stan Broyles on September 14, 2007 01:34 PMGrog,Your comment the rest of the world hates them,is wrong.
I was referring to the people in this country who follow the Cindy Sheehans and the George Soros's of the U.S.
They have more sympathy for the terrorists than they do our American soldiers and citizens.
the lefties in this country like Rosie O'Donnell ,Tim Robbins,George Clooney,Sean Penn,Michael Moore,The Democrats in Congress rather see America fail and spout their anti-American views than heal this country.
Anyone who listens to these people and believe in their anti-American,pro-terrorists positions are morons who can't see the truth.
What kind of torture do you think the thosands of families went through as they watched the air planes plow into the buildings their loved ones worked in.What kind of torture do you think the family members and children went through watching the buildings come down.What kind of torture do you think the families that had loved ones at the Pentagon went through. What about Flight 93?
That is torture. Not playing loud music and waterboarding or not giving a terrorist a prayer rug or 5 times a day to pray to their god of evil and murder.
You don't know what torture is. You just think the poor little terrorists should be treated like guests at a 5 star hotel.
Civilized?
You can't be civilized and fight that kind of evil.
Stan Broyles
The only one stooping to our enemies level are the bleeding hearts who take up fake humaitarian stances to decieve and weaken our resolve to defeat them.
Posted by Just a Suggestion on September 14, 2007 02:02 PMJAS,
Please define "fake humanitarian stances".
Posted by Stan Broyles on September 14, 2007 02:06 PMAmen Has everyone here seen the movie "siege" with Denzel Washington?
This is the ticking time bomb scenario that Republicans always bring up.
Amen, can you be sure every person in one of our controlled prisons is a terrorist?
How do you know this? You torture them till they confess?
That is circular reasoning at the least and at the worst, not what this country is all about.
Terrorists torture and behead people to frighten them and it looks like some of our people did the same, just a little messing around for fun. Not even going for information.
if we let the worst and the lowest of us torture others, this will come back in some way to hurt us more than it hurts them.
Waterboarding can kill you, why do you think they use it.
When you say "there is nothing wrong with torturing terrorists, they deserve it" I want you to answer two questions for me. Please.
(1) How do you know the person you have is a true actual terrorist? No mistake here now, this mans life is in your hands. In this example you have the power to torture or not. It is up to you. Say the kid is about 19 and looks scared to death, doesn`t have decent clothing and looks underfed. Hey no sympathy here, right?
(2) Are you going to torture him, since you have decided to, for information or for fun.
I get tired of your anti liberal rants and how you paint Democrats and liberals.
Now show some spine and answer my questions.
Posted by Sharon B. on September 14, 2007 02:18 PM
Stan Broyles
That's your thing. You should know. Why waste my time expaining the obvious?
To Ms. B,
See Dave above. Waterboarding is the only example you can think of of actual torture, and if I'm not mistaken, they don't do it anymore because someone decided it was wrong.
Perhaps we still have women with blouses missing a button or two...torture. Hah.
2:27:
You are mistaken. For a list of the (publicly acknowledged) ingenious torture methods employed by the US, the Human Rights Watch organization can bring you up to speed: http://hrw.org/campaigns/torture.htm. You'll see it amounts to a little more than "women with blouses missing a button or two" (I can't believe how sleazily deceptive this is). I think it is safe to say that there are many, many practices which our government engages in of which we know nothing, given their track record in this area.
Amen,
Can you please provide one quote/piece of actual evidence that the people you list care more about terrorists than our soldiers? Anything? You are in a delusional world. The image you speak of has been projected upon those people by people too stupid to tell the difference between someone wanting America to stop killing people and someone who wants Americans to be killed. It is possible to love America and still wish it could be better than it is, despite what your whack job hit men would have us believe.
That said, nothing I've seen in this blog full of wingnuts, degenerates, and idiots has ever alarmed as much as this quote: "You can't be civilized and fight that kind of evil."
We can. We must. Otherwise, we have nothing worth fighting for.
Posted by Grog on September 14, 2007 02:57 PMSharon B.
Does the B. stand for "Bolshevik?
If it doesn't , It should.
Now that's a Hoot!
Waiting for some decent answers to my two questions. Anyone can jump in.
Seems we let a lot of those 'terrorists' in Abu G. go home. Guess they were not all terrorists at all. Even let some at Gitmo go home. Some were back fighting, not all though.
Oh well, they probably had a good time in the hands of the U.S. troops. Bet they went home and told their friends and families to support us because we are people of honor who did not mistreat them.
Wanna bet?
Posted by Sharon B. on September 14, 2007 03:22 PMHeck, I'm still waiting for you to answer my one question!
I Know, It's Bin Laden!
An an answer to Sharon B.'s question
1. No, we don't know that the "young underfed, scared man" is a terrorist. We might have suspicion that he might be since he has been found in a terrorist area. But, that is what interrogation should find out. No one is talking about "torturing" him or other physical damage. But, neither do you know that he might know where the next suicide bomber is going to strike. Maybe that's why he is scared.
If we have reasonable suspicion that he is involved with terrorism, we find some evidence (i.e. a tapped telephone conversation) and have the resources to take him into custody, then what objection do you have? Or are you going to argue that we have to give him full rights under our constitution even though we captured him on the battlefield of Afghanistan or is carrying an AK 47 in Iraq?
2. What is your definition of torture? Is sleep deprivation? Bright lights? or Questioning by a Woman? All of these might be uncomfortable and by his perspective, torture. What is a reasonable policy on what is and what is not permissible in the interrogation of enemy combatants. Simply claiming that our interrogation method is torture is not a policy that we can afford in this conflict.
One final point. What type of world view do you have to believe that American soldiers or agents would "torture someone" just for fun?
Posted by Nostra Damus on September 14, 2007 04:31 PMSharon B
I have to agree that real torture is wrong. But I believe that Nostra Damus above has a valid point regarding what is really torture.
I tend to view torture as doing something that can physically or mentally result in permanent, irreversible damage. Doing something that may be adverse to a prisoner's culture and cause discomfort -- like a female questioning a male -- I don't view as torture.
Humiliation is an area of mixed concern. Some humiliation may be justified -- again, a female interrogating a male -- while perhaps other would be going to far -- keeping a male prisoner naked and subjecting him to taunts and ridicule of females. I believe the first is within the parameters of fair treatment, where the latter is probably not; and, may even prove to be counterproductive to obtaining information.
I've never been in the military or knowingly talked to anyone who was privy to what is actually going on. Without such knowledge, I tend to give the benefit of doubt to our soldiers in not intentionally crossing the line -- especially since the mess at Abu Ghraib.
Checking that video posted above by Grog, I failed to find a date of any recent documented cases since Abu Ghraib. Let's hope that we learned a lesson from earlier abuses and modified our handling of prisoners.
Posted by carl on September 14, 2007 05:57 PMCarl,l thank you for a reasoned response.
I was talking physical torture and look how the defenders jumped in to justify it. ND, that is what you did, you made the scenario fit your desire to explain when we can torture and used the word interrogation. Nice switch there.
Real physical torture is what I am talking about. And I think you all know that. Forget the cultural playing around and remember the dogs that were used in the prison. Were those dogs allowed to bite the men? Gee, do you even care.?
Again, I ask my first question about the movie "Siege"
You see they had the "right" terrorist who knew where the bomb was, so they tortured him for the information.
He died. He was innocent.
Thankfully, much of the abusive behavior, that was filmed or uncovered has ended. I hope.
B, That stands for Before Bush. Before we had an Attorney General who sort of upheld torture.
Before we had decided that these people we pick up, do not fall under our civilized rules of behavior.
Enemy combatant, terrorist whatever names you call them, remember money was paid for turning people in.
I hope you are all just letting off steam and don`t really support torture.
Posted by on September 14, 2007 06:37 PMANONYMOUS at a long freakin time ago and the other guy who gave a figure claiming that 50% of 6 billion was trying to enter this country: Like I said it isn't even CLOSE to reality.
Current trends show that most people are migrating to and within European borders. America is being left in the dust.
Posted by Sheila on September 14, 2007 10:59 PMthe Irish, my poor people.
Posted by Sharon B. on September 15, 2007 02:49 AMBango Skank,
Just use the buzz-words, "National Security", and anything goes for the War-Is-Wonderful-and-Shooting-People-Is-Fun (Republican) Party, and its faithful followers. Don't bother wasting your time trying to find sense, or sensibility there, much less offering any for consideration.
The editorial page today (Saturday 09/15/07) has excellent cartoons, aptly and accurately illustrating the whole Republican "program" for, and in, Iraq - both on the RMN side and on the Denver Post side of the page in our combined weekend edition of the two papers.
It might even be on the Internet version.
Posted by Old Grouch on September 15, 2007 11:02 AMCan't we just make a buck on these people, for the sake of a "free enterprise and liberty " (and corporate socialism) and dispense with their questions?
(Charles B and OG , that's supposed be facetious)
Posted by Stan Broyles on September 15, 2007 07:00 PMCan't we just make a buck on these people, for the sake of a "free enterprise and liberty " (and corporate socialism) and dispense with their questions?
(Charles B and OG , that's supposed be facetious)
Posted by Stan Broyles on September 15, 2007 07:00 PMI think it's very easy to determine if waterboarding, for example, is torture or not.
Simply offer to do it to a person who claims it isn't with the agreement that it stops if they break and claim that it is.
I challenge anybody who claims it isn't to undergo a single 10 minute session of waterboarding.
Come on bravehearts, 10 minutes, no problem for a tough guy.
Right?
Letter writer Larry Walsh writes that the whole world is laughing at Bush.Well I just want Larry to understand that Osama Bin Laden and his terrorist friends are laughing at Larry and his Democrat friends.The reason they are laughing is because you are helping them win the war in Iraq.Bin Laden finds it hilarious that you guys would be so stupid.
Posted by An American on September 16, 2007 11:28 AMOsama Bin Laden is laughing real hard at Bango Skank.While Osama and his friends are chopping off peoples heads and killing women and children ,intentionally, Skank is trying to stop us from "waterboarding" the terrorists.I can hear Osama laughing right now.
Posted by An American on September 16, 2007 11:48 AM”Osama Bin Laden is laughing real hard at Bango Skank”
I find it curious that you claim to know what bin Laden is doing right now, I think you need to be waterboarded to find out what else you know about him.
I suspect you are right though, bin Laden probably does find the whole thing amusing, he has got America to abandon pretty much everything it claimed to stand for, and he has had a recruiting bonanza as a result.
Here’s a factoid for you speedo; torture lies at the heart of what gave rise to bin Laden’s strength. Qutb was radicalized after being tortured, and from Qutb you eventually get bin Laden.
The Buddhists I talk to say this is Karma, but I would like to get your professional opinion – do you think torture is moral, does it yield satisfactory outcomes, and do previously tortured people tend to become more peaceful and amiable as a result?
Watcha say, speedo?
ps. I don't mind if he laughs at me, I do it myself on a daily basis.
Posted by Bango Skank on September 16, 2007 04:01 PMbango skanko.There is a cure for your cancer like disease,liberalism.Through proper education,hopefully in my lifetime.You just like all liberals have a addiction to ignorance.
Posted by Keith on September 16, 2007 09:13 PMKeith responded with "bango skanko.There is a cure for your cancer like disease,liberalism.Through proper education,hopefully in my lifetime.You just like all liberals have a addiction to ignorance."
hmmm ... so is that a yes or a no to the moral standing of torture and it's results?
I can’t quite tell.
I think liberalism is a valid curative for ignorance, after all, it is liberalism that questions the status quo and seeks new ideas, whereas conservatism accepts received wisdom and status quo and seeks to entrench it and protect it.
Since you obviously think differently, perhaps you would like to explain what the conservative view is on innovation and education. For example, should education require students to question received wisdom, and should some areas be “off limits” or can anything be questioned?