November 24, 2008 11:49 AM
Jeff Legwold on the Broncos-Raiders game
Mark_Wolf I was traveling all day yesterday and didn't see a score until it popped up on a TV screen. Good heavens, what happened?
Jeff_Legwold The Broncos said all week they weren't taking the Raiders lightly and then played as if they took the Raiders lightly.
Cutler6 joined.
Mark_Wolf From KHClinton: Bad calls....that was a legitimate pass interference call. You can't impede the receiver. You want bad calls, what about the not one but two roughing the passer calls. Those where garabage calls that helped the Broncos score on one drive and almost on the other. Yes I am a Raider fan and am shocked that we came in beat you guys. It was good for us and we needed it. The good news for you guys is that you will still when this horrible weak division and are still playoff bound. You guy's better get it together however if you want to go anywhere though. Here is a quick question for you Denver fans. Your coach gave a lot of praise to our star corner back who is a free agent next year. Is Denver making a play for Asmougha?
Mark_Wolf Welcome Cutler 6.
lv_john joined.
Jeff_Legwold The Broncos won't be as active in free agency as they have in the past years, at least if they stick to what they've said in recent months, but if Asomugha makes it into the market, given the demand for corners, the line will be long to sign him and it will form quickly.
Mark_Wolf Is home field advantage vanishing?
Mark_Wolf Welcome lv_john. what's on your mind?
kurtz joined.
Jeff_Legwold It has a lot of places around the league. people always talk about the new stadiums with club seats and psls and the prices in general and how it keeps the mainstream fan out and lets more people more interested in attending the game rather than sort of participating in it. Good teams still win a lot at home, though. Broncos were 8-0 at home in '05 and they were a pretty good team that year.
kurtz Any whispers around the Broncos that this could be Shanahan's final season?
lv_john left.
Cutler6 I have to say, I supported Shanahan for a long time, but his act is truly wearing thin, and all the ratonalizing and denial isn't making this team any better. It may be time for him to move on
Jeff_Legwold No. Nobody's happy with the way things are going, including shanahan, but he's still owed a lot of money on his contract and Pat Bowlen hasn't pointed toward any change in some time. I don't think their five losses are all coaching. coaching doesn't miss two field goals, coaches don't fumble and coaches don't complete less than 50 percent of their passes. There is plenty of blame for Shanahan because he's the guy in charge, but it's wrong to say it's all him at this point. The biggest mistake the Broncos have made, in my mind, are not deciding on a defensive scheme and building a roster to it, instead of trying to fit the guys they have instead of the scheme they want to play.
Cutler6 I agree with that Jeff, but Mike S. seems to be right in the thick of things when it comes to being impatient with defense, from caochs to players, and unfortunately it hasn't worked very well for several years. That shows me that Mike may be losing his ability to be flexable and self aware as a coa
Jeff_Legwold People talk about his act. What any coach says publicly, from the podium after the game, is not usually how he deals with things behind the scenes. Shanahan hasn't lost any fire, just watching people around the building walk on eggshells already today is proof of that. And you can't just scream at people all the time. I've covered plenty of coaches who yelled, hit players on the helmet, did all of the "enthusiastic'' things people like to see and the players hated that more than anything else. Truth is a head coach is only as good as he can make his team around a franchise quarterback. Chuck noll won no super bowls without terry bradshaw, paul brown won no championships without otto graham, jimmy johnson won no super bowls without troy aikman and bill walsh won no super bowls without joe montana. Just a fact of life.
Mark_Wolf I'm spending the week in a small town in Indiana, which is hugely Colts-centric and quite happy this morning. Can't imagine anybody's much happier about what happened on the last play of the Colts-Chargers game than the folks at Dove Valley.
Mark_Wolf The Broncos have a two-game lead on the Chargers but trail them in both division and conference records. How worried should Broncos be about the Chargers down the stretch.
Jeff_Legwold left.
Jeff_Legwold joined.
Jeff_Legwold Got booted, now i'm back....
xrace77 joined.
Mark_Wolf Jeff, don't know if you were offline when these were posted:Mark_Wolf: I'm spending the week in a small town in Indiana, which is hugely Colts-centric and quite happy this morning. Can't imagine anybody's much happier about what happened on the last play of the Colts-Chargers game than the folks at Dove Valley. Mark_Wolf: The Broncos have a two-game lead on the Chargers but trail them in both division and conference records. How worried should Broncos be about the Chargers down the stretch?
russhughes joined.
Arn joined.
Jeff_Legwold Chargers schedule is pretty rugged with atlanta and tampa bay still on there and the pressure building on Norv Turner. However, the Broncos have bigger things to worry about the next four weeks before they finish the regular season in san diego.
southstander joined.
hross joined.
russhughes left.
southstander left.
Mark_Wolf welcome all to the chat with Jeff Legwold. What on your minds?
Cutler6 If the past is any indication of the future, I think the broncos should be very worried. I can envison a senario that the Broncos put themselves in whereby they have a 1 game lead going inot that last game against the Chargers, and get served up. At this point I don't truly know what benifit it woul
_SouthStander joined.
hross left.
Jeff_Legwold With a two-game lead and four remaining before the two teams play the chargers would have to go 4-0 while the broncos 2-2 to make that game mean something. some would say with carolina and the jets on the docket the broncos will have a hard time going 2-2 in that span, but the chances of the chargers going 4-0 over that span are fairly small.
Arn When that fan ran onto the field yesterday why didn't they give him a uniform. More passion than most of the Broncos displayed.
_SouthStander Denver and San Diego will both end up 8-8. San Diego will win the division since we can't seem to win a game in the division...
kurtz If San Diego goes 3-1 and Denver goes 2-2, then the final game in San Diego will decide the division because the Chargers could win the division with a tie.
Jeff_Legwold I know losses are hard to watch, but standing in front of the players every day i think most of them care plenty how they play. the broncos are simply not good enough on defense right now or consistent enough on offense to win as much as people would like. i do like that they finally have started to build from within, in the draft, and with something like 19 picks already in the next two drafts, there is significant opportunity for them to improve if they can maintain some discipline in the offseason about who they throw money around to.
Arn Jeff, I concur with you about coaching, but it's troubling when players show up so flat for a game that could have tipped their season very positively. Can coaches really motivate players anymore?
dillybar joined.
_SouthStander I agree Arn. Once they fumbled that ball it was OVER. Even Graham was quoted as saying that took the wind out of their sails.
Mark_Wolf Welcome dillybar - although we prefer Blizzards. What's on your mind?
Jeff_Legwold i'm not sure people who aren't motivated to try their best at anything in life can be pushed only by outside forces. the key in football is to get as many guys who push themselves as possible and don't get caught up trying to be famous before they play well.
dillybar so what do the broncos gotta do to bet the jets?
_SouthStander Score a LOT of points...
dillybar yeah
Arn Maybe the NFL should institute a no-celebrating-for-rookies rule.
Jeff_Legwold Stop thomas jones first, block kris jenkins second and get some pressure on favre third.
dillybar but who knows what team is gonna show up
ty joined.
kdog joined.
_SouthStander exactly. at least if they were bad ALL the time we could write them off as young, injured, blah blah blah. that's what makes them SO frustrating to watch.
xrace77 left.
dillybar is champ going to be back?
_SouthStander they say he is
dillybar heys my main qestion though.
Jeff_Legwold young kids don't always do what they're supposed to, either on the playground or in the nfl, another fact of life. but better to be building a young team than trying to win with an older one. colts went 13-3 in '07 having lost the most games to starters by injury in the league and in their final game still played 20 starters who had never played for another team. that's how you build for consistency in the nfl.
_SouthStander he was supposed to play this week and last week too
dillybar does anyone want to see denver in the Playoffs?
_SouthStander NO
RAGINBRONC joined.
Jeff_Legwold Champ was not supposed to play last week or sunday, he was going to try, but most guys I've seen with that injury wouldn't even be practicing at this point. It will be close for him to play this week.
_SouthStander we will be humiliated by a wild card team. plus, i don't want to have to pay for tickets to see it...
dillybar Yeah, but if the went undefeated the rest of the way that could mean good news. but its like the rockies "IF"
Arn Jeff, what do you make of all the dropped passes? Concentration?
ssc joined.
RAGINBRONC HEY GUYS, I'M DOWN HERE IN LOUISIANA. WHAT ARE THE ODDS THAT SHANNY BECOMES THE GM NEXT YEAR AND HIS FIRST HIRE IS COWHER AS HEAD COACH?
Jeff_Legwold Exactly. guys turning their eyes upfield before they've secured the ball.
Cutler6 Playoffs, are for teams that play the best and deserve to compete against the best, right now the Broncos are neither
Jeff_Legwold bill cowher wants huge money to coach and pushed out a GM in pittsburgh in his time there. not a likely scenario. watch the browns and cowher, plenty of local pressure there to hire him where he played as a player and started as an assistant coach.
dillybar Jeff, do you think the Broncos will make the Playoffs?
RAGINBRONC IS IT ONLY ME, OR DOES IT LOOK LIKE MIKE HAS LOST THIS TEAM?
Jeff_Legwold it would be difficult for them not to win the division at this point unless they lost their remaining five games and the chargers show a little more than they have in recent weeks.
Jeff_Legwold Had he lost them in atlanta?
_SouthStander who are they going to beat?
kdog left.
dr_j joined.
Jeff_Legwold if they lose to the chiefs, you may be on to something.
RAGINBRONC IT DOESN'T MATTER. TO BE THE BRONCOS OF OLD, WE HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF BUSINESS AT HOME, ESP. AGAINST A ROOKIE HEAD COACH, A ROOKIE QB, AND A ROOKIE RB.
Jeff_Legwold You are raging. Russell is not a rookie.
_SouthStander But he's no Petyon Manning either. Do you know how many times we yelled IN-COM-PLETE yesterday? ONE!!!
RAGINBRONC HENCE MY NAME I GUESS
_SouthStander lol
Mark_Wolf I understand the emotion of "We don't want them in the playoffs" but do you seriously want to disregard a team that seems to play better on the road than they do at home in a one-and-done situation?
Goobzilla joined.
dr_j left.
Mark_Wolf More for the group than for Jeff
_SouthStander If they make the playoffs, won't the first game be at HOME?
Jeff_Legwold as a division winner they would play at home and right now that would be one of the 7-4 teams coming in -- baltimore, new england or indy, depending on the tiebreakers.
RAGINBRONC WHO'S FAULT DOES IT FALL TO WHEN WE DO SHOW UP IN ATLANTA BUT LAY AN EGG AT HOME? IF I LIVED THERE AND WENT TO GAMES , I WOULD WANT SOME ANSWERS.
Cutler6 This goes back to what we have seen of the Nuggets the last several years and the undeniable outcome. Teams in any sport play the seaon,playoffs to win the championship. Not every team will, but at least you want your team to be competative enough to challenge for that and the Broncos clearly are no
Mark_Wolf Was thinking more generally of how they've beaten teams they should have had trouble beating.
Goobzilla left.
_SouthStander and we would beat which one of them at home??? sorry to be so negative - i bleed orange and blue, have had season tickets in my family since 1970 and am just MAD this morning! :-)
Arn left.
chazz_manea joined.
Jeff_Legwold answers are two missed field goals, a fumble on the 7 to open the game, allowing a punt return for a touchdown. the line between good and bad in the nfl isn't that thick. they were flat, but that happens. this team struggles to overcome from its mistakes. some of that is coaching, but some of that is simply their key players not making something happen when they need it as well.
ssc jeff, if you were coach, would you play webster or larsen when webster's available. also, what is paymah doing in practice to keep getting in the doghouse? what do you think of paymah as fs since he's been tackling well and isn't far from good size froor the position
Jeff_Legwold i think this team is going to have a hard time not keeping woodyard on the field and he can only play the weak side at the moment. so they may have to consider putting d.j. back in the middle and keep woodyard in when everybody is healthy. they seem committed to larsen at the moment, but they're still considering everything. but the fact they are ready to sign a fullback in andrew pinnock over the next couple days if his knee checks out shows they want larsen to concentrate on defense a little bit.
Jeff_Legwold paymah is big for a corner, but would be small for a free safety.
_SouthStander is larsen okay? i don't think he came back into the game yesterday after getting injured...
ssc woodyard reminds me of gold, undersized but great motor and olid tackling. paymah can pack on 20 lbs!
Jeff_Legwold he says he's ok, but he took a shot on that knee and he may miss a little time. but won't know for sure until they get back on the field wednesday.
_SouthStander yikes - that would hurt if we lost him....
ssc paymah's not smaller than rogers and mccree, is he?
Jay_Cutler joined.
haymaker joined.
blah joined.
Jeff_Legwold no, but built a little differently and a free safety's ball skills are a little different too. they play facing the ball a lot and monitor both sides of the field a lot of the time. some corners have made the move to safety -- like rod woodson and ronnie lott -- but they has superior instincts and ball skills to go with great anticipation.
Jay_Cutler How many of you think broncos are going to win this week to the jets ?
_SouthStander I think if the offense shows up, they can win.
cmaddog1 joined.
kurtz the way this season has gone, I would not be shocked if they went in and beat the Jets. nothing makes sense at this point.
RAGINBRONC HOW BOUT IF THE D SHOWS UP WE CAN WIN...
ssc opponents seem to be having some success playing press against broncs wrs. what's the solution.
randy2008 joined.
Jay_Cutler you guys think next year is denver year ?
_SouthStander we don't have a D. Offense is going to have to outscore their offense. End of story.
RAGINBRONC WERE ARE GETTING TO BE KNOWN AS "THE ENVER BRONCOS"
cmaddog1 Maybe the Broncos read too much of the press clippings the 2 weeks before the Raiders game.
_SouthStander lol
Metrunners joined.
_SouthStander i guess i didn't understand the play calling yesterday
Jeff_Legwold receivers have to get off the bump. the raiders didn't do anything exotic, but the broncos receivers didn't consistently make themselves some room. marshall hasn't had a 100-yard game since september.
Metrunners what's been tough to watch is that this team can't run the ball, it's all good that Jay can throw the ball 40-50 yards down field, but that doesn't mean anything if we can run the ball to set up the pass
Jeff_Legwold hard to call plays when you have a fullback at running back and tatum bell, who was working at the mall two weeks ago. they'd run more, but don't have the people at this point. they're hoping young can get back on the field at some point.
Jay_Cutler if we do get to the payoff do you think we will win round 1 ?
_SouthStander yesterday they ran pretty well, but the passing game seemed to consist of throwing the long ball. and it wasn't working.
_SouthStander nope
Metrunners that's a good point, the way to go about that is to draft a RB and to stick with him
randy2008 left.
Jay_Cutler i love the way how hilli payed
_SouthStander jeff - do you think Young is the answer?
RAGINBRONC JEFF, DON'T YOU THINK OUR O-LINE IS MORE PASS BLOCKING ORIENTED. WE HAD RB'S EARLY IN THE YEAR AND STILL HAD TROUBLE KEEPING DEFENSES HONEST...
Jay_Cutler yeasterday
commonsense07 joined.
Jeff_Legwold cutler's next hurdle will be to take the underneath stuff when it's there. like every young guy with a big arm he wants to blast it down the field, but the raiders corners were just turing and running and didn't have to stop doing that because the broncos didn't make them have to stop by working the short to intermediate stuff more.
_SouthStander exactly
Jeff_Legwold they're movement oriented because of the emphasis on smaller guys who can move. most personnel guys will say that they are getting pushed sometimes inside at the two guard spots. when they struggle it's usually when the guards haven't stonewalled their guys, at least that's how opposing defensive coordinators see it right now.
Metrunners great point ... that could have been uesful I think the first or second drive in the second half when Jay went for the homerun on three consecutive plays ... throw it short or even try the screen pass
Jay_Cutler next year what do you guys think we need to draft ? RB ? SS ? FS ? DT ? DE ? CB ? ???????????????
Jeff_Legwold that's the big step for a quarterback making his way, using the whole field.
Jeff_Legwold Appreciate the questions everybody, I have to go. thanks again.
ssc speaking of the guards, i feel like hamilton fell off a cliff like lepsis last year. understand he's coming off the concussions, but he seems like a really weak link.
Cutler6 left.
RAGINBRONC left.
Jay_Cutler BYE JEFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF
ssc thanks jeff
commonsense07 my vote is to draft a safety
Mark_Wolf Thanks Jeff for his time and thanks for all the excellent input. We'll leave the room open if you want to talk among yourselves.
ssc left.
_SouthStander thanks and GO BRONCOS!!!
Jay_Cutler i think we need a cb and rb and a DT
cmaddog1 left.
_SouthStander left.
commonsense07 perhaps - i agree on the CB and RB but man - our middle is so soft too
Jay_Cutler TRUE
commonsense07 since losing Al Wilson it hasn't been the same on the LB's
commonsense07 and personally I think Bly is overrated and a bust
Jay_Cutler i miss AL
commonsense07 I think Elam was a better tackler than Bly
Join the discussion