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January 30, 2009 8:45 AM

Should children of illegal immigrants pay in-state tuition?

One of the legislature's hottest button issues is bubbling back up in the form of another attempt to allow the children of illegal immigrants who aren't citizens to qualify for in-state tuition.

Sen. Chris Romer (D-Denver) introduces the bill today and he's already lined up the support of some prominent Republicans, reports Lynn Bartels.

Dick Monfort, a Weld County cattleman and chairman of the University of Northern Colorado Board of Trustees, said tough economic times require a "forward-thinking" education policy.

"Opening educational opportunity for more of our high school graduates means our state will have a more developed work force down the road, and will be able to attract more high-growth industries," he said in a statement.

To be eligible for the reduced tuition, undocumented students would have to have graduated from a Colorado high school or received their GED within the past five years. They also must have been enrolled in a Colorado public or private high school for at least three years.

"If you were to ask the citizens of Colorado what they feel, they would be adamantly opposed to it, probably 85 percent," said Sen. Dave Schultheis, R-Colorado Springs. "We're supposed to be representing the people of Colorado. What are we doing running bills they don't want?"

But Romer likely will pick up more high-profile GOP support.

Alex Cranberg
, Aspect Energy chairman, said he backs the in-state tuition idea, but wants to read the bill before signing on.

Cranberg is a high-profile donor for Republican candidates and an education advocate who said there are several reasons college should be more affordable for all students.

"All people who live in Colorado are paying sales and real estate taxes and most are having income taxes deducted from their paychecks," he said. "Therefore they are entitled to some level of services."

Is it time to let the children of illegal immigrants pay in-state tuition? Is it fair to penalize older children if their younger siblings were born here and qualify for in-state tuition?



Discussion

  • January 30, 2009

    9:24 AM

    Truth writes:

    Expecting a meltdown from Shaggy and Ben - Raving bigot, in
    3,


    2,


    1...

  • January 30, 2009

    9:27 AM

    GenBalthus writes:

    No, they should not even be eligible to go to college in this country if it is proven their parents are illegal aliens.

    Deport them ALL. Quit screwing the American taxpayer to shower gifts on these societal parasites.

  • January 30, 2009

    9:28 AM

    GenBalthus writes:

    No, they should not even be eligible to go to college in this country if it is proven their parents are illegal aliens.

    Deport them ALL. Quit screwing the American taxpayer to shower gifts on these societal parasites.

    Alex Cranberg: GET OUT OF MY PARTY YOU DESPICABLE RiNO AND SHOVE YOUR MONEY WHERE THE SUN DON'T SHINE.

  • January 30, 2009

    9:31 AM

    Jimminy writes:

    Not just no,H*ll,no.Illegals have no presumption of residence anywhere in the US;neither do their children.

  • January 30, 2009

    9:36 AM

    Shaggy writes:

    "Should children of illegal immigrants pay in-state tuition?"

    No, they should not have to pay.
    They should be deported along with their illegal parents!

    Maybe if we got rid of ohh lets say 20 Million Illegals, jobs will free up for law abiding Citizens.

    Why is it that Democrats love to reward bad behavior and punish good behavior.

    They want to bail out Banks that were poorly ran.
    They want to bail out the Auto biz that can't compete because of Unions, another failed Democrat pet project.
    They want to take from those who work hard and prosper and give to those who are lazy and have less ambition.

    Then not only do they not punish the execs that ran the banks and mortgage companies in the ground, Obama puts them in charge of the monetary system at the Federal level.

  • January 30, 2009

    9:38 AM

    Jimminy writes:

    Not just no,H*ll,no.Illegals have no presumption of residence anywhere in the US;neither do their children.

  • January 30, 2009

    9:51 AM

    SASQUATCH writes:

    I don't care about the legal/illegal status of the parents--they aren't the ones going to school. If the kids are here legally, and they enjoy legal status, then its obviously in-state tuition. If the kids are illegal, then at best its out-of-state at the very minimum. Illegal kids, along with their illegal parents, should all get the boot.

    The question is very poorly phrased.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:05 AM

    tbizzy writes:

    I moved to Colorado from out of state to attend college. Before I started college I got a Colorado drivers license, a job paying Colorado State Income taxes, and a Colorado residence. I also legally emancipated myself from my parents, providing 100% of my support for room, board, food, and tuition.

    The first three years of my residency in Colorado, I was denied in-state residency, even though I was legally a Colorado resident. I was told that it was likely that I would take my degree and leave the state, with no intention to work in Colorado after my graduation. Part of this was complicated when I took an internship out of state, even though I continued to file and pay Colorado State Income taxes, had my car registered in Colorado, and even paid rent on my Colorado address while I was away.

    I have since lived in Colorado 10 years past my graduation (15 years total now).

    Why should someone who is not a legal resident of the state paying State Income Taxes get a break? I guess my skin tone was too light to be considered for any special treatment while I went through the process honestly and legally.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:10 AM

    tbizzy writes:

    I moved to Colorado from out of state to attend college. Before I started college I got a Colorado drivers license, a job paying Colorado State Income taxes, and a Colorado residence. I also legally emancipated myself from my parents, providing 100% of my support for room, board, food, and tuition.

    The first three years of my residency in Colorado, I was denied in-state residency, even though I was legally a Colorado resident. I was told that it was likely that I would take my degree and leave the state, with no intention to work in Colorado after my graduation. Part of this was complicated when I took an internship out of state, even though I continued to file and pay Colorado State Income taxes, had my car registered in Colorado, and even paid rent on my Colorado address while I was away.

    I have since lived in Colorado 10 years past my graduation (15 years total now).

    Why should someone who is not a legal resident of the state paying State Income Taxes get a break? I guess my skin tone was too light to be considered for any special treatment while I went through the process honestly and legally.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:20 AM

    tbizzy writes:

    I moved to Colorado from out of state to attend college. Before I started college I got a Colorado drivers license, a job paying Colorado State Income taxes, and a Colorado residence. I also legally emancipated myself from my parents, providing 100% of my support for room, board, food, and tuition.

    The first three years of my residency in Colorado, I was denied in-state residency, even though I was legally a Colorado resident. I was told that it was likely that I would take my degree and leave the state, with no intention to work in Colorado after my graduation. Part of this was complicated when I took an internship out of state, even though I continued to file and pay Colorado State Income taxes, had my car registered in Colorado, and even paid rent on my Colorado address while I was away.

    I have since lived in Colorado 10 years past my graduation (15 years total now).

    Why should someone who is not a legal resident of the state paying State Income Taxes get a break? I guess my skin tone was too light to be considered for any special treatment while I went through the process honestly and legally.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:23 AM

    freemarketworks writes:

    If the University knows that an applicant is the offspring of illegal aliens, do the officials of the University have the obligation to report those parents to I.C.E.? Just saying…

    In the case of in-state-tuition for the offspring of illegal aliens, I say “maybe.? If a University can’t fill all of its spots for out-of-state and in-state applicants and it can’t bring more out-of-state applicants to fill un-filled in-state spots, then maybe the University could consider offering in-state tuition to those qualified offspring of illegal aliens.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:31 AM

    wow writes:

    Your'e joking. Right? Well, it isn't funny.
    If they want to even attend college, in this or any other state, an undocumented alien should be required to get documents. Legal ones.
    If you come here for college (legitimately) from another country, you have to have a visa, and pay out of state tuition.
    Why should an illegal alien recieve preferential treatment?
    How about you people start advocating for enforcement of the law, rather than for disobedience of it?
    If not that, then at least consider the "fairness" of your actions.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:34 AM

    fiesty writes:

    Let me get this right.. As a legal U.S. citizen, and a veteran, if I go to another state I have to pay out of state tuition. And they want to give in-state tuition to someone who is not a U.S. citizen and is breaking the law? I don't think so! It's bills and laws like these, giving benefits to illegals, which is an incentive to be here! Obey our laws, follow our immigration procedures, and we will welcome you with open arms. Break our laws, and you should not expect to be rewarded for it.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:35 AM

    Richard writes:

    If the children of bank robbers are allowed in-state tuition, then the children of illegal aliens should get the same benefit. We cannot discriminate based upon race, creed, religion or nature of the crime.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:45 AM

    fiesty writes:

    Richard- big difference. If the children are legal citizens, fine, let them attend school as legal residents. However, if they are NOT legal citizens, then they have no business being here. It has nothing to do with the crimes of the parents, but their legal status.

  • January 30, 2009

    10:54 AM

    mojambo writes:

    Good idea!

    The higher education system is facing one of the biggest financial shortfalls in the state - let's take revenue away.

    Ranks right up there with The 'Bammers body blow to the car industry last week.


  • January 30, 2009

    10:55 AM

    mojambo writes:

    Good idea!

    The higher education system is facing one of the biggest financial shortfalls in the state - let's take revenue away.

    Ranks right up there with The 'Bammers body blow to the car industry last week.


  • January 30, 2009

    10:56 AM

    PajamaPulitzer writes:

    Shaggy for President Babe!

  • January 30, 2009

    10:57 AM

    theQ writes:

    NO...WHAT PART OF NO IS MISSUNDERSTOOD? THE AMERICAN PEOPLE ARE TIRED OF THESE RACIST ..ME ME ME..OUR RACR OUR RACE..CRIMINALS OUT OF THE COUNTRY...DO YOU UNDERSTAND STUPID?

  • January 30, 2009

    10:59 AM

    theQ writes:

    NO...WHAT PART OF NO IS MISSUNDERSTOOD? THE AMERICAN PEOPLE ARE TIRED OF THESE RACIST ..ME ME ME..OUR RACR OUR RACE..CRIMINALS OUT OF THE COUNTRY...DO YOU UNDERSTAND STUPID?

  • January 30, 2009

    11:01 AM

    FRN4U writes:

    No. Illegal is illegal. Want to change the dictionary?

  • January 30, 2009

    11:09 AM

    zeezil writes:

    In state tuition for illegal aliens is not fair to American citizen students and legal resident students. As you should know, the tuition charged to a student, whether in-state or out of state does not cover the total cost of that student's education. There are taxpayer dollars subsidizing the remainder of the costs.

    Another issue at hand is contravention of a 1996 federal law that prohibits any state from offering in-state tuition rates to illegal aliens unless the state also offers in-state tuition rates to all U.S. citizens. This, obviously, is another law regarding illegals that our federal government doesn't enforce.

    On top of that, this sends a message to foreign nationals to get their kids into America for a free public education and to top it off, special tuition benefits in college.

    Stopping providence of any tuition assistance to illegal aliens is essential. It will send a message that the little tricks legislators use to dupe the American people will no longer work. It will also prove to the illegals that American citizens are no longer asleep at the wheel, are fed up with our tax dollars going to services for illegal aliens, and that their special request trickery will be turned back by responsible citizens.

  • January 30, 2009

    11:19 AM

    Shaggy writes:

    Hey Truth,
    Please tell me what makes me or Ben a bigot?
    Wouldn't someone have to be racist to be a bigot?

  • January 30, 2009

    11:20 AM

    zeezil writes:

    In state tuition for illegal aliens is not fair to American citizen students and legal resident students. As you should know, the tuition charged to a student, whether in-state or out of state does not cover the total cost of that student's education. There are taxpayer dollars subsidizing the remainder of the costs.

    Another issue at hand is contravention of a 1996 federal law that prohibits any state from offering in-state tuition rates to illegal aliens unless the state also offers in-state tuition rates to all U.S. citizens. This, obviously, is another law regarding illegals that our federal government doesn't enforce.

    On top of that, this sends a message to foreign nationals to get their kids into America for a free public education and to top it off, special tuition benefits in college.

    Stopping providence of any tuition assistance to illegal aliens is essential. It will send a message that the little tricks legislators use to dupe the American people will no longer work. It will also prove to the illegals that American citizens are no longer asleep at the wheel, are fed up with our tax dollars going to services for illegal aliens, and that their special request trickery will be turned back by responsible citizens.

  • January 30, 2009

    11:21 AM

    Cynical Observer writes:

    No. They should go to college in their home countries. It's not like we have too few college grads, we have too many already. Build a well, deport them all.

  • January 30, 2009

    11:25 AM

    Iceman7 writes:

    Shaggy and SAS,

    Good points gents....

    How about if the state enforces larger penalties on known companies that benefit from illegal labor. I bet that would force these companies to not only hire legal workers but to be more cautious as to who they hire. Why should tax payers have to pay the bills for companies that benefit from illegal labor? I tell you this is an economics problem. Get after the Demand side with harder enforcement and penalities...

    No work, no money = lets go home. This is proving to be true in this economy.

    If illegal immigrants go home on their own this would further save tax dollars on deportation costs.

  • January 30, 2009

    11:45 AM

    theQ writes:

    NO....WHAT PART OF NO DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND? THE AMERICAN PEOPLE ARE TIRED OF THESE RACIST CRIMINALS.

  • January 30, 2009

    11:50 AM

    zeezil writes:

    Illegals receiving in-state tuition rates clearly discriminates against U.S. citizens and law-abiding foreign students who cannot. This is the first step in the goal of making illegals eligible for grants and student loans, in addition to favorable racial status awarded. This obviously, will displace legal residents and American citizens from colleges and severely reduce the available pool of grants and loans. Some may think that there are unlimited seats available to fill in colleges. The truth is, for every admission of an illegal alien to college, an American student is denied because of the limited seats available. The last time I checked, going to college was not a “job Americans wont’ do.?

  • January 30, 2009

    12:04 PM

    Independent writes:

    It's bad policy because it rewards a small number of people based on a dubious qualification (being the dependent of a person here illegally). It is discriminatory on it's face and racist if we use the common definition posed by the illegal immigrants themselves.

    Hell No.

  • January 30, 2009

    12:06 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    Dick Monfort, a Weld County cattleman and chairman of the University of Northern Colorado Board of Trustees, said tough economic times require a "forward-thinking" education policy.
    "Opening educational opportunity for more of our high school graduates means our state will have a more developed work force down the road, and will be able to attract more high-growth industries," he said in a statement.

    --------
    What he means is Montfort has all the illegal unskilled workers it needs, and some educated illegals would be nice!
    Talk about a fox in the hen-house!
    This is such BS I don't even know where to start.
    So let me just reiterate what every one else has said.
    No, it isn't fair, it's illegal, immoral, unethical and downright damaging to allow illegal aliens entrance, much less preferred status for our colleges.
    Jeeze, will somebody please wake these jokers up?

  • January 30, 2009

    12:07 PM

    wow writes:

    Dick Monfort, a Weld County cattleman and chairman of the University of Northern Colorado Board of Trustees, said tough economic times require a "forward-thinking" education policy.
    "Opening educational opportunity for more of our high school graduates means our state will have a more developed work force down the road, and will be able to attract more high-growth industries," he said in a statement.

    --------
    What he means is Montfort has all the illegal unskilled workers it needs, and some educated illegals would be nice!
    Talk about a fox in the hen-house!
    This is such BS I don't even know where to start.
    So let me just reiterate what every one else has said.
    No, it isn't fair, it's illegal, immoral, unethical and downright damaging to allow illegal aliens entrance, much less preferred status for our colleges.
    Jeeze, will somebody please wake these jokers up?

  • January 30, 2009

    12:08 PM

    GenBalthus writes:

    Any non-citizen who attends a university or college in the US should be charged DOUBLE what citizens are charged.

    NO non-citizen should receive ANY type of financial aid to attend American colleges.

    American higher education should be for Americans only. You want to come here to go to school? Fine. Come into our country LEGALLY, on a TEMPORARY student visa, pay double what citizens pay because you don't pay taxes like citizens do but you enjoy the fruits of OUR labors, and the cost of your education does not represent the true cost to the taxpayer.

    LEGAL immigrants who are not citizens should pay 150% of a citizen's costs to go to school.

    ALL subsidies of non-citizens should stop IMMEDIATELY. I am so tired of seeing crowds of foreign students choking the financial aid offices of our institutes of higher learning.

    In-State tuition levels FOR CITIZENS ONLY.

  • January 30, 2009

    12:11 PM

    the_ripper writes:

    I give up, just let them go to college for free.

  • January 30, 2009

    12:12 PM

    Lisa1165 writes:

    No! They are not legal residents of the state. They're not even legal residents of the country! They should pay foreign student rates like all the other foreign students. Americans in 49 other states can't get in-state tuition rates here, so why even discuss letting illegals get it. They're not wanted here and should be deported!

  • January 30, 2009

    12:25 PM

    Ben-Native American writes:

    Of course not. This type of carrot should have ended in 1986 with the Immigration Reform Act of 1986. I guess it is going to have to take a full-blown depression to end illegal immigration into this country, our government and our Representative won't end it. Geez it's not like American citizens don't have children to feed.


  • January 30, 2009

    12:55 PM

    Ben-Seen that fraud on the border for 20 years writes:

    "Dick Monfort, a Weld County cattleman and chairman of the University of Northern Colorado Board of Trustees, said tough economic times require a "forward-thinking" education policy."

    Here is a forward thinking education policy: Beef. It's not what's for Dinner

  • January 30, 2009

    2:02 PM

    KW writes:

    Well at least it seems unanimous here. One other point to ponder though...

    Aren't all the "Immigration Reform" (whatever that means) folks always going on and on about how we need to stop the employers from hiring illegals rather than arresting illegals?

    So following that line of thinking, what good will an education do these kids if there aren't any employers who can legally higher them?

    Just food for thought.

  • January 30, 2009

    2:37 PM

    tbizzy writes:

    I moved to Colorado from out of state to attend college. Before I started college I got a Colorado drivers license, a job paying Colorado State Income taxes, and a Colorado residence. I also legally emancipated myself from my parents, providing 100% of my support for room, board, food, and tuition.

    The first three years of my residency in Colorado, I was denied in-state residency, even though I was legally a Colorado resident. I was told that it was likely that I would take my degree and leave the state, with no intention to work in Colorado after my graduation. Part of this was complicated when I took an internship out of state, even though I continued to file and pay Colorado State Income taxes, had my car registered in Colorado, and even paid rent on my Colorado address while I was away.

    I have since lived in Colorado 10 years past my graduation (15 years total now).

    Why should someone who is not a legal resident of the state paying State Income Taxes get a break? I guess my skin tone was too light to be considered for any special treatment while I went through the process honestly and legally.

  • January 30, 2009

    3:15 PM

    tbizzy writes:

    I moved to Colorado from out of state to attend college. Before I started college I got a Colorado drivers license, a job paying Colorado State Income taxes, and a Colorado residence. I also legally emancipated myself from my parents, providing 100% of my support for room, board, food, and tuition.

    The first three years of my residency in Colorado, I was denied in-state residency, even though I was legally a Colorado resident. I was told that it was likely that I would take my degree and leave the state, with no intention to work in Colorado after my graduation. Part of this was complicated when I took an internship out of state, even though I continued to file and pay Colorado State Income taxes, had my car registered in Colorado, and even paid rent on my Colorado address while I was away.

    I have since lived in Colorado 10 years past my graduation (15 years total now).

    Why should someone who is not a legal resident of the state paying State Income Taxes get a break? I guess my skin tone was too light to be considered for any special treatment while I went through the process honestly and legally.

  • January 30, 2009

    3:30 PM

    redwhiteandBLUE writes:

    NO! NO! NO! NO!

  • January 30, 2009

    3:39 PM

    tbizzy writes:

    I moved to Colorado from out of state to attend college. Before I started college I got a Colorado drivers license, a job paying Colorado State Income taxes, and a Colorado residence. I also legally emancipated myself from my parents, providing 100% of my support for room, board, food, and tuition.

    The first three years of my residency in Colorado, I was denied in-state residency, even though I was legally a Colorado resident. I was told that it was likely that I would take my degree and leave the state, with no intention to work in Colorado after my graduation. Part of this was complicated when I took an internship out of state, even though I continued to file and pay Colorado State Income taxes, had my car registered in Colorado, and even paid rent on my Colorado address while I was away.

    I have since lived in Colorado 10 years past my graduation (15 years total now).

    Why should someone who is not a legal resident of the state paying State Income Taxes get a break? I guess my skin tone was too light to be considered for any special treatment while I went through the process honestly and legally.

  • January 30, 2009

    4:33 PM

    Julien Ross writes:

    Tuition equity in Colorado is simple…It is good for our economy, it strengthens our communities and it keeps us competitive among neighboring Western states. Tuition equity legislation creates opportunity for more Colorado students to attend a state college or university regardless of immigration status.

    First, Tuition equity is not a matter of generosity—it is an economic development strategy that will help bolster the state’s economy.

    Second, like Senator Chris Romer notes, the initial investment we make in the education of undocumented students is wasted if talented students do not have the opportunity to pursue higher education and ultimately give back to our state.

    Finally, tuition equity helps keep Colorado’s economy competitive — by providing industries with a well-educated workforce and keeping up with the education policies of other western states.

  • January 30, 2009

    4:50 PM

    Ashley writes:

    It's amazing to see how ignorant people still are in this country. First one talks about them taking taxpayer money... did you not read the question?? "Should the children of illegal immigrants PAY in-state tuition?" And one more thing... stop saying that they are taking our jobs. We all know that the high paying jobs Americans want wont hire illegal immigrants. They do the dirty jobs no one else wants to do. WE spoiled Americans would rather stand on the corner and beg for money than work out in the fields and expose ourselves to dangerous chemicals for dirt cheap!

  • January 30, 2009

    5:02 PM

    Dashley writes:

    Hey Ashley? Don't look now but paying in-state tuition means that the state (hence us taxpayers) pay the difference to keep the colleges going. It's called a subsidy and is reserved for LEGAL state residents.

    DOH!

  • January 30, 2009

    5:07 PM

    It doesn't add up writes:

    Julien, would you mind putting some numbers to the loss the state would experience if we do not give the gift of in-state tuition to children of illegal aliens?

    Is it possible that the number is small and insignificant? Could it be that you and like-minded apologists for illegal aliens want to pose an emotional debate point in the hopes of swaying the softies in the crowd?

  • January 30, 2009

    5:24 PM

    KW writes:

    You people are still missing the main point. What are these people going to do with their educations? It's not as if anyone can hire them... Not legally anyways.

    So the whole notion is a complete waste of their time, the schools time, and the taxpayers money.

  • January 30, 2009

    5:55 PM

    Ben-Former Chile picker writes:

    "WE spoiled Americans would rather stand on the corner and beg for money than work out in the fields and expose ourselves to dangerous chemicals for dirt cheap!"

    Uh Ashley, poor whites black also worked in the fields and factories to build this country to what it is today,...and still do. Point in fact I have every job and illegal alien has done save meat packing.

  • January 30, 2009

    6:00 PM

    Julien Ross writes:

    Tuition equity in Colorado is simple, smart policy…It is good for our economy, it strengthens our communities and it keeps us competitive among neighboring Western states. Tuition equity legislation creates opportunity for more Colorado students to attend a state college or university regardless of immigration status.

    First, Tuition equity is not a matter of generosity—it is an economic development strategy that will help bolster the state’s economy.

    Second, like Senator Chris Romer notes, the initial investment we make in the education of undocumented students is wasted if talented students do not have the opportunity to pursue higher education and ultimately give back to our state.

    Finally, tuition equity helps keep Colorado’s economy competitive — by providing industries with a well-educated workforce and keeping up with the education policies of other western states.

  • January 30, 2009

    6:39 PM

    Milehighguy writes:

    The price of admission is meaningless, when an illegal can't even get a job when they graduate! If the kid is illegal, it doesn't matter if school is free or $1 million, because his education will be useless in this country.

    Cost of education shouldn't have anything to do with the parents status, but should only depend on the student status. If they are legal, they should get the same treatment as everyone else (in-state and out-state) and eventually be able to get a job.

    If the student is illegal, then they should not be allowed to go to school here until they get a student visa. Or, without a visa, they pay double, triple so that the school benefits from educating someone who will take their knowledge back to their home country when they graduate, because they can't get a job here.

  • January 30, 2009

    7:08 PM

    Hogar De Vuelta (العودة) Committing criminal acts should not result in a benefit writes:

    The commission of a criminal act, namely invading a sovereign country, should not result in a benefit for either you or your progeny.

  • January 30, 2009

    9:46 PM

    It Doesn't Add Up writes:

    Thanks for proving my point Julien. You post is nothing but diversionary propaganda.

    I would challenge Chris Romer and anyone who quotes him to do the math and then try to convince us that they are not simply shills for the race bait lobby.

  • January 31, 2009

    6:18 AM

    Ben writes:

    Lou Dobbs Tonight on CNN- in reference to attempts by the U.S. Chanber of Commerce and others(can you believe it?) to kill E-verify, a government program 98.7% effective to insure the hiring of LEGAL workers

    Are you outraged that big business and socio-ethnocentric special interest groups are trying to destroy the most effective government program to fight illegal immigration?
    Yes 97%
    No 3%

  • January 31, 2009

    7:57 AM

    Bush writes:

    Howdy folks

    Whats wrong with having a few of my Saudi buddies
    gitting in state tuition? Heck all they want to do is take some flying lessons.

  • January 31, 2009

    8:33 AM

    KW writes:

    Shouldn't it be considered child abuse to involve your children in illegal activity?

  • January 31, 2009

    9:58 AM

    Tired of the Same Old writes:

    What's all the hollering about breaking up families? What law, what impediment, what obstacle is preventing families from staying together when illegal aliens repatriate? "Oh my, some of these people will be going to a country they don't know..." (hand-wringing). Isn't that the way the illegal aliens arrived here in the first place?

    Mamby Pamby Crap.

  • January 31, 2009

    6:52 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    Some of you should really take a Constitutional Law Class. You might Just Learn Something. The fact is, Our Constitution says that ANYONE born in the United States, whether their parents are here Illegally or Not, IS AN AMERICA CITIZEN BECAUSE THEY WERE BORN IN THE UNITED STATES. Now if you wish to Change the Constitution because you don't like illegals bearing children in the United States, you should Lobby your Crongressmen and Senaters to Change The Constitution. It's not an Easy Thing To Do. It Takes a Two Thirds Majority Vote in the House of Representatives and The Senate to Create a Constitutional Amendment. I don't like Illegals being here either. I think that they should be deported!!! And I have no idea what to do with their Children, Who Are U.S. Citizens by Birth Rite. But Constitutionally, That's What It Takes To Make An Amendment to Change The Constitution.

  • January 31, 2009

    8:18 PM

    Dick Cheney writes:

    ehhh

    who cares about the constitution ?

  • January 31, 2009

    8:37 PM

    The Learned Hand writes:

    MMMooch217 should do a little research before spouting. This is a fiscal issue to be decided by the state, which sets requirements on the how students must qualify for taxpayer aid. As a dependent of illegal alien parents, the state is well within its rights to deny taxpayer subsidies to such a child. This is not a constitutional issue, much to the chagrin of racial politicians and race baiters.

  • January 31, 2009

    9:19 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    The Learned Hand?
    Hey why don't you RE-READ what I wrote. I never said anything whatsoever about TAXPAYER AID or Who Should Or Should Not GET SUBSIDIES? I merely told you what it takes to change the Constitution. I also stated that the children of Illegal Aliens Who Are Born In The United States ARE AMERICAN CITIZENS BY BIRTH RITE. I never said that They Were OR Weren't entitled to those Subsidies. Perhaps you should take a course in CRITICAL READING.

  • January 31, 2009

    9:33 PM

    The Learned Hand writes:

    And you brought up this irrelevant point just because you wanted to show off your Wikipedic intelligence?

    Obviously you were saying that US born children of illegal aliens living in Colorado were entitled to in-state tuition stemming from their birth-right legal status. I know how to critically read AND interpret.

    Too bad all you know how to do is backpedal when you make a mistake.

  • January 31, 2009

    10:00 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    I stand behind my statements completely. They ARE U.S. Citizens and therefore Entitled to Subsidies now that you mention it. Their Parents, however, are Not Entitled to any Subsidies. And just like I said:

    "I don't like Illegals being here either. I think that they should be deported!!! And I have no idea what to do with their Children, Who Are U.S. Citizens by Birth Rite."

  • January 31, 2009

    10:56 PM

    The Learned Hand writes:

    Birth-right, not birth-rite, Einstein.

    And you are still wrong about their entitlement, which once again is not a constitutional issue, although it sounds cool when you invoke such heady language.

    Legal issues are apparently not your forte.

  • January 31, 2009

    11:53 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    Oh, so you're saying that certain American Citizens do not deserve to have the same Rights Guaranteed by The Constitution as others? Is that what you'r saying "oh wise one"? Perhaps you should pull your head completely out and realize that Every American Citizen Deserves to Have the Same Rights.....Period. American Citizens, be they born from Illegals or Otherwise, are STILL AMERICAN CITIZENS. Thereby affording them The Same Rights and Considerations.

  • February 1, 2009

    12:32 AM

    mmmark217 writes:

    Like I said, you should really take a course in CRITICAL READING. All Americian Citizens are By The Constitution, Guaranteed the Same Rights. This article is about Children of Illegal Immigrants Who Aren't U.S. Citizens. The only thing I am saying is: "That if they are born here, They deserve the Same Rights and Considerations Because They ARE American Citizens." If They ARE NOT American Citizens, They Should Be Deported Along With Their Parents, who are also NOT CITIZENS. And as far as Entitlements are concerned, All Citizens should be given the same Considerations when it comes to Entitlements. If they aren't Citizens, Their Shouldn't be Entitlements set Aside For Them, because they are here Illegally. Once again you fail to see your own Bias. You think you know what I am saying. In case you still do not understand what I am saying, let me try to condense it into a couple simple sentences. "If these children are born in the U.S., They are American Citizens. If they are American Citizens, The deserve the same Rights and Consideraitons as Any Other American Citizen." Is that Simplistic Enough For You To Grasp?

  • February 1, 2009

    3:03 AM

    jgarcia writes:

    mmmark217, I agree with you 1000%. I think all the children of illegals should not only be given in state tuition, but FREE tuition. I wish there were more people out there who think like you do. I am encouraging my family down in Mexico to come on up and have their kids here so they can live that American Dream and to take advantage of the great genorosity shown by the people like you and others of the like mind and get that education!!God bless you for taking a stand!!!

  • February 1, 2009

    9:22 AM

    FRN4U writes:

    Julien Ross,

    Continue your on-going diet of granola and fruit cake at the U. of Colorado Boulder cafeteria.
    Periodically, "intake" some of Monfort's "beef."

  • February 1, 2009

    9:50 AM

    The Learned Hand writes:

    You are very uneducated about the difference between constitutional rights and fiscal issues on a state level as it relates to taxpayer subsidies to dependents (do you know what this word means?) of illegal aliens. There is no inherent right to enjoy subsidies if your family is here illegally. Financial aid is apportioned according to family finances and eligibility requirements. So once again Offthemark, you are spewing nonsense.

    Let me guess. You are the angry offspring of illegal aliens and you want the United States to reward your family for breaking our laws and stealing honest folks identities. This would explain the baloney you post about things you know nothing about.

    I would suggest you consider yourself lucky that the United States has a birthright citizenship clause in the Constitution (Bill of Rights) that allowed your parents to cuckoo you onto the teat of the taxpayer years ago.

    Take a hike.

  • February 1, 2009

    10:03 AM

    Carly Thompson writes:

    If Mmmark217 would just post the section of the US Constitution that guarantees children of illegal aliens in-state tuition, I think this debate would be over.
    Otherwise, he is probably an American citizen of American parents who elected to drop out of our free education system to take a low level job and sit at home each night with a beer complaining how American failed him.

  • February 1, 2009

    10:21 AM

    FRN4U writes:

    Jgarcia, everything for free? "the american dream?" "encourage your family down in Mexico to come on up," with some silver and gold for payment to the legal residents of the USA who
    have been victimized by the "something for nothing" scam that has been going on for decades.
    Leave your bankers behind. We have too many bankers residing here, unfortunately. Have your family ask romer and monfort for travel funds for the trip. Once your family is here, have them squat on romer and monfort private property.

  • February 1, 2009

    12:11 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    You people are unbelievable. You still do not understand what I've written. The children of Illegal Immigrants, who were born in this country, should have the same Rights and Considerations. "Oh Wise One", That does not mean I think they should qualify for In State Tuition. It does mean that they deserve CONSIDERATION. Now, CONSIDERATION AS DEFINED ON DICTIONARY.COM, FOR INSTANCE, SAYS:
    consideration
       kənˌsɪd əˈreɪ ʃənShow Spelled Pronunciation [kuh n-sid-uh-rey-shuh n] Show IPA Pronunciation
    –noun
    1. the act of considering; careful thought; meditation; deliberation: I will give your project full consideration.
    2. something that is or is to be kept in mind in making a decision, evaluating facts, etc.: Age was an important consideration in the decision.
    3. thoughtful or sympathetic regard or respect; thoughtfulness for others: They showed no consideration for his feelings.
    4. a thought or reflection; an opinion based upon reflection.
    5. a recompense or payment, as for work done; compensation.
    6. importance or consequence.
    7. estimation; esteem: He is held in great consideration by the community.
    8. Law.
    a. something that suffices to make an informal promise legally binding, usually some value given in exchange for the promise.
    b. the hearing of a case by a tribunal.

    —Idioms
    9. in consideration of,
    a. in view of.
    b. in return or recompense for: She was offered money in consideration of her efforts.

    10. take into consideration, to take into account; consider: We failed to take into consideration the large number of tourists attending the exhibition.

    Now, CONSIDERATION DOES NOT MEAN THAT I THINK THAT THEY DESERVE IN STATE TUITION. JUST THAT THEY BE CONSIDERED IN THE PROCESS. A DEBATE ON THE SUBJECT BY OUT STATE GOVERNMENT IS BY DEFINITION "CONSIDERATION". CAN YOU ALL GET THAT THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULLS?
    UNBELIEVABLE

  • February 1, 2009

    12:15 PM

    Julien writes:

    Tuition equity in Colorado is smart, simple policy…It is good for our economy, it strengthens our communities and it keeps us competitive among neighboring Western states. Tuition equity is not a free pass to college. It simply gives kids who have attended a Colorado high school for three years and graduated the chance to pay in-state tuition. All students have to be accepted to a college or university, meaning that only qualified students will benefit.

  • February 1, 2009

    1:07 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    Julien, I was born and raised in the USA--six
    decades ago. I played by the rules. I paid my
    way through 4 years of college. As you are aware,
    our governing body and its private partners have bankrupted the USA in the last several decades--republicans and democrats.

    How about a refund for us that played by the
    rules before rewarding illegality?

    Do you promote border jumping and stealing--so
    that the reality of it absorbs and transpires itself to be legal? The essence of your argument
    defends breaking the law to reap rewards.

    I can live without being competitive with California.

  • February 1, 2009

    1:38 PM

    A Learned Hand writes:

    Sorry mmmush. You don't even know what you are writing. You keep fine tuning your meaning to avoid admitting you are wrong on the facts. What you have created now is a statement that is devoid of any meaning because you are such an idiot in not being able to defend a position you took at the outset.

    It is called context my undereducated friend. It is not an issue of critical reading.

    Nice try.

  • February 1, 2009

    2:13 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    "Oh Wise One" You still don't get it. I'm Neither for Nor against the children of Illegal Immigrants getting In State Tuition. What I am saying is quite simply this. I'll break it down for your addle mind. If a child is born in the United States, that child is by definition an American Citizen. An American Citizen, child or otherwise, deserves the same Rights and Considerations as ANY OTHER AMERICAN CITIZEN whether they were born from Illegal Immigrants or Not. Any State Government MUST CONSIDER EVERYONE OF IT'S CITIZENS WHEN HANDING OUT SERVICES OR ENTITLEMENTS. A CHILD BORN OF ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS, IN THE UNITED STATES, IS STILL AN AMERICAN CITIZEN AND THEREBY DESERVING OF CONSIDERATION. IT IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL NOT TO INCLUDE THEM IN THE DISCUSSION BECAUSE THEY ARE PART OF THIS COUNTRY. THEY ARE, IN FACT, AMERICAN CITIZENS. IMMIGRANTS IN THIS COUNTRY ILLEGALLY, SHOULD BE DEPORTED. BUT THEIR CHILDREN ARE HERE LEGALLY BY WAY OF BEING BORN IN THIS COUNTRY. SO YOU CANNOT TAKE AWAY OR DISCOUNT THEIR RIGHTS OR CONSIDERATIONS BECAUSE THEY ARE AMERICAN CITIZENS. IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT, TRY TO ATTEMPT TO CHANGE THE CONSTITUTION!!! I know that this is more of a LINEAR WAY OF THINKING FOR YOU SO I AM ATTEMPTING TO BREAK IT DOWN SO THAT YOU CAN UNDERSTAND.

  • February 1, 2009

    2:23 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    Mmmark217, I understood you perfectly several posts ago. a baby born here, in the USA, is a
    citizen. the understanding ability of some versus
    others seems to remain a problem.

  • February 1, 2009

    3:16 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    Julien, your post(s) sound like they are machine
    generated! Likely from Boulder. Watch the "beef
    intake."

  • February 1, 2009

    3:34 PM

    A Learned Hand writes:

    "I stand behind my statements completely. They ARE U.S. Citizens and therefore Entitled to Subsidies now that you mention it."

    "I never said anything whatsoever about TAXPAYER AID or Who Should Or Should Not GET SUBSIDIES?"

    Your words - direct quotes from your posts. Before you were just stupid. Now you are a liar.

    Good job Einstein. You finally got it rite.

  • February 1, 2009

    4:04 PM

    Carrie writes:

    Why doesn't this idiot realize that a dependent of illegal aliens, whether a citizen or not, may not receive certain state subsidies because it benefits the family's economics? He keeps repeating that this is a matter of constitutional rights because the child in question is a citizen. He obviously doesn't know the definition of dependent, or he wouldn't keep barfing up the same looniness. This person obviously did not graduate high school. Sad.

  • February 1, 2009

    5:07 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    while you are at it, why don't you give them my retirement benefits too

  • February 1, 2009

    6:16 PM

    Reality__Check writes:

    Why do Coloradoans continue to elect and support these bigoted racist politicians?

    If the Students are lawful residents of Colorado, then they pay in-state tuition.

    If you're going to regress to stone-age biblical punishment of innocents for the sins of their fathers, then deny in-state tuition to ANY student who's PARENTS have committed ANY criminal act - i.e. DUI, perjury, election fraud, etc.

  • February 1, 2009

    7:10 PM

    Scott Murray writes:

    With all the talk of economic stimulus and development what about the offspring of those who became citizens the right way?
    To those of you who quickly turn to the racist issue, these people are Illegal. While their offspring might be legal, then it does not make any difference does it- the offspring is Legal.

    To Mr. Cranberg's point- it is doubtful that the Illegal person(s) pay any income tax and most certainly real estate tax. Maybe with his thinking, the illegals should be given an exemption from the sales tax.

    Glad that I moved from Colorado 5 years ago. Too expensive, too big and too liberal.

  • February 1, 2009

    7:41 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    I reread the last several posts and there was no mention of the race of the illegal aliens and their children.

    Why do apologists for illegal aliens always resort to the race card when they have no facts upon which to argue their point?

    I think it is because they are weak minded idiots.

    Yes, that is the reason. The Mmmm idiot was revealed as a liar and the next series of posts throws down the race card.

    So predictable.

  • February 1, 2009

    8:48 PM

    AmericansforGunRights writes:

    If they are not legal citizens then they should pay out of state tuition just like any foreign student.

  • February 1, 2009

    8:49 PM

    AmericansforGunRights writes:

    If they are not legal citizens then they should pay out of state tuition just like any foreign student.

  • February 1, 2009

    8:50 PM

    AmericansforGunRights writes:

    If they are not legal citizens then they should pay out of state tuition just like any foreign student.

  • February 1, 2009

    9:43 PM

    Marta writes:

    Illegal immigrant excusers always play the race card. The surest sign they can't win any points on the truth.

  • February 1, 2009

    10:04 PM

    Marta writes:

    Illegal immigrant excusers always play the race card. The surest sign they can't win any points on the truth.

  • February 1, 2009

    10:04 PM

    Marta writes:

    Illegal immigrant excusers always play the race card. The surest sign they can't win any points on the truth.

  • February 1, 2009

    10:08 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    Reality_Check,
    Read the article a little more closely--then comment.you are not in the bounds of reality as
    it relates to the subject matter.

    I admire your "racist politicians,... and other,
    but...Children born in the USA are citizens--per the USA constituiton. They, alone, would be entitled to in-state-tuition.

    What some are trying to get passed in Colorado
    is rewarding illegals that were not born in the
    USA--plain and simple.

    Our constitution has become so watered down by
    executive order and international treaty,that
    anything is seemingly possible now.

    An interesting subject would be, why don't we convert Federal Reserve Notes to be one to one with the Peso? Or why is California the first
    state to declare bankruptcy?

    Monfort and Romer would do more good by flying kites.

  • February 1, 2009

    10:21 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    Still no mention of the race of the illegal aliens. These race baiters are desperate to derail the truth and silence the american people.

    Too bad these racists are too unstable to get up in public and rant the way they do anonymously. It would take courage to do that.

    Far easier to snipe from the shadows where all true racists have to hide.

  • February 1, 2009

    10:22 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    Still no mention of the race of the illegal aliens. These race baiters are desperate to derail the truth and silence the american people.

    Too bad these racists are too unstable to get up in public and rant the way they do anonymously. It would take courage to do that.

    Far easier to snipe from the shadows where all true racists have to hide.

  • February 1, 2009

    10:22 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    Still no mention of the race of the illegal aliens. These race baiters are desperate to derail the truth and silence the american people.

    Too bad these racists are too unstable to get up in public and rant the way they do anonymously. It would take courage to do that.

    Far easier to snipe from the shadows where all true racists have to hide.

  • February 1, 2009

    11:39 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    Let me pose a few questions to some of you folks and see what happens. Let's say there is a child born in the united states who's parents are here illegally. Now the parents are caught and in the process of being deported. What happens to the child who is an american citizen? Do we send the child back to his/her parents' native country? Do the parents get deported and the child becomes a ward of the state? If the child becomes a ward of the state, is the child sent to an orphanage, a foster home, or a relative who is a citizen (if there is one)? How do you deport the parents without somehow trampling on the rights of the child who is by definition an american citizen? I don't know how to make it happen without somehow infringing on the rights of the child. I'm asking, How do you do it in a practical manner? I'm open to any suggestions you might have.

  • February 1, 2009

    11:53 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    Oh, and if you take that to mean that I am for u.s. citizens of illegal immigrants getting in state tuition, then so be it.

  • February 2, 2009

    4:01 AM

    FRN4U writes:

    Mmmark217,
    Go fly a kite with Romer,Monfort,Julien Ross.
    Who is the real racist? At the expense of whom?
    Relocate to California--the poster child of "something for nothing for everyone."

    Above is the suggestion that you asked for.

  • February 2, 2009

    7:48 AM

    Ben writes:

    Mark17,
    1. No "rights" are being "trampled on".

    2. Parents make poor decisons every day in the USA affecting their children. Why should illegal aliens get special priviledges? Illegal aliens parents shouldn't even be here mind you. It's not like they don't have a back up plan if they get caught.

    3. Anchor babies can also go back to country of origin with the parents upon deportation orders. This happens in EVERY nation in the world. Why would it be suspended in the USA?

    4. When mama and papa get pinched dealing drugs in the USA and are facing consequences then up and leave the USA in the middle of the night, it's no problem. They illegally entered the country and they can even easily exit. Anchor baby "citizens" in tow, or anchor babies stay with relatives. Happens all the time.

    4. Why do you feel the need to use children as a human shield for illlegal aliens and illegal activity? Shame on you.

  • February 2, 2009

    8:56 AM

    mmmark217 writes:

    Ben, like I've stated in several posts on this subject. The parents are here Illegally and should be deported. But what happens to the Kid who is by definition, an american citizen and has the same rights as you and me? Anchor babies as you put it, still have the same rights as you and me, however they got here. If they have a birth certificate that says "made in the USA" they have a right to be here.

    FR4NU,
    I fail to see in any way shape or form how anything I've written could even remotely be considered racist. But you have your own opinion and that's fine with me. However, I would add, that I am a Citizen of the United States and a Citizen of Colorado Legally. My parents were citizens, my grandparents were citizens and My Great Granparents were citizens. I have a right to be here as well as having the right to free speech.

  • February 2, 2009

    9:06 AM

    mmmark217 writes:

    Oh and one more think FR4NU. You seek to deny me my right to free speech because you don't like what I have to say. I on the other hand, would fight to the death for your right to speak your mind. Not because, I agree with you, but because it's part of the U.S. Constitution as a InAlienable Right.

  • February 2, 2009

    9:07 AM

    Milehighguy writes:

    THE ISSUE IS: SHOULD CHILDREN OF ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS PAY IN-STATE TUITION?

    Stop changing the subject! The answer is, yes - if the child is a U.S. Citizen (anchor baby) and graduated from a Colorado High School. The answer is no - if the child is not a U.S. Citizen, regardless of where they graduated. If they are not a citizen, they are technically a foreign student, and will pay dearly for the education to take back to their country when completed - BECAUSE THEY WON'T BE ABLE TO WORK LEGALLY IN THE U.S. ANYWAY!

    There. Now this should be done.

    The next topic should be: Who can fix this website so that our posts get posted instead of going into some eternal stream and show up 4 times?

  • February 2, 2009

    9:24 AM

    Student from Iraq writes:

    I dunno

    it seems to me that they should pay OUT of State tuition.

  • February 2, 2009

    9:30 AM

    jay writes:

    we've heard it all before...you guys aren't getting your way on this one and it's boring watching you pout about it and simply refuste to acknowledge politically inconvenient facts...but let's review just for everyone's benefit.

    Sure our immigration system needs updating...it's business 101...all systems need inevitable revision to perform at maximum efficiency. college folks know this...

    Of course we need to increase our border and labor law enforcement. We need to commit $ and resources to that end. No one is saying otherwise.

    Since we don't know the full effect of illegal immigration, we need to devote $ and resources to a full evaluation of both the costs and benefits.

    Everyone favors decreasing the amount of illegal immigrants coming across our borders.

    Our differences lie in that fact that the loyal rushian footsoldiers are nationalists. a few are on record on this blog admitting that they favored crazy tom's idea of severely reducing ALL immigration, legal or not. they're also on record admitting that this current crop of immigrants from mexico are "inferior" to the immigrants who came in waves before them. The other major difference between the majority of americans and the extremists on the minority is that they believe it's viable and advisable to remove the illegal immigrants already here and working. furthermore, if you don't want people born in the us to be considered citizens, you're going to need to do more than whining to get the constitution changed.

    There you have it. I'm not saying that you freaks are wrong...just that you have no hope of getting those extremist policies adopted by the United States Government.


    just like always....the pouting and whining isn't going to change those politically (for you) inconvenient facts.

  • February 2, 2009

    9:30 AM

    mmmark217 writes:

    Thank You Milehighguy,
    I found one person on here who has an understanding of the law and also agrees with me.

  • February 2, 2009

    9:57 AM

    firesign725 writes:

    The children in question may be citizens and entitled to the same rights as the rest of us, but how long are we going to reward the criminal behavior of their parents?
    I'm all for going old-school on the guy who proposed this legislation: why did we ever get rid of tarring and feathering and running people out of town on a rail?

  • February 2, 2009

    10:13 AM

    Geoff writes:

    Illegal aliens are already costing us $925 million a year to educate them. Now they want higher education too? Don't they have any shame? In total illegal aliens cost Coloradans $1.1B annually while we have a $1.3B defecit. Does enforcing our immigration laws not seem like a very good solution to our budget crisis? I want illegal aliens out of our schools so that their third world culture stops infecting our children and so the flow of drugs to our children is stopped in a place where they are supposed to be safe and learning. Sure drugs can get in there through citizens but stopping the illegal alien drug mule -> illegal alien drug mule's kid -> our kids chain seems obvious.

  • February 2, 2009

    10:15 AM

    Geoff writes:

    Illegal aliens are already costing us $925 million a year to educate them. Now they want higher education too? Don't they have any shame? In total illegal aliens cost Coloradans $1.1B annually while we have a $1.3B defecit. Does enforcing our immigration laws not seem like a very good solution to our budget crisis? I want illegal aliens out of our schools so that their third world culture stops infecting our children and so the flow of drugs to our children is stopped in a place where they are supposed to be safe and learning. Sure drugs can get in there through citizens but stopping the illegal alien drug mule -> illegal alien drug mule's kid -> our kids chain seems obvious.

    P.S. Here's a link proving my numbers.

    http://www.fairus.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&id=19646&security=1601&news_iv_ctrl=1741

  • February 2, 2009

    10:27 AM

    GenBalthus writes:

    This is an issue that gets people who would normally be at each others' throats politically marching in unison.

    Illegal immigration is a stain on this nation.

    Legal immigration makes this nation healthy.

    Quit stealing from citizens to give to people who steal from citizens, many Republicans AND Democrats agree.

  • February 2, 2009

    10:29 AM

    jay writes:

    and can you now give us a cost benefit analysis, geoff, or are you, like ben, refusing to acknowledge the benefits of immigration...legal or not?

  • February 2, 2009

    10:40 AM

    Ben writes:

    jay,
    How about YOU supply some quantative analysis, or keep your hole shut?

  • February 2, 2009

    11:09 AM

    KW writes:

    According to FAIR, the cost of illegal immigration in Arizona alone, including education, health care and incarceration, to be in the area of $1.3 billion annually.

  • February 2, 2009

    11:31 AM

    Ben writes:

    Hmmmm.... Arizona. 1.3 BILLION..... I wonder what it is in the other FORTY NINE states..... COMBINED?

    * Isn't California going to be bankrupt this month too unless the Federal Government gives them a handout?

  • February 2, 2009

    11:47 AM

    jay writes:

    don't pout benny.

    instead of whining why don't you produce that long-asked for analysis?

    until then, read my previous post...

  • February 2, 2009

    11:51 AM

    Shaggy aka soldier of Bens border war writes:

    jay is an idiot.
    Why he refuses or is inept to understand how illegal immigration destroys this country is unfathomable.
    But then again, trying to have any dialect with him is like communicating with a monkey.

    jay, may I suggest you go to http://www.usillegalaliens.com/ for all your answers..
    Or just remain ignorant and keep on embarrassing yourself.

  • February 2, 2009

    11:52 AM

    Shaggy aka soldier of Bens border war writes:

    jay is an idiot.
    Why he refuses or is inept to understand how illegal immigration destroys this country is unfathomable.
    But then again, trying to have any dialect with him is like communicating with a monkey.

    jay, may I suggest you go to http://www.usillegalaliens.com/ for all your answers..
    Or just remain ignorant and keep on embarrassing yourself.

  • February 2, 2009

    11:55 AM

    The Learned Hand writes:

    mm puts forth the failed false choice arguement that the US is somehow responsible for an anchor baby if the illegal immigrant patents deservedly get deported. It is the same propaganda that illegal immigrant supporters use when they argue that since you can't deport 12 million people then you must let them stay.

    Parents are always responsible for their children and must continue to care for them wherever they are domiciled. There is absolutely no obligation of the US to make any anchor child a ward of the state. It is a lie to suggest so.

    And consistent with his prior posts.

  • February 2, 2009

    11:59 AM

    Hogar De Vuelta (العودة) Committing criminal acts should not result in a benefit writes:

    What we need is a return to sanity in our laws. If you birth in the USA was the result of a criminal act by your parents, you should get citizenship. No citizenship for illegal invaders.

  • February 2, 2009

    12:08 PM

    jay writes:

    shaggy, may i suggest you see the thread below in which you already did the willful ignorance dance to this song.

    saves time.

    http://blogs.rockymountainnews.com/rockytalklive/archives/2007/11/campos_tancredo_is_americas_wo.html

  • February 2, 2009

    12:20 PM

    Ben- tutoring the ethically challenged ..again writes:

    jay,
    Since you don't know what quantative analysis is, I'll use your terminology. Again Why don't YOU provide a Cost/Benefit analysis on illegal immigration to prove your assertions?

  • February 2, 2009

    12:38 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    jay, what information can you supply regarding illegals and California bankruptcy? Or do you
    have "willful ignorance" on the question?
    "pout," "willful ignorance," "whining,"--why can't
    you come up with anything but your worn out snippets?

  • February 2, 2009

    12:50 PM

    Morningstar writes:

    An illegal alien is an illegal alien and the entire family should be deported. Republic Chris
    Romer should be deported along with them. It is
    totally ridiculous to pay their tuition. When we
    first moved here from another state, we were
    denied state tuition assistance and we are legal.
    It is unfair to use our tax dollars to support
    illegal aliens. If this bill is passed, we are
    going to find another state to live in. We love
    Colorado and have made a life for ourselves here
    but cannot put up with this kind of irrational
    thinking.

  • February 2, 2009

    12:55 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    Get ready folks. Jay's partner, Popo, is warming up on the "sidelines." Usually, "directly behind
    jay."

  • February 2, 2009

    12:57 PM

    Morningstar writes:

    Yes. They should definitely pay. Their parents
    are here illegally and probably not paying any state or Federal income tax, may be receiving
    welfare and free medical benefits. Enough is
    enough. Deport all of them back to their country
    of origin and take Republic Chris Romer with you.

  • February 2, 2009

    1:01 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    Morningstar is on to something. We need to purge this type of "representation" by Romer and others who have been elected to serve the people, yet are only interested in themselves.

  • February 2, 2009

    1:14 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    Jay, we are waiting for your friend,Popo, to sound off. Where are you keeping him these days.
    He is usually close "behind you."

  • February 2, 2009

    1:25 PM

    SouthernColorado writes:

    Let's get this straight.
    Some of you voted for this liberal Romer,
    and now we all may suffer.

  • February 2, 2009

    3:00 PM

    BadBoy BadBoy writes:

    The Constitution should be ammended to prevent illegal immigrants from all countries from having Jackpot babies. As it is it is being misinterpreted to allow illegals to have Anchor Babies. The 14th amendment was written to insure that slaves and their descendants would be citizens. It was proposed on June 13, 1866, and ratified on July 9, 1868. The idea of the 14th Amendment was a good thing for the period of time it was proposed.

  • February 2, 2009

    3:01 PM

    BadBoy BadBoy writes:

    The Constitution should be ammended to prevent illegal immigrants from all countries from having Jackpot babies. As it is it is being misinterpreted to allow illegals to have Anchor Babies. The 14th amendment was written to insure that slaves and their descendants would be citizens. It was proposed on June 13, 1866, and ratified on July 9, 1868. The idea of the 14th Amendment was a good thing for the period of time it was proposed.

  • February 2, 2009

    3:15 PM

    OldSailor writes:

    The Constitution should be amended to prevent illegal immigrants from all countries from having Jackpot babies. As it is it is being misinterpreted to allow illegal’s to have Anchor Babies. The 14th amendment was written to insure that slaves and their descendants would be citizens. It was proposed on June 13, 1866, and ratified on July 9, 1868. The idea of the 14th Amendment was a good thing for the period of time it was proposed.

  • February 2, 2009

    3:24 PM

    Seasick Sailor writes:

    "The 14th amendment was written to insure that slaves and their descendants would be citizens"

    Today its called cheap farm labor and cheap construction labor. Ask Tom Tancredo. he knows all about it.

  • February 2, 2009

    4:27 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    Another cheap shot from those who can't make the facts work for them. Tancredo did not hire illlegal aliens. His contractor did.

    Still a weak showing from the race baiters.

  • February 2, 2009

    4:39 PM

    Ben- Former Democrat writes:

    Dear Friend,

    Speaking of Race Baiters= NY TIMES

    From Bay Buchanan TeamAmericaPAC

    Well we got their attention -New York Times lead editorial on Sunday no less! And the pejoratives are flying-directly at us!!

    But you know we are doing something right when The New York Times starts calling you names. Yesterday, their chief editorial, "The Nativists are Getting Restless" was dedicated to how awful a people we are for calling for enforcing our laws. [you can read the editorial here]

    I'll be on the O'Reilly Factor tonight at 8:00 EST to talk about it.

    Here's the background: You all remember how throughout the election everyone of our opponents insisted they were just as tough on illegal immigration as our guys. Chris Cannon tried this prank. Paul Kanjorski did this with Lou Barletta, and Parker Griffith threatened to sue when we said he wasn't tough.

    Well we did a study! Our executive director dug in his heels and reviewed every race in which congressional Republican seat was lost to show once and for all that opposing amnesty did not hurt the Republicans (and of course a lot of Republicans who lost supported amnesty.) [You can read the report here.]

    We held a press conference last Thursday to present the report and talk about immigration and the Republican future with Fox News commentator Jim Pinkerton and immigration journalist Peter Brimelow.

    We argued that the GOP needs to get tough on illegal immigration if it wishes to become the majority party again.

    Well that sure set off the Times. They completely ignored the findings of the study, and resorted to their old stand-by, calling us "nativists," "xenophobes," and the rest of their usual slur words. The Times is proving to be a bit unstable these days and we will do our best to put them over the edge.

    Your Friend,

    Bay

  • February 2, 2009

    5:53 PM

    jay writes:

    "Why don't YOU provide a Cost/Benefit analysis on illegal immigration to prove your assertions?"

    please see my post at 9:30 am, benny.

    frntr4us, are you our new Pouting Troll?

  • February 2, 2009

    6:09 PM

    Ben-Nationalist/Populist(American) writes:

    jay,
    Yawn just as we thought. You are all fluff. No Cost/Benefit Analysis and not a single number in your rehashed talking points.

    *Oh, and see my post at 4:39 in regard to your stale "nativist" schtick. Then watch Bay on T.V.

  • February 2, 2009

    6:23 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    No, Jay. I don't have time to pout. I only have
    time to expose challenged frauds that would
    include......sorry to be the bearer of the truth-----you, Julien, and most dyed in the "wool" liberals.

  • February 2, 2009

    6:27 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    jay, if you really want to know who the pouting troll is, it's you.

  • February 2, 2009

    6:27 PM

    Reality_Check writes:

    "Immigration policy should be generous; it should be fair; it should be flexible. With such a policy we can turn to the world, and to our own past, with clean hands and a clear conscience."
    -- John F Kennedy

  • February 2, 2009

    6:51 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    No, Jay. I don't have time to pout. I only have
    time to expose challenged frauds that would
    include......sorry to be the bearer of the truth-----you, Julien, and most dyed in the "wool" liberals.

  • February 2, 2009

    7:07 PM

    jay writes:

    we've heard it all before...you guys aren't getting your way on this one and it's boring watching you pout about it and simply refuste to acknowledge politically inconvenient facts...but let's review just for everyone's benefit.

    Sure our immigration system needs updating...it's business 101...all systems need inevitable revision to perform at maximum efficiency. college folks know this...

    Of course we need to increase our border and labor law enforcement. We need to commit $ and resources to that end. No one is saying otherwise.

    pay attention here people:

    Since we don't know the full effect of illegal immigration, we need to devote $ and resources to a full evaluation of both the costs and benefits.

    do i need to repeat that for the far right cheap seats?

    Everyone favors decreasing the amount of illegal immigrants coming across our borders.

    Our differences lie in that fact that the loyal rushian footsoldiers are nationalists. a few are on record on this blog admitting that they favored crazy tom's idea of severely reducing ALL immigration, legal or not. they're also on record admitting that this current crop of immigrants from mexico are "inferior" to the immigrants who came in waves before them. The other major difference between the majority of americans and the extremists on the minority is that they believe it's viable and advisable to remove the illegal immigrants already here and working. furthermore, if you don't want people born in the us to be considered citizens, you're going to need to do more than whining to get the constitution changed.

    There you have it. I'm not saying that you freaks are wrong...just that you have no hope of getting those extremist policies adopted by the United States Government.


    just like always....the pouting and whining isn't going to change those politically (for you) inconvenient facts.

    like playing dodgeball with children.

  • February 2, 2009

    7:25 PM

    FRN4U writes:

    You said the same thing at 9:30 am., jay.

    cut your manicured and painted nails once a
    month,at least. you are wearing out the chalk board.

    "since we don't know the full effect of illegal
    immigration, we need to devote $ and resources
    to a full evaluation of both the costs and benefits."

    You sound like a galley hand on the sunken
    ship California, jay boy.

  • February 2, 2009

    7:47 PM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Fact #1 - Immigrants pay taxes

    FACT - All immigrants pay taxes, whether income, property, sales, or other. As far as income tax payments go, sources vary in their accounts, but a range of studies find that immigrants pay between $90 and $140 billion a year in federal, state, and local taxes.

    Even undocumented immigrants pay income taxes, as evidenced by the Social Security Administration's "suspense file" -- taxes that cannot be matched to workers' names and social security numbers -- which grew $20 BILLION between 1990 and 1998.

    SOURCE - National Academy of Sciences, Cato Institute, Urban Institute, Social Security Administration

  • February 2, 2009

    8:17 PM

    Ben- writes:

    Reality Check,
    That post is laughably fraught with ambiguity. Link it at least.. Here is reality, from of a transcript from Lou Dobbs Tonight today 2-2-09 on California's worsening financial crisis.

    "The state's economy has already spiraled to historic depths. On Sunday, the governor and state lawmakers missed their self-imposed deadline to reach a deal on the projected $42 billion budget shortfall by next year.

    H.D. PALMER, CALIFORNIA STATE FINANCE DEPT.: This time there are real world consequences because we have not been able to get to a budget agreement.

    WIAN: Already tax refund payments to individuals and businesses are delayed. Nearly a quarter of a million state employees are being forced to take two days off a month without pay.

    UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In this economy it's staggering. It's one more kind of nail in the coffin.

    UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's right -- I just think that the rest of the United States thinks we're crazy.

    WIAN: Virtually absent from the discussion notes a columnist for the "Los Angeles Times" the strain of illegal immigration on the state budget. A Monday column concludes the state spends well over $5 billion a year on illegal immigrants and their families. That's about equal to a third of the state's budget shortfall this fiscal year.

    (END VIDEOTAPE)

    WIAN: Now over the past 10 years, California's population has grown by about 11 percent. But from 1996 through 2006, it's estimated the illegal alien population swelled by about 40 percent. And illegal immigrants now make up nearly eight percent of California's residents -- Lou.

    DOBBS: At first I'm just stunned that the "Los Angeles Times" even acknowledged even at the periphery that there is such a thing as an illegal immigration crisis in this country.

    (CROSSTALK)

    WIAN: It was sudden for me to see that as well Lou, as somebody who reads the "Los Angeles Times" every single day, you have not seen that mentioned, but their "Capitol Hill Caller" (ph), Capitol columnist, Sacramento columnist laid it all out, did his version of the math and how much illegal immigration costs the sate of California. And his calculations came up with $5 billion -- a lot of people think it's higher than that perhaps even double. But the fact that the "Los Angeles Times" acknowledged it is something new, Lou.

    DOBBS: Now "The New York Times" did a 761-word editorial on the issue of illegal immigration, Casey, and never once mentioned the word illegal. So the coasts are well covered by this sort of mindless political correctness which apparently is -- there's some breakthrough in the "L.A. Times".

    http://loudobbs.tv.cnn.com/

  • February 2, 2009

    8:54 PM

    mmmark217 writes:

    "Oh Wise One" says that I am spouting propaganda. Let's take a closer look at that statement shall we. Now propaganda is defined in dictionary.com as follows:
    propaganda - 6 dictionary results
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    propaganda   /ˌprɒpəˈgændə/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [prop-uh-gan-duh] Show IPA Pronunciation

    –noun 1. information, ideas, or rumors deliberately spread widely to help or harm a person, group, movement, institution, nation, etc.
    2. the deliberate spreading of such information, rumors, etc.
    3. the particular doctrines or principles propagated by an organization or movement.
    4. Roman Catholic Church. a. a committee of cardinals, established in 1622 by Pope Gregory XV, having supervision over foreign missions and the training of priests for these missions.
    b. a school (College of Propaganda) established by Pope Urban VIII for the education of priests for foreign missions.

    5. Archaic. an organization or movement for the spreading of propaganda.

    Now, what I did in my last post was pose to you a scenario. I asked quite simply "What happens to the child of illegal immigrants if that child is here legally? I posed multiple questions to try and get you to think. I fail to see, where in the definition of propaganda I spewed any agenda whatsoever. In order ot have an Agenda, a statement has to be made. I quite simply asked questions.
    Now in addition to posing some questions I asked whether or not the child becomes a ward of the state. I quite simply don't have the answer to that question, Which Is Why I Posed The Question. It's obvious that "oh wise one" also dose not have an answer to that question. He called me a liar for asking a question. Now dictionary.com defines a Lie as follows:
    lie - 20 dictionary results
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    lie1   /laɪ/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [lahy] Show IPA Pronunciation
    noun, verb, lied, ly⋅ing.
    –noun 1. a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an intentional untruth; a falsehood.
    2. something intended or serving to convey a false impression; imposture: His flashy car was a lie that deceived no one.
    3. an inaccurate or false statement.
    4. the charge or accusation of lying: He flung the lie back at his accusers.
    –verb (used without object) 5. to speak falsely or utter untruth knowingly, as with intent to deceive.
    6. to express what is false; convey a false impression.
    –verb (used with object) 7. to bring about or affect by lying (often used reflexively): to lie oneself out of a difficulty; accustomed to lying his way out of difficulties.
    —Idioms8. give the lie to, a. to accuse of lying; contradict.
    b. to prove or imply the falsity of; belie: His poor work gives the lie to his claims of experience.

    9. lie in one's throat or teeth, to lie grossly or maliciously: If she told you exactly the opposite of what she told me, she must be lying in her teeth. Also, lie through one's teeth.


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Origin:
    bef. 900; (n.) ME; OE lyge; c. G Lüge, ON lygi; akin to Goth liugn; (v.) ME lien, OE lēogan (intransit.); c. G lügen, ON ljūga, Goth liugan

    I believe that in order to have LIED, I would have had to make a Statement. But my last post was a group of questions. So to call me a LIAR and a person SPOUTING PROPAGANDA, I would have had to make a statement wouldn't I have?

    "Oh Wise One" Your grasp of the English Language is extraordinary. Not only do you not have the ability to Critically Read, and Critically Think, You also have no grasp of the English Language.

  • February 2, 2009

    9:15 PM

    jay writes:

    as i said before, frn, until you can refute the points i make, the whining isn't going to help.

    are you my next Pouting Troll?

  • February 2, 2009

    9:46 PM

    jay writes:

    "Here is reality, from of a transcript from Lou Dobbs Tonight"

    that is priceless.

  • February 2, 2009

    10:11 PM

    The Learned Hand writes:

    Your own words branded you a liar mushmouth, not me. You are hopelessly confused and desperate to win a point without the intellectual horsepower to do it.

    Cutting and pasting from your online dictionary is not at all impressive. It may keep your pudgy fingers limber, but it is a waste of everyone's time.

    You create scenarios that are not based in reality, but steeped in the usual propaganda that pro-illegal immigrant activists use as false choices. These are not questions but suggestions to others to start a conversation at the point you create. It is misleading and intended to be so. You are unable to admit your transparent motives.

    You are tiring and lack any creative imagination.

    Are you related to jay?

  • February 2, 2009

    10:12 PM

    Ben writes:

    jay,
    So you are denying that California is in dire economic straits? Par for the course with you.

    Sorry idiot, that is NOT priceless, it's costly.

  • February 2, 2009

    10:23 PM

    jay-former republican writes:

    so anything to refute the points i made or can we move on to your question, benny?

  • February 2, 2009

    10:58 PM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Fact #2 - Immigrants come to work and reunite with family members

    FACT - Immigrants come to work and reunite with family members. Immigrant labor force participation is consistently higher than native-born, and immigrant workers make up a larger share of the U.S. labor force (12.4%) than they do the U.S. population (11.5%).

    Moreover, the ratio between immigrant use of public benefits and the amount of taxes they pay is consistently favorable to the U.S., unless the "study" was undertaken by an anti-immigrant group. In one estimate, immigrants earn about $240 billion a year, pay about $90 billion a year in taxes, and use about $5 billion in public benefits. In another cut of the data, immigrant tax payments total $20 to $30 billion more than the amount of government services they use.

    SOURCE - American Immigration Lawyers Association, Urban Institute

    * Due to welfare reform, legal immigrants are severely restricted from accessing public benefits, and undocumented immigrants are even further precluded from anything other than emergency services.

  • February 3, 2009

    2:19 AM

    FRN4U writes:

    Ben,thank you for your observation of jay. jay (femdem wing of the liberals) is in "denial" about California (and a few "other" things).

  • February 3, 2009

    5:46 AM

    Ben writes:

    FRRN4U,

    It's an easy observation to make. jay's a strawman fraud from the word go. It is common knowledge among those of us who have posted here for a while.
    Now watch. He is going to post back a canned line of his.

    jay,
    Where is the Cost/Benefit Analysis that YOU wanted, but refuse to find yourself? (rhetorical question) Maybe jw can help you find one.
    Tell everyone "hi" down at your staffing agency that relies on cheap, foreign labor.

    Reality Check,
    Please. MOST people aren't stupid, and what.... no link .... again?

  • February 3, 2009

    6:02 AM

    Ben's Reality Check writes:

    Look... I even put an internet link.(insert sarcasm)

    http://immigrationcounters.com/index.html

  • February 3, 2009

    8:46 AM

    Donald Trump writes:

    There is only one solution to this mess. Fence off Colorado from the rest of the Union. Nobody from Texas or Calif allowed.

  • February 3, 2009

    9:31 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Fact #1 - Immigrants pay taxes

    FACT - All immigrants pay taxes, whether income, property, sales, or other. As far as income tax payments go, sources vary in their accounts, but a range of studies find that immigrants pay between $90 and $140 billion a year in federal, state, and local taxes.

    Even undocumented immigrants pay income taxes, as evidenced by the Social Security Administration's "suspense file" -- taxes that cannot be matched to workers' names and social security numbers -- which grew $20 BILLION between 1990 and 1998.

    SOURCE - National Academy of Sciences, Cato Institute, Urban Institute, Social Security Administration

  • February 3, 2009

    9:35 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Fact #3 - Immigrants and their businesses contribute $162 billion in tax revenue

    FACT - In addition to the consumer spending of immigrant households, immigrants and their businesses contribute $162 billion in tax revenue to U.S. federal, state, and local governments. While it is true that immigrants remit billions of dollars a year to their home countries, this is one of the most targeted and effective forms of direct foreign investment.

    SOURCE - Cato Institute, Inter-American Development Bank

  • February 3, 2009

    9:47 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    "Every ethnic minority, in seeking in its own freedom, helped strengthen the fabric of liberty in American life. Similarly, every aspect of the American economy has profited from the contributions of immigrants."
    -- John F Kennedy

  • February 3, 2009

    9:48 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    "Every ethnic minority, in seeking in its own freedom, helped strengthen the fabric of liberty in American life. Similarly, every aspect of the American economy has profited from the contributions of immigrants."
    -- John F Kennedy

  • February 3, 2009

    10:13 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    "Every ethnic minority, in seeking in its own freedom, helped strengthen the fabric of liberty in American life. Similarly, every aspect of the American economy has profited from the contributions of immigrants."
    -- John F Kennedy

  • February 3, 2009

    10:24 AM

    Ben-Seen that fraud on the border for 20 years writes:

    Looks like the illegal alien amnesty propoganda machine had started with Mr. Reality Check. Hey link it and quit repeating your "facts" lol.

    Fact # Immigrants and illegal aliens aren't in the same category.

    Fact #2 Cato Institute ignores this "Fact".

    Fact #3 This renders CI an unworthy source of liberal/Libertarian information.

    Fact# 4 This is usually the case with fact "3

    Fact "5 Illegal aliens take way more than the pay. Americans pay for their existentence to fund cheap labor and left wing ideologies.

    Huddle Study Rice University from 1996: It hasn't gotten any better people.

    http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecentersf134


    Fact # 6 reality check is repeating his illegal alien "facts"

  • February 3, 2009

    10:52 AM

    Reality Check writes:

    "A nation without borders is not a nation." Ronald Reagan

  • February 3, 2009

    11:06 AM

    Reality Check writes:

    Speaking of Kennedy's, This quote is in reference to Ted "Hasta la Victoria" Kennedy's bill of which we are seeing the problems from now.

    "This type of mass influx is simply too much to handle. What we've had since the disaster of the 1965 Immigration Act will take 100 years or more to absorb." Peter Brimelow

  • February 3, 2009

    11:06 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Fact #4 - Immigrant entrepreneurs create jobs for U.S. and foreign workers

    FACT - The largest wave of immigration to the U.S. since the early 1900s coincided with our lowest national unemployment rate and fastest economic growth. Immigrant entrepreneurs create jobs for U.S. and foreign workers, and foreign-born students allow many U.S. graduate programs to keep their doors open. While there has been no comprehensive study done of immigrant-owned businesses, we have countless examples: in Silicon Valley, companies begun by Chinese and Indian immigrants generated more than $19.5 billion in sales and nearly 73,000 jobs in 2000.

    SOURCE - Brookings Institution

  • February 3, 2009

    11:18 AM

    Another reality Check writes:

    Yeah, Immigrants stand in line and follow our laws, good for them. Ileegal aliens go home and stand in line.

    "Amnesty is a big billboard, a flashing billboard, to the rest of the world that we don't really mean our immigration law."
    Richard Lamm

  • February 3, 2009

    11:21 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Fact #5 - Immigrants fill jobs in key sectors, start their own businesses, and contribute to the economy

    FACT - During the 1990s, half of all new workers were foreign-born, filling gaps left by native-born workers in both the high- and low-skill ends of the spectrum. Immigrants fill jobs in key sectors, start their own businesses, and contribute to a thriving economy.

    The net benefit of immigration to the U.S. is nearly $10 billion annually. As Alan Greenspan points out, 70% of immigrants arrive in prime working age. That means we haven't spent a penny on their education, yet they are transplanted into our workforce and will contribute $500 billion toward our social security system over the next 20 years.

    SOURCE - National Academy of Sciences, Center for Labor Market Studies at Northeastern University, Federal Reserve

  • February 3, 2009

    11:22 AM

    jay writes:

    "Where is the Cost/Benefit Analysis that YOU wanted, but refuse to find yourself?"

    benny you are the epitome of the willfully ignorant wingnut.

    PLEASE see my posts above regarding this question.

    so again...anything from you or the crowd to refute the points i've made or is whining all you continue to have to offer here?

  • February 3, 2009

    11:28 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Fact #7 - Today's immigrants are not that different than those of 100 years ago

    FACT - The percentage of the U.S. population that is foreign-born now stands at 11.5%; in the early 20th century it was approximately 15%.

    Similar to accusations about today's immigrants, those of 100 years ago initially often settled in mono-ethnic neighborhoods, spoke their native languages, and built up newspapers and businesses that catered to their fellow émigrés.

    They also experienced the same types of discrimination, racism and bigotry that today's immigrants face, and integrated within American culture at a similar rate. If we view history objectively, we remember that every new wave of immigrants has been met with suspicion and doubt and yet, ultimately, every past wave of immigrants has been vindicated and saluted.

    SOURCE - U.S. Census Bureau

  • February 3, 2009

    11:35 AM

    Another reality check writes:

    "I am concerned for the security of our great nation, not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insidious forces working from within.?

    General Douglas MacArthur

  • February 3, 2009

    12:07 PM

    the_ripper writes:

    '...Similar to accusations about today's immigrants, those of 100 years ago initially often settled in mono-ethnic neighborhoods, spoke their native languages, and built up newspapers and businesses that catered to their fellow émigrés...'

    Of course they did...after immigrating LEGALLY!

  • February 3, 2009

    12:15 PM

    Another reality check writes:

    "I am concerned for the security of our great nation, not so much because of any threat from without, but because of the insidious forces working from within.?

    General Douglas MacArthur

  • February 3, 2009

    12:18 PM

    Everybody writes:

    Illegal Immigration Costs Colorado Nearly $1.1 Billion Annually Finds New Study from FAIR
    Washington DC — A report prepared by the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) finds that illegal immigration costs Colorado about $1.1 billion a year, or about $612 for every native-born household in the state. The report, The Costs of Illegal Immigration to Coloradans looks at just three essential state provided services and programs: K-12 education, public health care, and incarceration from criminal illegal aliens.

    According the report, illegal aliens in Colorado pay about $160 million in taxes, reducing the net costs to the state to $912 million annually. However, since most of the jobs currently held by illegal aliens would likely be filled by legal workers, at higher wages, the taxes paid by illegal aliens would have been collected anyway.

  • February 3, 2009

    1:28 PM

    Rodolpho writes:

    The amnesty sheeple need these criminals to join their voting ranks. That is the only real truth for those who willfully and ignorantly propose repeating yet another failed amnesty cycle.

    Their antiAmericanism is eclipsed only by their moronic selfishness.

  • February 3, 2009

    2:11 PM

    Citizen writes:

    http://www.diggersrealm.com/mt/archives/000612.html

    Illegal threaten New Jersey hospitals. Is New Jersey on the border?

  • February 3, 2009

    3:40 PM

    Anonymous writes:

    The NYTs gets huge cash infusion from the richest Mexican alive and now they have to start smearing people using YouTube as a reference.

    It doesn't get sloppier than that.

  • February 3, 2009

    4:53 PM

    Janet writes:

    Anyone with a brain the size of a pea could tell we are getting ripped off by illegal aliens and illegal immigration.

  • February 3, 2009

    5:45 PM

    Reality_Check writes:

    unFAIR ...? What next, you gonna quote the KKK ??

    LOL!

    Your white sheets are getting threadbare.


    The Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) advocates *CHANGES* in U.S. immigration policy that would result in significant reductions in immigration, both LEGAL and illegal.

    - FAIR has been identified as a "hate group" by the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC)

    - FAIR's racist bedfellows: FAIR accepted contributions from the Pioneer Fund. Between 1982 and 1994, FAIR received $1.2 million from the foundation. The Pioneer Fund focuses on projects it perceives will not be easily funded due to controversial, racist or pro-eugenics subject matter. It was described by the Sunday Telegraph as a "neo-Nazi organization closely integrated with the far right in American politics" in 1989

    - FAIR has been condemned by the International Relations Center as producing "policy rhetoric [that] is often inflammatory, clearly anti-immigrant, and partisan." In 2005, an article in the political magazine, The American Prospect, called FAIR "the anti-immigration movement’s most powerful institution". It further condemned FAIR for cooperating with "white nationalists."

    Now goose-step for us like a good little racist !

  • February 3, 2009

    6:17 PM

    Ben-Racist writes:

    Racism....? Really....

    Is any one watching O'Reilly right now? It's simple. Give amnesty to illegals they turn into Democrats via entitlements. George Soros, NY Times, ACLU are apparently trying to turn our 2 party system into a one party system by breaking the back of the conservative movement and the Republicans by using the Democratic party. That's bad for the USA in so many ways. The sheeple put bammy in for change. Guess what sheeple? You just might get it.

    Reality Check, So millions of Americans are KKK members because they belong to FAIR and NUMBERS USA type groups etc. Keep posting, you are starting to unravel.

  • February 3, 2009

    10:04 PM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Suck to be you, don't it repug?

  • February 3, 2009

    10:06 PM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Sucks to be you, don't it repug ?

  • February 4, 2009

    5:54 AM

    Ben-Racist writes:

    Reality,
    You and your lying,radical left wing ilk are like a disease. Americans shall overcome.

  • February 4, 2009

    7:30 AM

    American Citizen writes:

    "Sucks to be you, don't it repug ?" Reality Check.

    No. We don't have lies to maintain. You do.

  • February 4, 2009

    8:52 AM

    H Stowell writes:

    This is crazy that this question is even being asked. The answer is NO! If they are citizens born to illegal parents then yes but if they are illegal then NO! Illegals are already causing a burden in schools, hospitals, and other services. They are not entitled and should not receive anything that would encourage them to remain in the country. The sad thing is that clowns like "Reality Check" can't provide any sensible argument and their only response is to start yelling "racist." The truth is that the question regarding what to do with all the illegals in the country needs to be resolved before anything like this should be presented. We should all remember who introduced this type of legislation when it comes time to vote again and hopefully their opponents will remind us.

  • February 4, 2009

    9:19 AM

    Giggles writes:

    They should be deported along with their parents.

  • February 4, 2009

    10:29 AM

    FRN4U writes:

    but!, but! we are the wealthiest nation on earth.

    just ask jay, reality_check. constitution does
    apply to some--kindof like a self --winding road.

  • February 4, 2009

    10:30 AM

    FRN4U writes:

    but!, but! we are the wealthiest nation on earth.

    just ask jay, reality_check. constitution does (not)apply to some--kindof like a self --winding road.

  • February 4, 2009

    11:33 AM

    Reality_Check writes:

    Why do you right-wing bigots and racist hate America ?

  • February 4, 2009

    12:11 PM

    Ben Former Democrat writes:

    "Why do you right-wing bigots and racist hate America ?"

    As if.
    Americans of all walks of life hate radical left wing hate-America radicals that lie, such as yourself. Please move to Mexico. They have some of the most race driven, harsh laws against illegal immigration.
    That is the only thing that the USA should be letting migrate north. Mexico's laws on illegal immigration.

  • February 4, 2009

    12:21 PM

    Antonia G. writes:

    If a child is born in the US - they are citizens -regardless of their parent's immigration status.
    The only way to prevent the state and federal government from footing the bill for these "anchor" children is to change the law to exclude citizenship to kids born in the US to undocumented parents. I have mixed feelings about this. But ultimately, a child born in the US is the highest motivation that undocumented immigrants have for coming to this country illegally. If they can just manage to pop out a kid or two - those kids, once they turn 21, as US citizens can petition, on behalf of their parents, for citizenship. I work in my local community, with Latino immigrants. This immigrant class clearly knows the benefits of having US born children - and they tend to exploit it to their best advantage, often fraudulently. Bottom line is that until the US changes the constitution to deny citizenship to kids born here to undocumented workers - these kids are and will continue to be US citizens with all of the rights that legal residents, and US citizens "enjoy".

  • February 4, 2009

    5:50 PM

    Tom from Highland Park writes:

    The birthright citizenship law is outdated and needs to be changed. It is being abused each and every day to take advantage of America's largess, which if anyone has noticed, is not so large anymore.

  • March 6, 2009

    10:53 AM

    FeistyTiger writes:

    I am a college student right now. I find it highly frustrating all the perks people receive just for being a certain race, color, denomination, etc. I am neither racist, nor a bigot however I do consider myself a realist. So lets face reality people. Why on Earth should illegal aliens receive any benefits when the system is already expending hundreds, no thousands of dollars already just because a person is African, Native American, Baptist, Catholic, Hispanic, etc? It makes no sense to me. I pay for all of my tuition and books albeit its not quite as costly as it would be at a greater university it is still quite costly and this taking money away from legal residents and giving it to illegals is damned ridiculous and quite insulting as well. It is almost as if its saying: "well your doing what your supposed to be doing yet your still not good enough to receive financial help."

    Wake up and smell the coffee people. This country has taken too many liberties away from the honest, hardworking, legal citizen. It's high time we start taking some back.

  • April 3, 2009

    2:32 AM

    Slumberger writes:

    It is only getting worse since Obama was elected! In addition, for folks to think that their vote counted for something. Please. Anyone with any intelligence would know that the Electoral Votes were who determined who was going to be President. I think this disgusting offer of pity to the biggest beggars in the U.S. should come to the illegals as an insult. However, I'm not surprised that it doesn't. The solution to the U.S. citizens that pay taxes in this country as I have is to simply quit!!!! We can't deport 14 million illegals. Can we incarcerate far more legal citizens for not paying taxes??!!! I paid my way through college without any grants or loans for my BS degree. I worked as a Probation Officer for five years (in AZ) until I had a son with Autism, causing me to have to leave because daycares won't keep him. That was almost seven years ago. Since that time, he's started school and I have interviewed with several counties throughout the Denver Metro area. Guess what? I've been turned down at least ten times since 2005. You know why? Because I'm not bilingual. How about that!!! I'm now parenting two children in poverty (one disabled), can't get any money to go back to school for a more marketable degree because I already have a BS degree and don't qualify for Medicaid because I make too much from temporary Unemployment. I now have to beg non-profit organization to a small amount of money to allow me to get a certificate from the technical school here in Denver. Furthermore, if I do have a medical emergency, I guess I'll have to put off as if I am not from here and can't understand the language, so that I can get free medical help. Otherwise, I'll have an enormous judgment slapped on my credit by the hospital. It's so pleasing to know that I've worked my ass off for the past twenty-two years, earned a degree and get to live like a hobo. The only thing that brings me pleasure about my current situation is that I am not paying taxes now. Therefore, I don't have to contribute to the illegal immigrant cause. Yeah for me!!!!! I'm going to keep it going as long as I have to, until the country can get it together. I don't want to hear any bullshit from any illegal aliens about their wants. They can kiss my white ass!!!!!!!

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