February 3, 2009 9:31 AM
IRS problems bounce Daschle as HHS Secretary, Killefer as chief performance officer
If you're a Democratic appointee, don't you think your first stop should be at your neighborhood H&R Block office? Or at least slip a Turbo Tax disc into your computer. You know, just to brush up on things like, "Oh my, a car and driver provided to me are taxable? Who'd have thought?"
f you're a Democratic appointee, don't you think your first stop should be at your neighborhood H&R Block office? Or at least slip a Turbo Tax disc into your computer. You know, just to brush up on things like, "Oh my, a car and driver provided to me are taxable? Who'd have thought?"
Former Sen. Tom Daschle dropped his nomination as Health and Human Services Secretary because of tax issues.
President Barack Obama said Tuesday he accepted the withdrawal "with sadness and regret."Daschle has been battling for his nomination since it was disclosed he failed to pay more than $120,000 in taxes.
He said he's withdrawing because he's not a leader who has the full faith of Congress and will be a distraction.
Yet another Obama administration nominee is in trouble with the IRS.
Nancy Killefer, who failed for a year and a half to pay employment taxes on household help, withdrew her candidacy to be the first chief performance officer for the federal government on Tuesday.
Killefer was the second major Obama administration nominee to withdraw and the third to have tax problems complicate nominations after President Barack Obama announced he had chosen them.
In a brief letter to Obama, the 55-year-old executive with consulting giant McKinsey & Co. wrote that she had "come to realize in the current environment that my personal tax issue of D.C. unemployment tax could be used to create exactly the kind of distraction and delay" that must be avoided in responding to urgent economic problems.
She offered no further details of her tax difficulties.
February 2, 2009
10:00 AM
LCDR Mandingo writes:
Makes sense to me (peanuts though). GOP! They rob banks, don't they? I would rather GHWB's son, Neil Bush (MBA-dyslexia), return the $1 BILLION he stole from Denver's Silverado Bank. GHWB even made $16 million from insider-stock trading at Global Crossings, Inc., and the joint financially collapsed. Who can forget old "chicken-arms". Voter fraud too? John McCain and Charles Keating are known AZ S&L bank robbers. Keating gave old "chicken-POS" a $112K bribe. GHWB sent Keating to jail. TheGOP annoited McShame as their '08' prez candidate.
February 2, 2009
10:17 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
NO WONDER WHY DEMS ARE BIG TAX HIKERS--THEY DON'T PAY ANY!
February 2, 2009
10:19 AM
Tired of the cheneys and Bushes writes:
No lets not put anymore cheats and felons in power.
February 2, 2009
10:33 AM
jay writes:
try to remember, my little bigfooted troll..that we'll have to raise taxes for the conservative policy decisions of the last 8 years...regardless of what those evil democrats do.
February 2, 2009
10:34 AM
Shaggy writes:
Where did all the Democrats patriotism go to?
I guess this falls under rule #1 of the Democratic playbook.
1). What applies to everyone else does necessarily apply to us unless we say so and fits our personal agendas.
Bunch of hypocrites!
I thought Barry wasn't going to appoint liars, thieves and cheats to his cabinet.
I guess he is the biggest liar of them all!
February 2, 2009
10:34 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
“Make no mistake, tax cheaters cheat us all, and the IRS should enforce our laws to the letter. ” (Congressional Record, May 7, 1998, p. S4507, Senator Tom Daschle (D-SD))
The IRS new head--Tim Geithner--also happens to be a serial tax cheat and tax evader.
This is not an H&R Block thing...its an FBI thing. This cockeyed crowd needs to be perp walked.
February 2, 2009
10:47 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
14th Amendment: "...equal protection under the law."
Cheat, evade, dodge and then apologize. If it works for them, then under our 14th Amendment, it should also work equally for you.
February 2, 2009
10:47 AM
KW writes:
Regardless of whether or not this "error" was intentional, or merely an oversight, what is it with Obama's appointments having so much difficulty with back taxes?
"try to remember, my little bigfooted troll..that we'll have to raise taxes for the conservative policy decisions of the last 8 years...regardless of what those evil democrats do." --jay
Funny, not during the campaign, nor since his election have we heard Obama mention this anywhere.
I wonder why that is?
February 2, 2009
11:00 AM
JW writes:
"Funny, not during the campaign, nor since his election have we heard Obama mention this anywhere.
I wonder why that is?"
Because people dont like hearing that taxes need to be raised. Look at the last 8 years. We get tax cuts to stimulate the economy. Then during the boom time we keep spending on deficit. Why? Because Americans are dumb, and so politicians cater to it. Why be fiscally responsible when you can tell your constituants that they can keep their tax cuts and spending TOO!? Gets you elected all the time!
Besides, we are in a recession. We NEED to spend on deficit right now to stimulate the economy. Its just too damn bad McCain couldnt get the other Republicans to remove Bush's tax cuts once the economy picked up like he wants to to do Obama's. We would probably still be in a nasty economic state, but at least we wouldnt already have $10 trillion in debt.
"Cheat, evade, dodge and then apologize. If it works for them, then under our 14th Amendment, it should also work equally for you."
With taxes it does. Make a mistake on your taxes, and you will pay a fine, not go to jail. Repeated offenders intentionally defrauding the system go to jail, like Liona Helmsly or whatever her name was, and Wesley Snipes (is he in jail yet?). Typically, people DONT go to jail over taxes.
February 2, 2009
11:11 AM
Ben Former Democrat writes:
Apparently Democratic Leaders want to take your money away via taxes for their interests, yet feel no need to pay them themselves. It's like getting paid twice. That's quite clever.
February 2, 2009
11:20 AM
Shaggy writes:
jay and JW don't want to come to the realization that it was the Democrats who were saying freddy and franny were stable when the Republicans were trying for tougher regulations on the sub-prime loans they were handing out.
But hey, when they got Bush to bash, what the hell, keep slinging it and see how long it will continue to stick before the media will actually start doing their jobs of informing the uniformed and misguided brainwashed idiots about where the real blame lies!
February 2, 2009
11:25 AM
KW writes:
Get on now JW, jay's been using that tired worn out slogan of his for at least 2 years now.
In reality, what we are hearing and seeing from Obama is actually quite the opposite of jay's claim. Obama is proposing to cut taxes and increase spending to deal with what jay likes to call the result of "conservative policy decisions over the last eight years."
His statement really can't get anymore wrong.
February 2, 2009
12:28 PM
JW writes:
"jay and JW don't want to come to the realization that it was the Democrats who were saying freddy and franny were stable when the Republicans were trying for tougher regulations on the sub-prime loans they were handing out."
Because that is STUPID. Republicans did the same thing. Yes, Shaggy, I realize that for the idiotic Republican claims that "Hey, we wrote a bill!" means they actually tried to get regulations passed, but for anyone with a BRAIN the Repubs didnt even bring that bill to the floor.
Additionally, back in 05 when the claims that freddy and fanny were fine were made, it was true. Thats before the mortgage assets were written down. You wont understand what that means, but it realy doesnt matter, because you are an ideologue.
And finally, I have NEVER bashed Bush for the mortgage meltdown. Why? Because it was fraduluent business dealings WORLD WIDE that caused this, and the melt down is consequently WORLD WIDE. The US Goverment isnt responsible for WORLD WIDE policy.
"In reality, what we are hearing and seeing from Obama is actually quite the opposite of jay's claim. Obama is proposing to cut taxes and increase spending to deal with what jay likes to call the result of "conservative policy decisions over the last eight years.""
Well, thats sort of true. Agian, the big driver of this economic meltdown has been business policy, not government policy. The true part is that because of conservatve UN-conservative fiscal policy over the last, lets just call it 5 instead of 8, where massive deficit spending was done during good economic times, we WILL have to end up raising taxes more than we would if those conservative legilators had acually been conservative, and balanced the budget during the good times.
Because of what Obama is doing now we will be in for even MORE tax hikes at some point. In this instance, however, its what is necessary to spur the economy. You dimwits understood that when Reagan did it, but Obama is a Democrat.
February 2, 2009
1:13 PM
KingFishWatch writes:
"Because people dont like hearing that taxes need to be raised."
But Obama ran on "tax cuts for 95% of taxpayers." If taxes need to be raised (always a great strategy during a recession), then why did Omama lie and BS America--make that 95% of America?
AFFIRMATIVE ACTION...EMPTY-SUIT...LIAR
February 2, 2009
1:17 PM
Shaggy writes:
"In this instance, however, its what is necessary to spur the economy."
When are you dolts going to learn what and who stimulates the economy?
If this money does anything at all it will be short lived at best and most of it won't hit the market for several years.
Democrats love having a crisis so they can attach pet projects that wouldn't pass on their own.
And when the GOP votes against their pork infested bills they try to blame them for not being bipartisan.
February 2, 2009
1:25 PM
KW writes:
Shaggy - I think the bipartisan members of congress were the dems and reps that worked together and voted no on this bill. A sign of real teamwork.
Those other dems voting yes all by themselves were the partisan hacks.
February 2, 2009
1:26 PM
Ted Haggard writes:
When are you dolts going to learn what and who stimulates the economy?
A Big Package. Size does matter
February 2, 2009
1:49 PM
SASQUATCH writes:
ROUND 'EM UP % PERP WALK 'EM!
Washington is getting awfully crowded with tax cheats these days. This explains why they are so willing to spend so much money on “rescue” programs: It’s not their money! It’s OPM, other people’s money. Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner is a tax cheat. His confirmation hearing was delayed after the Senate Finance Committee discovered that the former New York Fed president failed to pay more than $34,000 in back taxes for 2001-2004. He’s since paid them, plus interest for the period. The man is now in charge of the IRS! Tom Daschle, the former US Senate Majority Leader picked to be Barack Obama’s Health and Human Services secretary, amended his tax returns for 2005-2007 on January 2, when he also paid $128,203 in back taxes and $11,964 in interest. In September 2008, Rep. Charlie Rangel, the chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee, the committee that basically writes tax legislation, wrote a check for $10,800 to pay the back taxes he owed from rental income on his Dominican Republic villa. If everyone in Washington paid their back taxes, the federal deficit might be significantly smaller. Bill Richardson, has anyone seen this crook lately? Where is he hidding? As for Blago, what did he know and when did he know it? Has Sen. Chris Dodd found his mortgage papers yet--the same papers that this "Friend of Angelo" (remember Countrywide?) promised to make public some 6 months ago? America is still waiting, Chris! Is F.D. Raines, former Fannie CEO, now living in Argentina? Where is he?
How can all these corrupt people--this DNC Hall of Shame--lead America to better times?
The Dems cheered when Ebbers, Skilling, Lay, Rigas and Kozloski were perp-walked and jailed. But now that its their crowd of crooks, I don't hear any cheering.
February 2, 2009
1:50 PM
Shaggy writes:
Your right KW, now that I think about it, that was the only bipartisanship of this Democratic pork invested package.
I am sure Prince Reid & Princess Pelosi will now have to punish those eleven Democrats who voted against their partisian bill.
From what I hear the Democrats did most of this in hiding with out ANY input from the Republicans.
Did you hear about Princess Pelosi's proposing over a hundred million for her personal pet project of contraceptives saying it would help stimulate the economy by having fewer pregnancies?
I am not making this crap up.
She is so stupid she wasn't even embarrassed by it.
Nice to see the transparency Barry keeps lying errrr talking about.
February 2, 2009
2:07 PM
Ben writes:
"She is so stupid she wasn't even embarrassed by it."
Pelosi is 2 spots away from pushing the little red button. Kinda scary eh Shaggy.....
February 2, 2009
2:37 PM
JW writes:
"Democrats love having a crisis so they can attach pet projects that wouldn't pass on their own."
LOL!! You just described the Shock Doctrine, and it was the platform for the ENTIRE Bush admin. F'ing Freedman INVENTED the damn thing.
Turn about is FAIR PLAY.
February 2, 2009
3:01 PM
Shaggy writes:
Which factual are you confused about Scooby?
I guess when you liptards can't debate the facts you resort to name calling.
Good job sport and I am sorry you hate and discriminate against gays.
And we are preached to think the republican party is the party of hate.
KW,
I don't know what is more scarier, having Pelosi two finger pulls away, having Biden one finger pull away or Barry having the control.
Anyway one looks at it it is a scary situation.
I am just glad Barry has no kahunas.
JW,
Do you think it is a good plan to spend $250,000 for each job created under this stupid plan?
February 2, 2009
3:13 PM
Poopy pants writes:
"I am just glad Barry has no kahunas.'
He wouldn't blow up his Muslim blood brothers.
I heard pork is now banned at the White House.
February 2, 2009
3:52 PM
Matt writes:
"Daschle latest Dem to get crosswise with the Taxman"
The latest that we KNOW about, rather. But he does hold the title of latest Dem to be given a pass by other Dems for what would land an average American in jail.
February 2, 2009
3:52 PM
JW writes:
"JW,
Do you think it is a good plan to spend $250,000 for each job created under this stupid plan?"
Before I answer that, where does this $250k per job number come from? What is it made up of? Is that JUST salaries, or is that all costs per job? What Kind of jobs are these? How much does it cost to pay for a job doing infrastructure work vs. education? Is that based on the entire bill including the tax cuts which really shouldnt be, or just the about $541 billion in actual spending?
Where does the number come from Shaggy? Without knowing that any answer is just ingnorance based opinion.
February 2, 2009
4:11 PM
Shaggy writes:
This is the amount Barry's plan will take to create each of the jobs he has plans for.
I am sorry, I thought maybe someone of your intellect knew about this.
Do the math.
http://slycapital.com/2008/12/26/obamas-plan-will-cost-250000-per-job/
February 2, 2009
4:19 PM
Max Panck, Aurora writes:
Daschle "fesses up" to a $120K tax liability which stems from a 'private car' service. Let's see - that means the value of the car service was appreciably more than the $120K.
I don't want to get into the mechanics of his return but when did these 'public' servants deem it necessary to have a private car service? What's wrong with driving yourself or public transportation?
My case - I've filed and complied with the IRS on a timely basis for 35 years. I drive a 12 year old car with 190k miles. If I tweak my 1040 just a little, I'd get audited and get thrown in the slammer.
D.C. is truly a different world; where do they get off with this sense of entitlement?
February 2, 2009
4:25 PM
KW writes:
"I... Forgot!"
It's the Steve Martin alibi. Works every time.
February 2, 2009
6:36 PM
JW writes:
"I am sorry, I thought maybe someone of your intellect knew about this.
Do the math."
How am I supposed to "Do the math" Shaggy, this fuckwit just throws out a number like you do. He doesnt tell me JACK about HOW he got that number.
Again, wtf does that number represent? Does it include the cost of the tax cuts? It shouldnt! Does it include only salaries? If so, this guy is an IDIOT. Does it include all the expenses associated with these jobs and if so, wtf were this guys assumptions regarding those expenses. Do they make SENSE? By "this guy" I mean the guy the author of your article sites who says these jobs will cost $250k each.
This is over your head Shaggy, I know. Just hoping it will get you thinking a bit about the stuff you just "believe" without any reason other than "YES! I like it!"
February 2, 2009
8:11 PM
jay writes:
"Get on now JW, jay's been using that tired worn out slogan of his for at least 2 years now."
and i'll continue to post inconvenient facts until you can refute them my little footsoldier seen here faithfully marching over a mountain made out of a molehill.
good little footsoldier.
march along.
February 2, 2009
10:03 PM
Iceman7 writes:
Mark
"Just an honest mistake? If the Senate believes Daschle is the right person for the job should he be confirmed?"
Ahh, let me see how many choices do we have? Democrats now control the senate. It is like asking someone that is riding north and needs to west, should he turn Left?
No mistake about it Mark, the Weasel knew exactly what he was doing. By the way, when normal citizens owe back taxes doesn't the IRS collect interest?
Hmmmm and if the Barry flavored creme de la creme doesn’t have to pay interest on money that is owed; why should anyone else?
February 2, 2009
10:07 PM
Anonymous writes:
jay=troll
February 2, 2009
10:21 PM
jay writes:
don't pout, cruton.
do you have anything to add? maybe something to refute the point or was whining all you had to offer?
February 3, 2009
6:25 AM
ditto writes:
What gets me about these incidence is the pass the media and democrats give these people. Democrats are the first to tell us this isn’t FAIR or that’s not FAIR . I find the interesting that when democrats like Geithner, Daschle and Rangle don’t want to play FAIR many Dems except it and look the other way. Even Obama has shown he’s flip flop the where he sets a thermostat, and where he wants us to set our thermostats. He sets his at 80 degrees, because he doesn’t like the cold, yet he tell us we can’t set ours above 72 degrees because it’s not FAIR to the rest of the world.
Democrats put their political leaders on pedestals and when these leaders fall off many dems except the excuses and spin . What’s worst is that when Geithner, Daschle and Rangle want to raise everyone’s taxes and the Republican oppose this, the dems in the media and around the country will call Republican mean spirited. Excuses and Spin
The more hope and change from the Obama administration we see, the more real the meaning becomes clear. DO AS WE SAY NOT AS WE DO.
February 3, 2009
7:46 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
SAYS IT ALL ABOUT DEMO TAXHIKERS:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_otfwl2zc6Qc/SYhVJeve5MI/AAAAAAAAJKA/1AKWFYK9Q10/s1600-h/taxes.jpg
February 3, 2009
8:14 AM
GenBalthus writes:
I am a Senator.
I write laws.
I wrote laws that put average citizens in jail for what I do on a daily basis.
I can "forget" to pay more money in taxes than most of you even earn in a year.
And when I've been kicked out of office by my constituents, I can be appointed to a Cabinet position and my tax cheating does not matter.
Why?
I am a Senator. The laws are for thee, not for me.
DON'T look at me that way! How dare you? What, you think that we live in a representative republic or something?
Alexander Hamilton put it best:
"'The People?' 'The People' is a Great Beast."
February 3, 2009
8:16 AM
Shaggy writes:
Now I understand why Democrats love to raise taxes on everyone because they don't pay them and when they get caught they play it off as an innocent mistake.
Can anyone imagine if it were a Republican seating all of these crooks?
OMG, the Dems would be having a pow wow.
Then again the Republicans couldn't get away with running someone with the radical back ground as Barry either.
Yes JW, under Barry's plan it will cost an average of 250,000 for each job created.
BTW, The longer it sits out exposing his Democratic pork filled head, the stinkier it becomes.
February 3, 2009
8:27 AM
JW writes:
Listen to you frothing at the mouth ideologues;
"No mistake about it Mark, the Weasel knew exactly what he was doing. By the way, when normal citizens owe back taxes doesn't the IRS collect interest?"
LOL. Man you just want to hate anything Democrat so bad youre willing to look like a complete idiot.
and youre not alone. First we had the whackos screaming about how daschle should be in jail, because any regular American would be.
Uh, no. They would have to pay their back taxes with interest, as you say...
Which Daschle DID.
"I find the interesting that when democrats like Geithner, Daschle and Rangle don’t want to play FAIR many Dems except it and look the other way."
You have a bit of a point here but you guys are still missing the point you should be attacking with. It doesnt matter.
What does matter is all the money Daschle has made off consulting with the medical profession. That represents a conflict of interest in terms of the position Obama wants to put Daschle in.
But you guys are too busy frothing at the mouth about hating Dems for anything youre told to hate them about to look at legitimate issues with his appointment.
February 3, 2009
8:28 AM
Treefrog writes:
What is so hypocritical is that Tom Daschle earlier said anyone caught not paying their taxes should be punished by the full extent of the law.
I happen to agree with and think we should start with him and use him as an example.
I don't think any administration in the history of America has had so many crooks picked to fill cabinets.
What an embarrassment.
February 3, 2009
9:02 AM
JW writes:
"Yes JW, under Barry's plan it will cost an average of 250,000 for each job created."
You keep saying that Shaggy, but you have no idea if its true or not.
Every job you create at your business costs the tax payers $50k in taxes you would otherwise be paying.
Now, I can SAY that, but WTF am I basing it on?
"What is so hypocritical is that Tom Daschle earlier said anyone caught not paying their taxes should be punished by the full extent of the law.
I happen to agree with and think we should start with him and use him as an example."
Jesus. Youre assuming that 'punnishment to the fullest extent of the law" is MORE than paying the back taxes and interest fine. Your wrong. Daschle has done what anyone in his situation would, pay the back taxes and the interest. There is no hypocrisy. There is no favors because hes a guy in power. Hes done what everyone else would have.
god damn you people are STUPID.
February 3, 2009
9:04 AM
Anonymous writes:
Obama already refuted your "inconvenient (non) facts" jaybird. I didn't even have to lift one finger to show how out of touch you are.
Obama's CUTTING taxes, not raising them. The only thing he's raising is the spending.
But don't you worry my little friend, you'll still be able to continue drinking your thrice daily dose of that non-fact milk you're so fond of.
We wouldn't have it any other way.
February 3, 2009
9:06 AM
Shaggy writes:
"What does matter is all the money Daschle has made off consulting with the medical profession. That represents a conflict of interest in terms of the position Obama wants to put Daschle in."
Your right and he is going to get grilled by the Republicans today and given a free pass by the Democrats. The Democrats don't give a shit what kind a dealings or relationship he has had in the past and will appoint him anyways.
February 3, 2009
9:25 AM
Shaggy writes:
Still having a hard time understanding JW.
BTW, Did you ask your instructor how having a capital gains tax holiday or just a cross the loard tax holiday will stimulate the economy.
Now even Barfey Franks admitted this is not a stimulus package and most of it will not hit the market until 2012.
The last "stimulus package" did not work and either will this one.
"$266,666.67 per Obama job
08Jan09
Obama announced today his stimulus plan will create or save 3 million jobs.
The cost of his plan is estimated at $800 billion to $1 trillion. If you take the low end of his estimate, that’s $266,666 spent on each of the 3 million jobs.
People who have lost their jobs in the private sector will be given new jobs in the public sector, jobs for which there has previously been no demand. $266,666 represents only the initial cost of creating new jobs or maintaining those that are no longer needed. The long term costs are far greater. Instead of these people working at private sector jobs, earning a wage determined by the market, they will work jobs that, according to the market, do not add value, and will earn a wage arbitrarily determined by a bureaucrat. Unemployment will be artificially lowered and value will be drained from the economy rather than added.
In his January 3 radio address, Obama claimed 80% of the 3 million new jobs would be created in the private sector. That means 2,400,000 jobs in the private sector and 600,000 government jobs.
However, any jobs created by the public sector are government jobs, whether they are associated with a “private” company or not. The government is creating and funding the new positions, reportedly at a cost of $266,666 for each one. None of the new, government jobs can properly be classified in the “private sector.”
The nature of the new jobs is unknown, but Obama has suggested repeatedly they will be “green jobs” and will dramatically enhance our infrastructure. He raved about Communist China’s infrastructural accomplishments during the Olympics, apparently envious of what their 1,000,000,000+ slave population can accomplish. So, some of our unemployed stock analaysts can expect to be put to work on roads and bridges, and others can look forward to more glamorous endeavors like “green jobs.”
$266,666 per job is a surprising admission of inefficiency by the Obama team before their administration even begins. They perhaps failed to crunch the numbers, or knew scarcely anyone would notice the full weight of their announcement."
http://rationalactor.wordpress.com/2009/01/08/26666667-per-obama-job/
Damn you are stupid!
February 3, 2009
9:29 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
OPERATION CHAOS...MORE OBAMBA SCREW-UPS!
WASHINGTON (AP) - Nancy Killefer, who failed for a year and a half to pay employment taxes on household help, has withdrawn her candidacy to be the first chief performance officer for the federal government, the White House said Tuesday.
Killefer was the second major Obama administration nominee to withdraw (Richardson was first) and the third to have tax problems complicate their nomination after President Barack Obama announced their selection.
In yet another unrelated Obamanation screw-up, it was revealed that Obamba's pick to head Dept. Commerce--Sen. Gregg of NH--once voted to kill Commerce which he now agrees to head!
Finally, it was revealed that Obamba is now feuding with is generals (like Petraus) and the Sec. of Defense about his 160 month and out timetable.
And of course his increasingly unpopular and disapproved "PORKULUS," HR-1, is in for a major overhaul in the Senate!
THIS AIN'T LIKE ORGANIZING A NEIGHBORHOOD, IS IT OBAMBA?
AFFIRMATIVE ACTION...EMPTY-SUIT...CHAOS!
February 3, 2009
9:39 AM
JW writes:
"BTW, Did you ask your instructor how having a capital gains tax holiday or just a cross the loard tax holiday will stimulate the economy."
First, Ive said I think there could be a benefit from a business tax holiday.
Second, if I asked my instructors what you want me to about capital gains they would look at me like Im an idiot and ask "Have you been in class?" Not because they would agree with you Shaggy. Because when the market is down 34% capital gains isnt an issue.
As for your post, again, no breakdown of the costs hes associating. Hes claiming $266k per job, but hes not backing it up. Wanting some actual evidence of his claims validity doesnt make me stupid Shaggy. Buying it hook line and sinker without any evidence makes YOU an idiot ideologue.
February 3, 2009
9:47 AM
KW writes:
Obama already refuted your "inconvenient (non) facts" jaybird. I didn't even have to lift one finger to show how out of touch you are.
Obama's CUTTING taxes, not raising them. The only thing he's raising is the spending.
But don't you worry my little friend, you'll still be able to continue drinking your thrice daily dose of that non-fact milk you're so fond of.
We wouldn't have it any other way.
February 3, 2009
9:47 AM
JMH writes:
Hey NEO-CON wussies!
Wasn't that tax-cheat - Joe "The Plummer" your hero just 2 months ago?
Ironic (but not un-expected) that I didn't hear ONE of you hypocrites whining to put him in jail!
Can any of you EVER post something without showing your partisan hypocracy? EVER? LOL...
February 3, 2009
10:01 AM
Shaggy writes:
JW,
If I told you that Mitt Romney also said cutting capital gains tax and payroll taxes would stimulate the economy would you believe me then?
Or because he has a "R" in front of his name means he doesn't know what he is talking about?
Guess what, he said it and so has many other economists.
But I guess you know more than all of them.
I guess if it doesn't come from Greenspan you won't believe anything.
BTW, He is an idiot!
February 3, 2009
10:06 AM
Independent Voter writes:
Rank and file voters are starting to feel the remorse now that political business as usual becomes visible. Obama's "Because I won" rationale won't fly.
When Obama abandons one campaign promise after another as the taxpayers get more insight into what pork actually is hidden in the stimulus bill democrats crafted, those friendly approval ratings will slide (and they have).
The thumb-in-the-eye message to struggling people is: "Yeah I know what we SAID, but old style democratic politics is just what we always DO.". Obama,Pelosi, Durbin, and Reid downplay the billions in waste while they defend cabinet appointees who cheat on their taxes (amounts triple of what most families earn in a year). Now that is plain arrogant.
February 3, 2009
10:48 AM
Shaggy writes:
What number is Nancy Killefer of the corrupt picks by Barryboy to run this country.
Hope and change is coming to America.
He's a new kind of Politician.
He won't appoint lobbyists, liars and theives.
Is there anything he promised that he has kept?
Didn't think so.
February 3, 2009
11:01 AM
JMH writes:
"He's a new kind of Politician.
He won't appoint lobbyists, liars and theives." - shaggy
Guess you just want more Republicans appointed then huh?
Well this is all over... Daschle has resigned from consideration.
I say good.
This is the way things should have worked. Anyone want to bet that if McCain became president we would have nothing but tax-cheats, lobbists and corporate power brokers running the show for ANOTHER 4 years with no oversight?
Maybe the NeoCon hero Joe "the Plummer & tax-cheat" would have been available since he is unemployed due to the failed NeoCon economic policies of shifting growth and wealth to the top 2 percent, un-regulated capitalism, outsourcing of jobs and plenty of corruption to go around.
February 3, 2009
11:11 AM
jay writes:
smart move by tom.
tom gets it. you're either part of the solution or part of the problem.
kw are you STILL refusing to acknowledge that we'll eventually have to raise taxes because of the debt incurred under the last several republican administrations??
talk about the epitome of willful ignorance.
thanks for once again being a wonderful example for the class.
February 3, 2009
11:28 AM
Matt writes:
She was the fourth fraud nominated, Shaggy.
Richardson, Geithner, Daschle and now Killefer.
Hey JW, before assuming, I have to ask - As a fiscal conservative, how do you feel about tax cheats being given these high levels of responsibility? Are you in agreement with Obama that people who break tax laws for personal financial reasons should making decisions for the rest of us?
February 3, 2009
11:43 AM
KW writes:
jay - Are you still refusing to acknowledge that you are the only one still making that most ridiculous statement?
You certainly aren't speaking for Obama -or- speaking with any amount of relevant facts in your corner. But we've come to expect that from you. It's in your nature.
Maybe when you're a little older we'll begin to ween you off that non-fact milk you drink so frequently... perhaps move you up to 1% for starters... when you're a little older that is.
February 3, 2009
11:55 AM
am 760 writes:
Good Tom, if you can't play by the rules, get out and sit on the side lines.
February 3, 2009
12:03 PM
Anonymous writes:
"If I told you that Mitt Romney also said cutting capital gains tax and payroll taxes would stimulate the economy would you believe me then?
Or because he has a "R" in front of his name means he doesn't know what he is talking about?"
No Shaggy, because he has an R after his name his talking points are "Tax cuts, tax cuts, more tax cuts, and tax cuts".
Look, I dont know what to say man. You believe what you want. The other tax cuts are a viable option, sure. I agree with Romney AND Rush there.
Capital gains are already really low, AND no one is making any capital gains, so the taxes on capital gains arent an issue. I dont agree with them there. Romney is just sticking to message, because the man is smart enough to know that lowering capital gains taxes to 0% wont do a damn thing, because taxes on $0 capital gains is $0 no matter what the rate.
The bs argument that lower capital gains spurs investment wont fly either. We have had TONS of investment for the last 20 years. The capital gains tax didnt stop anyone.
"Guess what, he said it and so has many other economists.
But I guess you know more than all of them."
Funny, youve NEVER sited any of these "many other economists". Now, if you arent full of shit and talking out your ass (lying), Id be interested to hear "many other economists" saying CAPITAL GAINS TAX CUTS would be good right now, AND WHY. Dont forget the WHY Shaggy. Its just an opinion without the WHY.
"I guess if it doesn't come from Greenspan you won't believe anything.
BTW, He is an idiot!"
LOL. Now that is pathetic. The man was wrong ONCE. You spent years idolizing the guy, and hes wrong once, and you just flip flop like a fish out of water.
You people and your reliance on fallacious thinking just make me laugh. Its advertising your stupidity, your ignorance, and your gullibility, and you just KEEP DOING IT. And yes, it is a fallacious argument to say that because someone is wrong once they are wrong all the time, or most of the time, or they are an idiot. The man's history of being correct is FAR bigger than his history of being wrong.
"Hey JW, before assuming, I have to ask - As a fiscal conservative, how do you feel about tax cheats being given these high levels of responsibility? Are you in agreement with Obama that people who break tax laws for personal financial reasons should making decisions for the rest of us?"
Thats a strawman argument. Obama isnt in favor of putting people in charge who break tax laws FOR PERSONAL FINANCIAL REASONS. Hes in favor of putting smart people in the right positions, and provided their tax mistakes were really mistakes, that isnt a reason to take them out of the discussion. You just ASSUME that these guys did this on purpose for personal gain. I figure thats what the CONFIRMATION HEARINGS are supposed to determine. IF they did it on purpose, they wouldnt/shouldnt get confirmed.
February 3, 2009
12:16 PM
history buff writes:
If Tom owes $120,000 for back taxes, that's one thing. But if penalties and interest are included in the sum, well...he might only owe something like $80,000 in back taxes.
February 3, 2009
12:26 PM
KW writes:
Even so, I'm not so certain I could refer to $80,000 as "only $80,000." That's still one heck of a hunk of change and I'm sure the IRS would agree.
On the flip side, Geinther owed 4 years of taxes but only had to pay the 2 most recent years, and on top of that he didn't have to pay any of the penalties and interest.
So the question still remains, why didn't Geinther have penalties and interest included in his sum?
February 3, 2009
12:28 PM
SASQUATCH writes:
PICTURE OF THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION:
http://a.abcnews.com/images/Entertainment/ht_circus_11_060105_ssh.jpg
What a month! Had enough? I didn't vote for him!
February 3, 2009
12:39 PM
prima facie writes:
Oompa, loompa, doompity, doo ...
February 3, 2009
1:07 PM
Matt writes:
"You just ASSUME that these guys did this on purpose for personal gain."
YOU just assume they didn't while at the same time, what pea brain DOESN'T know that you have to pay income taxes on compensation for services as a *competent consultant (ironically) - especially when that figure was $30K/month!!!
How about Geithner using Turbo Tax? Let me repeat that to you, JW - The treasury secretary of the United States, uses Turbo Tax. Yet you lend more weight to the argument that turbo tax was the reason that his *little oversight over many years* happened and NOT that Geithner, our treasury secretary, choose to use turbo tax for his millions in income.
It's like saying hey, the reason the accident happened is because the guy was drunk - not because he decided to drink in the first place.
"IF they did it on purpose, they wouldnt/shouldnt get confirmed."
Lets just say it wasn't on purpose - should somebody who is prone to these types of 'mistakes' be confirmed? Are there no responsible liberals that Obama can nominate?
February 3, 2009
1:13 PM
Shaggy writes:
"After less than a week in office, Barack Obama's approval rating plunges 15 points" in only three days!
Ohhh Ouch...Thats gotta hurt.
What happened to his indestructible Teflon?
But who pays attention to polls right jay?
hehehe
Looks like his "economy recover package" is beginning to stink the more people see how much pork the Democrats through in it.
They were trying to instill fear in the American people in a time of crisis to get their pet projects passed knowing they would never pass on their own merits.
Change and hope we can all believe in.
Fine JW, Believe what you want, I believe in what has worked and tax cuts is proven to work and Socialism has been proven not to work and in case you don't know, Europe is on the brink of bankruptcy like Iceland and Greenland!
BTW, Greenspan's failure to see the mortgage collapse was very costly.
February 3, 2009
1:14 PM
Tom D. writes:
... And the wheels continue to fall off this donkey wagon.
Leave it to democrats to saw themselves off the free end of a plank. What a bunch of macaroons.
February 3, 2009
1:23 PM
Anonymous writes:
I'm not so certain I could refer to $80,000 as "only $80,000." -- KW
Now I know where the expression dense as a post comes from.
What a month! Had enough? I didn't vote for him! -- Squat
I would have never guessed. That is quite a revelation.
I don't think any administration in the history of America has had so many crooks picked to fill cabinets. -- Treefrog
That's why thinking is dangerous for some people.
"$266,666.67 per Obama job -- Shaggy
Well, yea. You're right if you divide the stimulus package my one minute instead of two years.
February 3, 2009
1:26 PM
KW writes:
I noticed that too Shaggy, poll numbers are really beginning to sag.
Even the once popular stimulus package is only being supported "as proposed" by a mere 38% of voters, according to the Gallup Poll.
That's quite a drop from 7-10 days ago.
February 3, 2009
1:34 PM
Oink Oink writes:
Speaking of "pork".
If Muslims are so offended by it, why isn't Obama trying to get rid of it in the stimulus package?
February 3, 2009
1:39 PM
JW writes:
"YOU just assume they didn't"
No chump. I was pretty damn clear that the issue should be taken care of in the confirmation hearings. Im assuming NEITHER guilt nor innocence.
"How about Geithner using Turbo Tax? Let me repeat that to you, JW - The treasury secretary of the United States, uses Turbo Tax. Yet you lend more weight to the argument that turbo tax was the reason that his *little oversight over many years* happened and NOT that Geithner, our treasury secretary, choose to use turbo tax for his millions in income. "
As the treasury sec. his job is alot bigger than tax policy. And none of your arguments actually say anything about his abilities. You INFER that he hasnt got any, but thats a fallacious argument AGAIN. The fact that he used turbo tax doesnt say anything about his skills setting fiscal policy for a nation, jackass. There are about 50 reasons why he might use the program, including TIME SAVINGS and EASE OF USE. The fact that he used turbo tax says NOTHING about how smart the guy is. You would actually have to interview the guy, check up on his educational and work background...you know, ask some questions and interview the guy.
And in the end he was confirmed. With what he did in the private sector Im not surprised. Apparently he has the skills, whether he uses turbo tax or not.
"Fine JW, Believe what you want, I believe in what has worked and tax cuts is proven to work"
This is the problem with you Shaggy, youre fucking ignorant. You dont know WHY tax cuts work. You cant deal with tax cuts NOT ALWAYS working. You dont understand SHIT accept that you LIKE lower taxes. Again, I think you should take a vacation in Somalia so you can see what your perfect world looks like. The have the best taxes ANYWHERE.
"Socialism has been proven not to work"
Accept that you would call England and Norway socialist. Norway has the highest standard of living in the world, and England is right up there. HOW THE HELL is that proof of socialism not working? What about Germany? Have they been "proven not to work"? Japan? Its like saying Ferrari has been proven unable to build a fast car.
"Europe is on the brink of bankruptcy like Iceland and Greenland!"
They are having problems just like us, and for the same reason.
"BTW, Greenspan's failure to see the mortgage collapse was very costly."
Wow genius, you FINALLY said something that isnt stupid. Obvious like a slap in the face, but not stupid.
Guess who else made the same mistake and it was really costly? MILLIONS OF PEOPLE.
One mistake does not make the man wrong about EVERYTHING. And idiot, you better hope Im right about that, because his policy ideas are still the part of the basis for conservative fiscal thought.
February 3, 2009
2:21 PM
Shaggy aka turning socialist one bill at a time writes:
Ummm, JW, Yes I understand how cutting people taxes stimulates the economy, why is it that Democrats don't?
I believe if we had a six(?)month tax holiday by not withholding any taxes, minus SS, from paychecks and let the people have it instead of handing out stimulus checks would be a far better way to get people to start spending thus stimulating the economy.
Yea KW, the plastic rock star seems to be losing all his luster the more people find out about him.
The process of properly vetting a candidate used to take care of this but now media dictates who will be vetted and who will not.
February 3, 2009
2:35 PM
Kim K. writes:
"Mr. Obama stands behind former Sen. Daschle absolutely, positively, 100%."
Press Release prior to Daschle's withdrawal.
---whoa. Now that is very poor judgement.
What? There's MORE?!?
February 3, 2009
2:39 PM
heads up rushs ass writes:
Yeah, americas failing because of the obstruction from the neo con right and the repubs are rejoicing. Tax cuts work, yeah right, thats why the economy is the worst its ever been, but lets just keep doing the same thing and expect different results. F*&^ing repubs want to take out anything that might actual stimulate the economy like jobs, but you have the shags of the world licking their balls for all its worth.
As I said earlier, let the repubs continue to obstruct, say no and do nothing. Than in 2010 we can vote out the rest of these idiots and actually get america moving again.
I have never heard of such idiots before than the partisan right wingers on this blog.
You anti-american trailer trash righties are pathetic and need to move back to wyoming or the south.
February 3, 2009
2:39 PM
JW writes:
"Ummm, JW, Yes I understand how cutting people taxes stimulates the economy, why is it that Democrats don't?"
No, you don't. You understand that it does because thats what youve been TOLD. But you cannot get a simple thing like there are no capital gains being taxed so capital gains rates are meaningless, through your head. Youre stupid and youre ignorant, and youre the worst kind of stupid and ignorant because you think youre smart and knowledgeable. It takes more than listening and repeating Republican talking points to know wtf youre talking about.
Additionally, you believe every tax cut is a good one. That being the case, you obviously dont understand anything about how, why, and when tax cuts are appropriate, and when taxes should be raised. You dont understand FISCAL POLICY. You do understand REPUBLICAN TALKING POINTS. And you parrot them very well. Its why you support tax cuts even during a boom while we are spending at a deficit. Its why youve NEVER pulled the lever for ANYONE who wasnt a Republican. Its why you repeat absolute stupidity like "socialism is proven not to work" ad nausea.
"I believe if we had a six(?)month tax holiday by not withholding any taxes, minus SS, from paychecks and let the people have it instead of handing out stimulus checks would be a far better way to get people to start spending thus stimulating the economy."
Why? And dont say "because tax cuts are good at stimulating the economy". Give me some numbers.
Or, just blabber a bunch of bs. Its what youre good at.
February 3, 2009
2:41 PM
Anonymous writes:
"Ummm, JW, Yes I understand how cutting people taxes stimulates the economy, why is it that Democrats don't?" - shaggy
I know you live in a "no thinking zone" based outside of reality, but that is all the Bush administration did (well besides letting the wolves watch the hen house with all the deregulation) for 8 years... pretty safe to say that cutting taxes isn't really "STIMULATING the ECONOMY". If it did, you really think we would even be having this discussion? If it did, why is the econmoy in need of "stimulating"?
Oh, and you know taxes do pay for tousands of services that we use everyday. You want everyone to stop paying taxes, fine... but don't start crying if bridges fall, roads don't get fixed, police don't come when you call them, your house burns down while you try to call 911, etc. etc...
Moron. You knwo what is really scary, this simple thinking actually makes sense to you...
BTW... I wouldn't exactly call 2 out of 3 Americans approving of Obama's job poor... LOL... You NeoCons are sooo afraid he will fix the mess you made that you have done nothing but try to tear him down. You know if he succeeds and the GOP did nothing but get in the way, your party of radicals will be sidelined FOREVER... so please, keep up the irrational and un-American thinking!
February 3, 2009
2:48 PM
Matt writes:
"The fact that he used turbo tax doesnt say anything about his skills setting fiscal policy for a nation, jackass. There are about 50 reasons why he might use the program, including TIME SAVINGS and EASE OF USE. The fact that he used turbo tax says NOTHING about how smart the guy is"
You're just wrong, JW - A responsible multi-millionare doesn't do his/her taxes on Turbo Tax.
Hes either a thief looking to defer blame, or hes incompetent. Both should disqualify him to be in charge of anybody else's money. Put the common good over liberalism for once.
February 3, 2009
3:02 PM
Shaggy writes:
It's kinda like this JW.
Just because you want to believe the scientists that believe we are going through a MAN MADE global warming phase does not mean they are right and that there aren't any Scientists who disagree with that theory.
Believe what you want.
I happen to believe in proven facts rather than theories and that is the difference between you and me and Republicans and Democrats.
February 3, 2009
3:16 PM
JMH writes:
"Even the once popular stimulus package is only being supported "as proposed" by a mere 38% of voters, according to the Gallup Poll." - KW
Way to cherry pick your intelligence like a good foot soldier... I notice you omit that another 37% want it passed with changes... You could put me in this group as well. Sure there are things everyone would love to change... I actually like one (just one) Republican idea and that is letting people re-fi their houses at a low interest rate of about 4%... The tax cuts the GOP mindlessly support over and over don't work. If they did, we would be here!!!
Just like "Staying the course" in Iraq... you NeoCons never learn from your mistakes... Any of you guys learn to tie your shoes yet since you are probably still trying the way you think it should be done the first time you tried?
But you laughingly place this statement above with the false hope that people are turning against it when 76% want it to PASS in some form ... only 17% of you radicals don't want any package at all!
So the American public is firmly for the Recovery and Investment in America bill (Stimulus)... but some want changes... that doesn't mean it is un-popular. Hell, get 10 people in a room and ask them what they want on their pizza, you will probably get 10 different answers... Doesn't mean that no one wants pizza for lunch!
Just wondering, do all you NeoCon stooges get classes online on how to SPIN info? WOW... You guys would make Bill O'Rielly proud!
February 3, 2009
3:18 PM
JW writes:
"You're just wrong, JW - A responsible multi-millionare doesn't do his/her taxes on Turbo Tax."
Thats your opinion. Youre welcome to it.
"Hes either a thief looking to defer blame, or hes incompetent. Both should disqualify him to be in charge of anybody else's money."
Ahh well. Your elected officials disagree, including the Republican ones. They know more about it than you, so you'll forgive me if I give not the least bit of a shit about what you think. The man's resume tells me that even if he made a mistake using turbo tax, hes got plenty of smarts and experience to hold down the position. It was a question of his motives, and since hes been confirmed, I guess it was just a mistake. I certainly have no information to say otherwise. Neither do you, but you have...ideology. Who needs info?
"Put the common good over liberalism for once."
Actually, social liberalism is in the interest of the common good. The fact that you wingnut ideologues consistently misuse the word, and apparently cannot use a dictionary, doesnt change it.
You do realize that the ENTIRE constitution of this great nation is nothing more than a list of guaranteed LIBERTIES, and that consequently, our way of life is LIBERAL by definition? You do realize that if you look up the word liberal in the dictionary (is a book that lists words and what they mean) you will see described there OUR form of government?
Hell, even fiscal conservatism is built on liberal frameworks. The end result of fiscal conservatism is that people have the highest amount of LIBERTIES regarding what they do with their own money. Thats WAY over your head though.
Stupid, ignorant, ideologue. Buy an education.
February 3, 2009
3:26 PM
Shaggy writes:
JW,
I noticed you forgot where I am from so I'm thinking your memory is not serving you well lately, did you also forget that I own my own Business and you don't?
I am the man, you work for the man.
Understand little peon?
Now get back to your cubicle before your boss takes away your potty breaks.
Your not the sharpest loon in the flock now are you!
Not a question, merely stating a fact.
February 3, 2009
3:28 PM
JW writes:
"Just because you want to believe the scientists that believe we are going through a MAN MADE global warming phase does not mean they are right and that there aren't any Scientists who disagree with that theory."
Do you really think people WANT to believe in global warming Shaggy? Are you really that stupid? I think you are.
"I happen to believe in proven facts rather than theories and that is the difference between you and me and Republicans and Democrats."
Yea well, the problem is that youve taken a fact that is sometimes true "tax cuts are good" and turned it into an ideology that it is ALWAYS true.
I mean, its a fact that water is good for plants. Its also a fact that you can kill a plant by over watering.
February 3, 2009
3:30 PM
KW writes:
Cute JMH - For your info, "cherry picking" requires reviewing several and choosing the best fit. I, after reading Shaggy's post merely went to the (read: 1) most reliable polling site and gave you what they reported. I have a real job that doesn't afford me the time to cherry pick like your buddy jay does.
If you'd like I can show you Rasmussen (the numbers are even worse than Gallup) but you'd probably whine about that even more.
BTW - I distinctly remember my post saying "only being supported "as proposed" by a mere 38% of voters."
Do you understand what "as proposed" means?
February 3, 2009
3:34 PM
Ted writes:
And all you have is opinion moron. Rehashed, reheated, prechewed opinion. And you berate others as idiots? That is the pot calling the kettle black.
What a loser.
February 3, 2009
3:38 PM
Mickie from Lodo writes:
Did jay develop an allergy to the polls all of a sudden?
February 3, 2009
3:38 PM
Shaggy writes:
Damn JW,
"Do you really think people WANT to believe in global warming Shaggy?"
I even put MAN MADE in capital letters in hopes to make it easier for you to understand but I guess I failed at that too.
Yes, many Democrats cannot wait to fabricate a MAN MADE global warming tax and they are doing it as w speak.
Have you ever heard of carbon credits?
How about cap and trade?
Are you really this stupid you can see it?
Yes I think you are!
February 3, 2009
3:41 PM
Shaggy writes:
"Are you really this stupid you [can't] see it?
Yes I think you are!"
February 3, 2009
3:45 PM
NeoCon Soldier writes:
Liberties? Who needs liberties JW?
Don't you know there are a bunch of poor, uneducated Jawa's from halfway around the world out to get us and we need to get rid of our civil liberties, not to mention our rule of law and our respect for freedom and human rights to protect ourselves from them and to protect our freedom in the process?
Why do you hate America? If we keep those bothersome civil liberties, we will be bowing to Mecca by this time next week, since Obama is one of them and we all are too stupid to see it! I mean after all, he doesn't have a flag pin on and his middle name is Hussan... how much proof do you need!
All you need to do is trust the GOP... They would never abuse their power and they are never wrong about everything. After all, the Middle East is now pro-America now and the economy is rocking thanks to Bush and his soldiers!
I can't wait for all the extra money in this country to trickle down to me. I will never have to work again. Nevermind I lost my job three years ago to some guy in India. Damn Democrats! It's all their fault...
February 3, 2009
3:55 PM
Matt writes:
"They know more about it than you, so you'll forgive me if I give not the least bit of a shit about what you think."
Your lying again and your response in itself proves it. You live for getting in that last shot.
"Actually, social liberalism is in the interest of the common good."
Tell that to the residents of Michigan and Detroit - America's most liberal city. (link below)
http://www.nysun.com/new-york/citys-liberal-but-its-no-detroit/18489/
February 3, 2009
4:05 PM
JMH writes:
Cute JMH - "For your info, "cherry picking" requires reviewing several and choosing the best fit." - KW
Ummm no... the official definition is...
"Cherry picking is the act of pointing at individual cases or data that seem to confirm a particular position, while ignoring a significant portion of related cases or data that may contradict that position."
...which is exactly what you did. To be honest you did say "as proposed" which was true... but then you were "ignoring a significant portion of related cases or data that may contradict that position" to make it look like the Stimulus package was - in your own words "once popular"... even though by this polls numbers 76% SUPPORT the bill in some form.
This is "SPIN"... but whatever makes you feel better about supporting the obstruction of a package that the vast MAJORITY wants... admittingly maybe not totally in it's current form, but they do want it! It isn't "once popular"... it still is with some changes...and the MOST popular choice of the 4 options to this question is still the 38% that say "as proposed"!
But this is why we have a system in place in this country that makes compromise an ideal. I know after 8 years of trying to shove every NeoCon failed idea down our throats when the GOP had total control, this is an unfamiliar idea... but it is one that works and has for over 200 years.
BTW... With 64% of the American public behind Obama, the American public giving almost total, fillibuster proof, control over Congress to the Dem party and the fact that the GOP has taken a whooping in the last 2 elections... it's pretty safe to say, most Americans don't want too much of the same ol' same ol' that the GOP is selling!
February 3, 2009
4:06 PM
JW writes:
Matt, Ill talk with you about it. Ill argue with you about it. But in the end youre an ideolgoue. Youre not going to change. Jeez. Shaggy never does. Do I really care about that? No. If I did, I wouldnt be able to stand you people. But since I dont care, Im able to have some fun on the blog with you idi...sorry. You guys.
Have a nice day.
Nice post NeoCon. Its gona go right over their heads though.
February 3, 2009
4:07 PM
Matt writes:
"I can't wait for all the extra money in this country to trickle down to me. I will never have to work again."
Why wait? Vote Democratic and Obama will steal other people's property so you can stay a lazy and unproductive member of society! Trickle down doesn't mean your entitlement minded ass gets handed anything. It means that somebody richer than you starts a project and needs people to work on it so you get an opportunity at a job. But it's not like you really want to work either so you might as well keep on complaining about being poor. Eventually somebody will feel sorry for you.
February 3, 2009
4:08 PM
Mellow White Dude writes:
So the Republicans are all for a good Economic Stimulus bill, meaning one that would stop taxing the rich and stop any corporate taxes and also, somehow, further ruin the environment and whatever. As a result of this clear “small government” philosophy the big-spending corporate-welfare closeted homosexuals adopted last week, GOP congressional leaders have found the parts they just can’t tolerate in the Economic Stimulus legislation: the parts that would create jobs and build American infrastructure. Yes we can’t!
Look, whatever anybody’s uninformed opinions about this Rescue the Economy package, you should at least be able to reconcile “support for economic stimulus legislation” with “support for legislation that will throw a bunch of money at the economy, in the form of money paid for goods and services, manufacturing and labor, and other traditional uncontroversial gears of Capitalism.”
So, here are some specific things the GOP will not condone, in this bill they’re not going to vote for, anyway:
* A billion dollars extra for the 2010 U.S. Census, which is going to pay good money to many jobless people in every American town — and shore up Lockheed-Martin, which is getting $500 million to build the data systems and run the machinery.
* $75 million for FBI employee salaries, because why would you want to pay America’s top cops to do law enforcement and investigations, in America?
* $500 million for Mississippi River flood control projects, which would employ thousands of laborers and keep dozens of construction companies in business, because nothing makes Republicans happier than seeing a Katrina repeat on the teevee every other hurricane season.
* $200 million for green vehicles on U.S. military bases and $600 million to replace the federal fleet of cars with hybrids, because only a gay communist could see the economic benefits of $800 bmillion in sales for U.S. auto manufacturers while simultaneously cutting the government’s gasoline bill by billions per year.
* $1.4 billion for rural garbage-disposal and recycling programs, because who but an Islamo-Fascist would want to provide much-needed jobs for the Red State countryside while keeping toxic garbage out of those people’s drinking water?
* $125 million to rebuild the broken, rotten, third-world sewer system of our Nation’s Capital. You give the blacks this, and who knows what they’ll want next! And by “give,” we mean “pay a decent wage to laborers in D.C., to rebuild their sewers.”
* $6 billion to pay dozens of big regional contractors, hundreds of local businesses and tens of thousands of American workers to retrofit federal buildings so that they’ll be energy efficient.
* $200 million for computer centers at community colleges, because if poor unskilled workers want to “learn the computer,” they should just go to Stanford instead of complaining.
February 3, 2009
4:13 PM
Shaggy writes:
LoL Matt,
Isn't this JW character a trip?
I don't think I have ever met anyone who thinks they know more about everything than him.
Well except for Barney Fifth, he could give him a run for his money.
February 3, 2009
4:18 PM
JW writes:
Nice post Mellow dude. Add all that up and youre talking about 1.2% of the total bill. Not only are all those things completely commie, but I think holding up the entire stimulus bill over 1.2% is positively American!
"If you cant have a perfect economic stimulus bill, you'll have no economy at all."
I still think Colbert said it the best.
February 3, 2009
4:20 PM
JMH writes:
Matt, you are a d*ck!
Keep trying to say that people who are poor don't want to work... Just ignore the fact that the Republicans actually encourage outsourcing, did nothing about illegal immigration so they could keep the flow of cheap labor coming and undercutting working American wages and have shifted ALL the wealth in this country to the top 2%!
But if that caracture you punks want to convey about the MAJORITY of Americans (there are more Dems in this country in shear numbers, in fact even independants out number the dying party known as the GOP) amkes you feel better about hating your fellow Americans, well I suppose that is your right... Loser...
The problem now is there are NO jobs!!! Just about everyone would work if they could, regardless of political affiliation, but that is the problem with you silver spoon babies that have had everyting handed to you... you equate poor with lazy and that is just not the case!
February 3, 2009
4:42 PM
Matt writes:
"Matt, Ill talk with you about it. Ill argue with you about it. But in the end youre an ideolgoue."
Yea, OK JW. I'm an ideologue because:
I think Obama's people deserve the same treatment as Wesly Snipes for doing the same thing Wesly Snipes did.
And you think they deserve to be in charge of the country.
IDEOLOGUE??? And here I was thinking that you had at least one foot off the farm.
February 3, 2009
4:48 PM
Matt writes:
"Republicans actually encourage outsourcing, did nothing about illegal immigration"
And this is a reason to vote for Democrats?
February 3, 2009
5:45 PM
KingFishWatch writes:
BLACK BLAGO:
Elevating crooks, cheats, liars, evaders, dodgers, snake-oil peddlers, flim-flam artists and frauds will provide the moral fiber, character and leadership needed to elevate all of America!
CHANGE & HOPE...and a little BS--we got a black shuck 'n jive Chicago Blago running this show!
February 3, 2009
6:14 PM
JW writes:
No Matt. Youre an ideologue because you believe all things Republican regardless of reality. You just repeat whatever youre told by Republicans or their mouthpieces.
The best example I have of this is Shaggy's whole shtick on the mortgage meltdown.
He believes that Democrats are at fault because they didnt allow for new regulation.
Now, lets just ignore the fact that this is a world wide problem and Dems CERTAINLY werent setting world wide policy while they were the minority party in the USA.
Lets ignore that the bill Republicans use to tell us they were trying to regulate never made it out of a Republican controlled committee.
Lets ignore the fact that Republicans have been screaming for less regulation since Reagan took office (and before really).
Lets just look at Shaggy's beliefs about the free market, and how they change based on whatever Republicans are saying to promote their electability.
First, you have the Republican mantra that free markets are the way to go. The nanny state needs to stay out of the way so that real people and real businesses can make fast paced decisions and move the market. This is the real engine of growth, and all the nanny state can do is screw it up. This is what Shaggy was pimping before the economy went bad.
Yet, when this melt down happens, suddenly the nanny state SHOULD HAVE BEEN THERE to protect us. And in fact the Republicans would have been the nanny state and saved us all had those damn Democrats not stopped them! This is what Shaggy believes now.
Its a complete 180. It goes against everything the free market advocates would stand for. And its all about REPUBLICAN POLITICAL GAIN.
As a Republican ideologue, its what Republicans are saying. And it doesnt matter that they were saying something different 6 months ago. Just stick to the talking points. Reality has got nothing to do with it. When youre a Republican Ideologue, you support the Republican line REGARDLESS (Same applies to Dem Ideologues).
And youre the same animal. Wesley Snipes REFUSES to pay his taxes and has done so for years. Its not even remotely the same as Daschle, accept that it has to do with taxes in general.
Here is another example:
"Are there no responsible liberals that Obama can nominate? "
The man has kept Gates and nominated two other REPUBLICANS to his cabinet. Of the Democrats, hes nominated several of the most centrist Dems available. Yet you tow the Republican line, as if Obama was pulling people straight out of a Dead show line.
"The latest that we KNOW about, rather. But he does hold the title of latest Dem to be given a pass by other Dems for what would land an average American in jail."
Did you hear this on Rush or what? You certainly didnt get it from reality. People pay their back taxes and interest as a fine. They dont go to jail unless they pull a Snipes and REFUSE to pay habitually, or they knowingly defraud the government to the tune of millions of $$$ like Liona Helmsely did.
Then there is the laundry list of ideological bs in your post about liberties:
All poor people are lazy and dont want to work.
Democrats steal public money to give to the poor.
Clinton reformed welfare for fux sake. He lowered capital gains.
These statements are as stupid as saying all Republicans are in the pocket of lobbyists. All Republicans are rich white men. All Republicans love war. All Republicans are closet homosexuals. Anyone that votes Republican is rich or stupid.
I mean, its straight up ideology that has nothing to do with reality. Its emotion based and it makes you stupid.
And finally there is the fact that you and Shaggy and your ilk are still pushing Republican talking points even now. You say that these guys who made mistakes on their taxes are too mistake prone to run the government? Why the hell would you want the people who got us HERE in charge again? They didnt just screw up their taxes. They caused the cluster fuck in Iraq. They racked up $10 trillion in debt during an economic boom! They argued FOR torture. They split this country like it has NEVER been split.
Why on earth would you want them back in charge? Give someone else a chance, and yes, because of our system its got to be a Democrat, because no one votes for any third parties. Its either the incumbent GOP, or a Dem.
February 3, 2009
6:41 PM
Shaggy writes:
"Shaggy's whole shtick on the mortgage meltdown.
He believes that Democrats are at fault because they didnt allow for new regulation."
They were actually asking for TOUGHER regulations and yes the Democrats are on tape saying freddy and franny were solid and didn't need tougher regulations and to leave them alone.
BTW, Thank god all of us had Reagan during the cold war and tough economic times.
Thank god we had Bush to pull us out of a recession oh cigar toting Billy got us into.
Poor Barry is having a rough time just filling his cabinet.
God bless us all.
Change and hope for everyone.
Think I'll call my fellow Wyomingite pal Dick Cheney up and go Duck hunting now that he has some free time.
February 3, 2009
11:28 PM
Matt writes:
“No Matt. Youre an ideologue because you believe all things Republican regardless of reality. You just repeat whatever youre told by Republicans or their mouthpieces.”
So it was Rush that made half of Obama’s nominee’s cheat on their taxes? Sure, JW. And I suppose you think that Rush is the one who made cheating on your taxes illegal just to catch Democrats doing it. That’s your reality bud, not mine.
You know what else is a documented fact, Democrats did block Bush administration efforts to put more regulation on the GSEs, even if it was a weak showing, they tried more than once. It’s on film but apparently you let liberalism block out that little bit of reality also. I suppose you think the Holocaust never happened either.
“Yet, when this melt down happens, suddenly the nanny state SHOULD HAVE BEEN THERE to protect us.”
Again, you’re being willfully ignorant of the fact that what Shaggy was talking about regulating were the bureaucracies, Freddie and Fannie, not the private sector finances. But you don’t care, you use it for argument’s sake, because you have nothing material to present.
“Then there is the laundry list of ideological bs in your post about liberties:”
“All poor people are lazy and dont want to work.”
The truth is, I didn’t say ‘all’ but you are trying to say it came from me so you could try and strengthen your own argument. That’s cheap of you. Nice tactic. But the thing is, LAZY PEOPLE ARE TYPICALLY THE POOR ONES!!! Do you think that all the hard workers are the ones who aren’t making it? In other countries where opportunity isn’t as abundant as it is in America, the liberal free money crusaders might be able to make YOUR argument that people are BORN screwed, but not here. We have so many opportunities in this country that if you screw every one of them up, then you probably deserve to sleep in the bed you’ve made for yourself. And since I can see you coming back with a ‘we really do lack opportunity here’ argument, just look at the sheer number of people trying to get out of their shit-hole socialist countries and into our free market paradise.
“Democrats steal public money to give to the poor.”
Lets just say it was once your money, and now it ACORN's or in the capable hands of LA RAZA so they can help bring us the gift of more illegal aliens. See, we skipped the whole 'steal' part.
“I mean, its straight up ideology that has nothing to do with reality. Its emotion based and it makes you stupid.”
If you have a problem with policy being directed by emotion then what are you doing voting for Democrats? Your people own the hate crime/thought crime legislation. All emotion based, like the source of your ‘stupid’ comment.
“You say that these guys who made mistakes on their taxes are too mistake prone to run the government? Why the hell would you want the people who got us HERE in charge again? They didnt just screw up their taxes. They caused the cluster fuck in Iraq. They racked up $10 trillion in debt during an economic boom!”
JW, I’ve said before that I thought the war was is probably one of the most colossal mistakes in our generation. The biggest thing that your paragraph ignores however, is that 40% of Democrats at the time voted give the president power to go to war (and knowing Bush they knew that actually ment going to war) based on the same intelligence that Bush had access to. Stop distorting reality and acknowledge the smell of your own farts. If they’re falling out uncontrollably then maybe you should take a break from sex.
February 4, 2009
7:47 AM
JW writes:
"So it was Rush that made half of Obama’s nominee’s cheat on their taxes? Sure, JW. And I suppose you think that Rush is the one who made cheating on your taxes illegal just to catch Democrats doing it. That’s your reality bud, not mine. "
Not sure where you got this, because I certainly never said it. Just looking for ANY retort?
"You know what else is a documented fact, Democrats did block Bush administration efforts to put more regulation on the GSEs, even if it was a weak showing, they tried more than once. It’s on film but apparently you let liberalism block out that little bit of reality also. I suppose you think the Holocaust never happened either"
LOL. And this is what Im talking about. Its RIDICULOUS. There was never even a DEBATE about ANY BILLS. Do you understand what that means? It means REPUBLICAN controlled committees NEVER put out a bill for DEBATE. Now, how the hell are Democrats supposed to "block" regulation that was NEVER EVEN DEBATED? Answer that one, then we can talk about the rest.
"Again, you’re being willfully ignorant of the fact that what Shaggy was talking about regulating were the bureaucracies, Freddie and Fannie, not the private sector finances."
OHHH! Well then, hes missing the MAJORITY OF THE PROBLEM. Franny and Freddie were a problem, but if you havent noticed, its the PRIVATE SECTOR BANKS that are really causing the problelm in our economy. BTW, they are also the ones causing it WORLD WIDE, which makes your entire argument about "Dems did this" idiotic. And just so you understand how stupid you are to say Im a "Dem" or they are "My people", it would be almost EQUALLY idiotic to say that Republicans were responsible. The only reason it wouldnt be quite as idiotic is that Republicans actually had power. IF ANYONE outside the Banking industry is responsible, it would have to be Republicans. And if you are ignorant I could see making that argument as LESS stupid than blaming it on Dems. But, it wasnt Repubs or Dems. It was banks.
"The truth is, I didn’t say ‘all’ but you are trying to say it came from me so you could try and strengthen your own argument. "
Why, when you will do it for me?
"But the thing is, LAZY PEOPLE ARE TYPICALLY THE POOR ONES!!! "
Jackass.
"In other countries where opportunity isn’t as abundant as it is in America, the liberal free money crusaders might be able to make YOUR argument that people are BORN screwed, but not here."
See, I never made THAT argument. You may want to strengthen yours.
"If you have a problem with policy being directed by emotion then what are you doing voting for Democrats? Your people own the hate crime/thought crime legislation. All emotion based, like the source of your ‘stupid’ comment."
Its the partisan loyalty that is "emotion based" and it does make you stupid. You think Dems are "My people" but that isnt the case. Unlike you, Ive actually voted for Dems and Republicans. I like POLICY. Fiscal Conservatism, Social Liberalism, and the most freedom you can have in both your private and fiscal choices. That means sometimes I vote Republican, and sometimes I vote Dem. Hell, sometimes I vote third party. But after the last 8 years, I didnt really have a choice. The Republicans have gone NUTS. They never supported my social liberties, they are social conservatives who want to limit what behavior is acceptable. Thanks, I can make that decision for MYSELF. But in the last 8 years they ALSO went away from fiscal conservatism. They deficit spent like drunken CEO's during good economic times. Thats stupid.
"JW, I’ve said before that I thought the war was is probably one of the most colossal mistakes in our generation. The biggest thing that your paragraph ignores however, is that 40% of Democrats at the time voted give the president power to go to war (and knowing Bush they knew that actually ment going to war) based on the same intelligence that Bush had access to."
But this isnt the issue. Not for me anyway. I thought we should go in too. What I didnt think was that the Bush admin should overule military advisors and do it stupidly. What I didnt want was for Bush admin people to be put into positions of power when they didnt know wtf they were doing, and out of party loyalty. What I didnt want, Matt, was for the Bush admin to think it would be "Easy" and not plan for ANYTHING. And I didnt think Republicans in congress should have supported that. I didnt think they should be a rubberstamp for all the IDIOCY coming out of the WH over Iraq.
And BTW, its pretty typical for ideologues to argue bs, and just ignore any argument that cant be countered with bs. Like you just did. I belive it was Iraq, $10 Trillion in debt during an economic boom, and arguing FOR torture. That was by no means an exaustive list, but you couldnt even deal with two of three, so I guess its good I didnt take the time.
"Stop distorting reality and acknowledge the smell of your own farts. If they’re falling out uncontrollably then maybe you should take a break from sex. "
Hehe, well this is useful. Let me see if I can do this...
GFYS chumpsky. Like all social conservatives, you should stay the fuck out of my bedroom. None of your damn business and no, I dont care that youre force yourself into other peoples bedroom business because you secretly get tittliated by the thought of sex with a man, and it bothers you. Its not my problem. Its yours.
Finally, again, after the last 8 years, youre still pushing Republican talking points as if they had been this amazing success! I dont know what to tell you other than Im glad there is only about 20% of this country that is as stupid as you are. Even people who are generally Republican recognized that we needed a change, because the last 8 years were NOT totally successful. Hell, there wer LIFE LONG Republicans that understood this, and voted Dem for the FIRST TIME EVER.
And then there were the ones who are straight up partisan Ideologues who couldnt say a good thing about anyone BUT Republicans if you put a gun to their heads. That would be you.
February 4, 2009
9:39 AM
Shaggy writes:
And JW still claims he isn't a partisian stooge..hehe
I never realized someone could actually stoop to the level he does to make excuses for the corruption and devastation largely caused by the Democratic party..Oh my, mercy me!!
Whats next, are you going to tell us you are a fiscal conservative but voted for Barry just because of GW?
Me bets you even thinks Geithner and Daschle are fine outstanding role models who made innocent mistakes.
Hey W, your nose has turned bright blue, where have you been sticking it?
February 4, 2009
9:48 AM
prima facie writes:
Richardson ... Daschle ... Killefer ... will the last Obama nominee left please turn out the lights?
February 4, 2009
10:10 AM
Shaggy writes:
Prima,
Any bets Blago has his finger on the light switch ready to flick it at a moments notice when he comes face to face with a lengthy prison sentence?
February 4, 2009
10:15 AM
Matt writes:
JW,
You are just as much as an ideologue as anyone else if not more because you do nothing but spend time on this blog defending democrat's and their agenda to change America from a Republic to a mob ruled Democracy, and where mob rule doesn't get America changed more the utopia visions of the Dems, they use the courts, like for their support of illegal immigration.
You sit here high in your own ivory tower, looking down your nose at people who don't come to the same conclusions as you and call them stupid for it. Although I see you called me a 'jackass' again, your use of personal insults seems to have declined thru the posts. This intimidation is probably what worked on you and is why you became a Democrat to begin with. People like me want YOUR agenda stopped. We already live better lives than anybody else in the history of this world ever has known. We are here to protect this way of life and stop the Dems from forcing their republic destroying 'vision for America' on us. We like things the way they are, its the best it's ever been. Your side is full of nothing but malcontents who clamor to Democaratic politicians to take money from people who produce to make up for their short comings. You call me an ideologue while at the same time you have no idea that I would support the legalization of marijuana, am against the war (because I see the costs out weighting any benefits) and am also an atheist. But you categorize me into what your liberal handlers have taught you to hate and hence, you think everybody who has values that they want to defend is an ideologue. You have become one of their fascist little soldiers and don't even know it. You can shove your socialist agenda up your commie lovin ass.
February 4, 2009
11:06 AM
Hogar De Vuelta (العودة) Obama, change like you won't believe writes:
The most disturbing thing I have heard with regard to Daschle, (aside from the inability of Democrats to criticize any behavior, no matter how criminal) is that Daschle new about his little problem six months ago, but took no action until he was being vetted.
February 4, 2009
11:12 AM
JW writes:
"You are just as much as an ideologue as anyone else if not more because you do nothing but spend time on this blog defending democrat's and their agenda to change America from a Republic to a mob ruled Democracy, and where mob rule doesn't get America changed more the utopia visions of the Dems, they use the courts, like for their support of illegal immigration. "
This is a Strawman argument. Look it up.
"You sit here high in your own ivory tower, looking down your nose at people who don't come to the same conclusions as you and call them stupid for it."
Negative. I call you stupid because you take marching orders from the party line. Consequently your arguments are fallacious, involve double standards, or are often just flat hypocritical. I dont have a problem with people that disagree with me. I have a problem with people who disagree out of an ideological need and with weak ass argument.
"This intimidation is probably what worked on you and is why you became a Democrat to begin with. "
I dont know how many times I have to tell you Ive voted Republican in the past before you will take THIS weak ass argument and stop using it. This is ideological tripe. You cannot deal with me in any other way, because I dont agree with you, I MUST be a Democrat.
"People like me want YOUR agenda stopped."
Really? You dont like the free market? You dont think we need to watch how much we regulate so that we dont hinder the LEGITIMATE flow of business? You dont want a return to Pay Go? You SURE about that?
"We are here to protect this way of life and stop the Dems from forcing their republic destroying 'vision for America' on us."
Youre an idiot. Our "Way of Life" that you so rightfully idealize was FOUNDED on dissent. The working together of people of different views to come up with a common MIDDLE ground. Without people who see things differently AND have the freedom to push for those positions, we wouldnt have the success of today. Its when you get TOO FAR to the LEFT or the RIGHT that things go bad, as the last 8 years have CLEARLY shown us.
"We like things the way they are, its the best it's ever been. "
Are you SERIOUS? Have you read any financial news in the last YEAR? This is another WEAK ASS ARGUMENT.
"Your side is full of nothing but malcontents who clamor to Democaratic politicians to take money from people who produce to make up for their short comings."
Another weak ass argument based on your ideology. Obama has been calling for tax CUTS. Dummy.
"You call me an ideologue while at the same time you have no idea that I would support the legalization of marijuana, am against the war (because I see the costs out weighting any benefits) and am also an atheist."
Hey! Good for you! You still follow an ideology of "Any Republican will do because Dems r bad". Deal with it.
"But you categorize me into what your liberal handlers have taught you to hate and hence, you think everybody who has values that they want to defend is an ideologue."
No, I think anyone who tows a party line is an ideologue. And again, you keep categorizing me as a "Liberal" but it is only true in that I support personal LIBERTIES, like those enshrined in our constitution. As an American, I would hope you do as well. But your use of the word liberal is the wingnut ideologue use, and its misused in both the definition of the word, and also because I have voted Republican. "Liberals" dont vote Republican...EVER.
"You have become one of their fascist little soldiers and don't even know it."
LOL. Youre painting me as a leftist, then you call me a fascist. Way to go ingnorant boy. Take a poli sci class.
"You can shove your socialist agenda up your commie lovin ass."
:) GFYS ideologue.
February 4, 2009
11:26 AM
Anonymous writes:
Hogar,
Something tells me if he wasn't tapped he wouldn't have paid it back.
February 4, 2009
11:33 AM
JMH writes:
"We like things the way they are, its the best it's ever been." - Matt
That is why you are irrelivant... You and your whole NeoCon cult of failure, lies and corruption!
The "best it has ever been?"... really? Must be the dumbest thing I have EVER heard and shaggy will be upset to hear you have took his mantle!
You like the fact that millions of your fellow Americans are out of work and are struggling everyday to feed their kids and keep a roof over their heads? You like that the GOP has attacked our freedoms and civil liberties in the name of fear? You like that America is no longer that "shining city on the hill"?
Maybe you should move to Mexico you f*cking traitor, then you will be able to live in a 3rd world country like you desire and you will still be able to look down at the peasants...
But thanks for proving with that one line that you are a complete moron, selfish and ignorant... with no regard to anyone but yourself! Why do you hate other Americans?
Can't wait till this depression bites your silver spoon, trust-fund ass! But I'm sure you will have your mommy and daddy to run to when that happens! What a d*ck!
February 4, 2009
11:59 AM
JW writes:
"The most disturbing thing I have heard with regard to Daschle, (aside from the inability of Democrats to criticize any behavior, no matter how criminal) is that Daschle new about his little problem six months ago, but took no action until he was being vetted."
If thats true he probably pulled himself out of the confirmation process because he knew it would come out.
As for your pot shot at Dems, it goes both ways. Youve been supporting a party that brought us the argument for torture, unwarranted wiretaps, and removal of due process for years Hogar. That stuff is criminal. More so than these tax issues even, which typically ARE NOT considered "Criminal" and are dealt with outside of court.
But thats typical of you, as you are ALSO an ideologue.
February 4, 2009
12:13 PM
Matt writes:
JW,
I don't have time right now to deal with the ton of BS and opinions you state as fact in your post but I want to call you on one thing for right now. As a self-described non-ideologue, what do you have to say about a post like JMH's? If you're as smart as you give yourself credit for, then tell me if you find anything that jumps out at you in his/her/leftwingsexualfreakizoid's post. Also, explain the inconsistency of why you only want to attack Republicans and then when you're attacked back as a Democrat, you pretend like you're not one. Shifty.
February 4, 2009
12:21 PM
Anonymous writes:
At least obama appointments have expertise in the area they are being hired for. Bush just put in a bunch or cronies and partisan hacks in positions so they could rob from the american taxpayer and have no accountability. Remember "good job Brownie", hired for homeland security. He was a so called expert in horse trading. Now that was a good pick and there were many more just like that.
February 4, 2009
12:50 PM
JW writes:
"Also, explain the inconsistency of why you only want to attack Republicans and then when you're attacked back as a Democrat, you pretend like you're not one. Shifty."
Lets deal with this first. The answer is: Because you wingnut ideologues are always attacking Dems. Again, witness Shaggys insane blaming of Dems for the mortgage meltdown. IF you guys would blame that on Republicans, well, then Id have to bash you for that as well. Ive said several times it was banks to blame, and not Dems nor Repububs either.
Did you notice what I said to Hogar? If Daschle really didnt deal with his tax problem till he knew he was going to be in the public eye, thats bad. He shouldnt have been confirmed. Id say Obama isnt too happy with him at the moment.
BTW, what did you think about Obama getting up on tv and saying he made a mistake appointing Daschle and whatsherface?
What have you thought about Obama saying the process that is happening in the senate should give them a better bill, rather than attacking Repubs and calling them obstructionists?
"As a self-described non-ideologue, what do you have to say about a post like JMH's?"
Ok...
"You like the fact that millions of your fellow Americans are out of work and are struggling everyday to feed their kids and keep a roof over their heads? You like that the GOP has attacked our freedoms and civil liberties in the name of fear? You like that America is no longer that "shining city on the hill"?"
Strawman arguments. All of them.
As for the rest, hes obvioulsy pretty emotional about it. Ive seen the same arguments (traitor and such) for the last 8 years from Republicans, and I think they are just as wrong.
Anyway, Id say he is pissed off about the state of our nation, and feels people like you are responsible, since you always vote Republican. If it was Democrats in power the last 8 years and we were in this position, then it would be time to bash Dems. But it was Republicans, and they need to be held accountable.
He was right about how stupid your "The best its ever been" comment was. Thats idiotic.
February 4, 2009
12:58 PM
Ben Former Democrat writes:
anonymous @ 12:21- That's weak.
February 4, 2009
2:14 PM
Shaggy aka turning socialist one day at a time writes:
Looks like now they are starting the first phase of taking away our guns.
http://readitnews.com/read-it-views-prescott-opinion/page-9/1624-gun-law-update-gun-rights-testing-planned
"Under HR 45, if you can't pass a complex test written by the U.S. Attorney General (described in detail below), pay the tax, give up fingerprints and a biometric-capable photo of yourself (that can be turned into a digital facial-recognition number and used as a de facto national ID), every gun you own will become contraband and subject to confiscation, while you stand trial before imprisonment. You'd think Bobby, a former black panther, would know better."
February 4, 2009
2:19 PM
Shaggy aka turning socialist one day at a time writes:
Looks like now they are starting the first phase of taking away our guns.
http://readitnews.com/read-it-views-prescott-opinion/page-9/1624-gun-law-update-gun-rights-testing-planned
"Under HR 45, if you can't pass a complex test written by the U.S. Attorney General (described in detail below), pay the tax, give up fingerprints and a biometric-capable photo of yourself (that can be turned into a digital facial-recognition number and used as a de facto national ID), every gun you own will become contraband and subject to confiscation, while you stand trial before imprisonment. You'd think Bobby, a former black panther, would know better."
February 4, 2009
2:32 PM
JW writes:
LOL. You know Shaggy, I have no doubt that there are some fuckwits out there (mostly Dems) that want this law to pass. Hell, it could even pass.
And BAM! A federal judge will say it cannot be infoced until the Supremes get ahold of it, and then the Supremes will kick it to the curb.
This is the same thing I have had to tell some of the whackos on the left about some of the idiotic right to life legislation that has been passed in the past. They can pass bills till they fall down, but in the end the bill has to be constitutional.
Unless its the MCA of 06.
Anyway, the left's promises of taking away your guns are about as realistic as the right's promises of abortion bans.
February 4, 2009
2:32 PM
Dave Duke (R) writes:
HE HE HE
lookie here Pubs. Heres your new Leader. OMG
OMG Gasp.
http://www.harvestbankmd.com/images/Michael_Steele.jpg
Affirmative Action. empty suit OMG
February 4, 2009
2:33 PM
Matt writes:
Much less contention in your last post JW but I still think that you're more of a libby than you think you are.
"Did you notice what I said to Hogar? If Daschle really didnt deal with his tax problem till he knew he was going to be in the public eye, thats bad. He shouldnt have been confirmed. Id say Obama isnt too happy with him at the moment."
This is what the whole conversation stated over. You can give Daschle the benefit of the doubt but who doesn't know that they need to pay taxes for consulting services? Especially at 30k/month? (And JMH thinks big time money is a Republican thing)That was my point to begin with. Now, as it turns out, even Obama is saying that Daschle was a mistake. My point was - 'why not consider somebody else?'. Can I get some credit for being in the mainstream all along and not being handed orders by Rush or another somebody else who you give my ideas credit to?
"BTW, what did you think about Obama getting up on tv and saying he made a mistake appointing Daschle and whatsherface?"
That was very graceful of him. But as for those two who were held accountable for what was at best, just being careless with their taxes, I bet are really jealous of Geithner right now.
"What have you thought about Obama saying the process that is happening in the senate should give them a better bill, rather than attacking Repubs and calling them obstructionists?"
I'm not in there working on the thing JW. I suspect that (with nothing to go on) that Obama saw ideas from people other than Democrats, thought they were worthwhile and feels that there is enough reason to peruse them. Which is good but during the election, everybody found out what types of characters Obama had been hanging out with in Chicago - so excuse us for keeping one eye open, waiting to see if those old friends are still having any influence.
And as for JMH, call him out more often then. To follow up on this:
"Anyway, Id say he is pissed off about the state of our nation, and feels people like you are responsible, since you always vote Republican. If it was Democrats in power the last 8 years and we were in this position, then it would be time to bash Dems. But it was Republicans, and they need to be held accountable."
You didn't mention anything about the fact that for a while now, six years to ballpark it, Democrats have been running congress. They've been the ones deciding which bills to vote on and have been deciding what projects to cut the checks for. Collectively, they have considerably more power than the president. That has to mean something if you're looking at it from a 'neutral' point of view, doesn't it?
Also if you were truly neutral, you would excuse Republicans on this blog (like you did JMH) who are fed up with Democrats over pork barrel spending, supporting legislation that weakens voter ID requirements and other things like giving in-state tuition to illegal alien's kids as a reward for evading the law for long enough time after arriving in America.
"He was right about how stupid your "The best its ever been" comment was. Thats idiotic."
This is my only, big disagreement with your post. This IS the best it's ever been. I like to say that because its 100% true and malcontents use that argument as justification for liberal social engineering projects. Here is some information you'd have to dismiss to think that America isn't the best place in the world to live:
You don't see Americans doing a mass exodus from America to Mexico, Europe, Asia or anywhere else for that matter. But you do see the opposite. People put their livelihoods at stake just to get here so they can have a chance. You can argue that it's not perfect but it's damn better than where they came from. If America ceases to be as it is, we VERY EASILY could end up in the same position of all the world's people who are trying to get out of their countries and into ours - Where would we run to when our country becomes like theirs? People around the world agree that this is the best place to live by their decision to come here instead of anywhere else they could have gone. JMH is just a malcontent. He likes complaining about stuff because it probably got him sympathy and a few new toys when he was a kid.
Anyway, I'm with you when you say that if Daschle knew he had to pay taxes and didn't, then not only does he not deserve to hold in public office, the FBI should be looking into it. Maybe him and Snipes can be bunkmates. I find it hard to believe that a man who wrote tax codes simply 'forgot' to report that much income. Whether it's sloppy bookkeeping or malicious, there is precedent to know that we can do better. As for other countries doing better by their citizen's freedom than America has done, there is no precedent.
February 4, 2009
2:47 PM
Hogar De Vuelta (العودة) Republicans, harassing tax dodgers and applauding citizens writes:
JW,
Just want to give equal time to the Republicans.
Seriously though, I applaud all criminals being dealt with.
Nothing wrong with suspending when necessary. Just ask Lincoln, he did far worse than Bush ever did. And the Constitution allows for the suspension of Habeus, read it.
February 4, 2009
3:04 PM
JW writes:
"Much less contention in your last post JW but I still think that you're more of a libby than you think you are."
I am about as socially liberal as you can get. I believe in FREEDOM. Duh. The whole social conservative movement is TRUELY anti-American, because they dont believe people should have the freedom to behave in ways social conservatives dont like. The fact that social conservatives are free to behave in ways that other people dont like doesnt seem to matter.
"Can I get some credit for being in the mainstream all along and not being handed orders by Rush or another somebody else who you give my ideas credit to?"
Why not. But the reason I blasted you about it was because you had him guilty right off the bat. Why? cause hes a Dem. If you were even a little bit unpartisan you might have said, "You know, I dont know enough about this. The whole story isnt out, and the media is about fucking worthless. Im gona reserve judgement and let the process work this out." But no, hes a Dem, hes guilty.
"I'm not in there working on the thing JW. I suspect that (with nothing to go on) that Obama saw ideas from people other than Democrats, thought they were worthwhile and feels that there is enough reason to peruse them. Which is good but during the election, everybody found out what types of characters Obama had been hanging out with in Chicago - so excuse us for keeping one eye open, waiting to see if those old friends are still having any influence. "
LOL. See, now that I can say "ok, thats your opinion." and leave it at that. Unfortunatley, before this its all been how much of a "liberal" he is and how he is just pushing pork, and OH MY GOD HES GONA TURN US INTO SOCIALISTS!
Thats RUSH talkiing out of YOUR mouth.
"You didn't mention anything about the fact that for a while now, six years to ballpark it, Democrats have been running congress."
Hehe, mostly because its been since January 07, not january 03. That would be TWO years.
"They've been the ones deciding which bills to vote on and have been deciding what projects to cut the checks for. Collectively, they have considerably more power than the president. That has to mean something if you're looking at it from a 'neutral' point of view, doesn't it?"
There is this one, tiny mitigating factor. Its called a "Filibuster" because while Dems have actually controlled Congress since jan 07, they have NOT controlled the Senate. Its been a dead even split, with two independents, one of which is Joe "Republican" Lieberman. Dude spoke at the freaking RNC for fux sake. Hes not an "Independent". Anyway, the Republicans have set records filibustering over the last two years. And several times when Republicans crossed the line to vote with Dems, the president vetoed the bills, which requires even MORE Republicans to cross the line, and it NEVER happened. You cannot say Dems were in "Control" when they MUST have 10 Republicans vote with them just to get a VOTE on a bill in the Senate.
"Also if you were truly neutral, you would excuse Republicans on this blog (like you did JMH) who are fed up with Democrats over pork barrel spending, supporting legislation that weakens voter ID requirements and other things like giving in-state tuition to illegal alien's kids as a reward for evading the law for long enough time after arriving in America."
Why? Thats Republican bs, because Republicans are guilty of ALL THAT STUFF.
And BTW, this "Pork" crap? Yea, thats not gona fly with me. I realize Rush has freaked out, so you have to freak out. Ive run the actual numbers, and its just not material amounts! "Pork" is so miniscule it doesnt even MATTER! Not only that, but what you call pork would be another persons much needed spending. Even McCain couldnt get it straight! He was telling these people down south what a great deal their federally funded ferry was one day, just a few weeks after he was calling the exact same line item PORK!
Pork is a red herring. Its a ruse to keep you occupied. Its a freaking MARKETING tactic.
And dude, you need a critical thinking class. "Its the best its ever been!" is not the same as "Its the best place to live in the world!"
While I can agree that this is probably the best place to live in the world, this is NOT the best America has ever been. We tortured people over the last 8 years. We wiretapped our own populace without warrants. We denied people the right to habeus corpus which has been the basis for human rights for 1000 years! We passed the MCA of 06. Much of the world sees us as HYPOCRITES rather than the shining beacon of freedom we were. And we have the worst damn economy we have seen since the 30'S.
"f America ceases to be as it is, we VERY EASILY could end up in the same position of all the world's people who are trying to get out of their countries and into ours - Where would we run to when our country becomes like theirs?"
This is EXACTLY why Im so pissed at Republican leadership for the last 8 years, and why Im so pissed at the totally useless, spineless Democrats who couldnt be an effective counter.
We argued the merrits of TORTURE. That is America going backward. We argued that it was ok to encarcerate people without due process. These are the things STALIN and PINOCHET did!
You wana talk about the moral degredation of America? You wana talk about America becoming "like those other places". THIS is where you need to start. And YOU enabled it by buying into the bs "your freedom or your safety" line Republicans handed you for the last 8 years. I helped, because I voted for a few of the rubberstamping Congressmen and Senators in 00, 02, and 04. I dont think any of them won though. Schwartzenegger is the only Repub I know that I voted for and he won. I NEVER voted for Bush though.
"Anyway, I'm with you when you say that if Daschle knew he had to pay taxes and didn't, then not only does he not deserve to hold in public office, the FBI should be looking into it. Maybe him and Snipes can be bunkmates."
Well, youre taking that too far. Again, unless you habitually refuse to pay taxes, its a fine and no jail time.
"I find it hard to believe that a man who wrote tax codes simply 'forgot' to report that much income."
Hehe, well when your making millions $30k isnt that much. And the tax code, damn man, Id have a hard time bashing Bush for screwing up taxes. Those tax codes are screwed up.
But screw him. He should pay the fine.
"As for other countries doing better by their citizen's freedom than America has done, there is no precedent."
I wish I could agree, and I would have before 2001. Since then...Look up the MCA of 06. See what the Republican majority pushed through right before they abdicated office. See why I REFUSED to vote for McCain REGARDLESS of everything else. The man voted for the MCA of 06, and there is NO EXCUSE I will tollerate. You cannot live up to your oath to support the constitution and vote for that TRAVESTY.
February 4, 2009
3:12 PM
JW writes:
"Nothing wrong with suspending when necessary. Just ask Lincoln, he did far worse than Bush ever did. And the Constitution allows for the suspension of Habeus, read it."
I have. And it does, under certain circumstances. We havent had those circumstances. Or, if you say we have had those circumstances, then you say we can suspend it forever because those circumstances will continue forever, which was CLEARLY not the intent.
Secondly, there was NO provision for suspention of due process, or the requirement for warrants, or for TORTURE. Those remain CRIMES.
And finally, "those who would give up liberty for perceived freedom deserve neither". You go ahead and give up your rights, sissy. Im keeping mine. Youre more likely to die driving your car BY FAR than you are to die at a terrorists hands. What kind of useless wuss says "Sure, take my rights! Im afraid of people who live in CAVES!"
Idiot.
February 4, 2009
4:22 PM
Ben writes:
"I am about as socially liberal as you can get. I believe in FREEDOM. Duh. The whole social conservative movement is TRUELY anti-American, because they dont believe people should have the freedom to behave in ways social conservatives dont like. The fact that social conservatives are free to behave in ways that other people dont like doesnt seem to matter." jw
Lol,now that's an ignorant statement.
jw,
You are fine with constitutional suspensions if left wing liberals do them ain't ya boy?
Socially liberal and fiscally conservative. That is an oxymoron and mix like oil and water.
February 4, 2009
4:34 PM
Matt writes:
" I am about as socially liberal as you can get. I believe in FREEDOM"
Socially liberal in itself is fine but when you social liberals FORCE publicly funded programs on American citizens, it's only freedom for YOUR chosen people, not the ones who will be paying for or benefiting from your programs.
" The whole story isnt out, and the media is about fucking worthless. Im gona reserve judgement and let the process work this out." But no, hes a Dem, hes guilty."
Your lying about what triggered my suspicions, I based it on the fact I give the guy credit for not being an idiot, because that’s what he's have to be to overlook 30k/month in income. Maybe you can try reserving judgment on me.
" OH MY GOD HES GONA TURN US INTO SOCIALISTS!
Thats RUSH talkiing out of YOUR mouth."
No, that's you putting words in my mouth and then declaring that I heard it from Rush. But at least you're being consistent in the way you deal with people who don't agree with you.
" This is EXACTLY why Im so pissed at Republican leadership for the last 8 years, and why Im so pissed at the totally useless, spineless Democrats who couldnt be an effective counter."
Do you think the Dems will be the ones to do anything about the SPP, NAFTA or stopping illegal immigration? They will do nothing to stop any of that. Hell, they're even leveraging money away from American citizens to pay for their new pet Mexicans, and they want more.
" Well, youre taking that too far. Again, unless you habitually refuse to pay taxes, its a fine and no jail time."
The FBI still needs to look into it so he can ultimately get a fine if he deserves it or go to jail if he deserves it. Your knee jerk reaction was that he was innocent and this was somebody else's witch hunt but Tom Daschle not paying his taxes is Tom Daschle's problem. You and me aren’t prosecutors, we don't have to presume innocence, guilt or anything else. If he did it on purpose, then we'll let a judge decide his punishment. Being a guy who loves raising other people's taxes, he should be held 100% accountable as this makes him a hypocrite.
" well when your making millions $30k isnt that much"
That’s 360,000 he 'forgot' to report. Not 30k. Apparently you're a human as well so I don't expect yo to lambaste anybody else for getting their facts slightly off.
""As for other countries doing better by their citizen's freedom than America has done, there is no precedent."
"I wish I could agree, and I would have before 2001. Since then...Look up the MCA of 06. See what the Republican majority pushed through right before they abdicated office. See why I REFUSED to vote for McCain REGARDLESS of everything else. The man voted for the MCA of 06, and there is NO EXCUSE I will tollerate. You cannot live up to your oath to support the constitution and vote for that TRAVESTY."
You won't find many conservative fans of McCain either. I couldn't vote for the guy myself. Him, along with Ted Kennedy, really, really wanted to make it so America would be liable for Mexico's failures, as did the majority of Democrats who will predictably do it again. I wouldn't call cramming and entire country's failures down the throats of American citizens 'promoting freedom' among American citizens, but that is what social liberalism will do anyway. True, some Republicans are trying to do the same thing but at least we have more people on our side who stick up for the common good of American citizens rather than being won over by lobbyist from the politically correct organization, La Raza.
JW, by your failure to provide an example of a better country than where you currently live and by the fact that you're in America now, I'll just assume that you are enjoying your life unlike the hoards of left wingers that have nothing except bad things to say about America. You can talk trash about your country but in the end, you know you really like it here.
Again:
"As for other countries doing better by their citizen's freedom than America has done, there is no precedent."
" I wish I could agree, and I would have before 2001. Since then...Look up the MCA of 06."
If you can't agree, then where is there a better country to live in than America?
February 4, 2009
4:39 PM
Hogar De Vuelta (العودة) Habeus Propoise writes:
JW,
The one thing I will say is that we should never have had such an open door policy that we welcome untold numbers of our sworn enemies to move into the house. If we had leaders who understood the need to protect from invaders, the need for such drastic action would not have been necessary. We have not tortured, (except allowing people like Blago to drone on incessantly on TV), and I cannot think of any US citizen who has been denied due process, except the dwindling ranks of US taxPAYERS.
February 4, 2009
6:03 PM
Denise23 writes:
I am concerned that our president is making one bad decision after another, mainly due to taking advice or letting old Washington far left generals like Pelosi and Reid control the puppet strings.
This is not good and far too early to happen.
February 4, 2009
11:42 PM
Iceman7 writes:
Denise23,
Obama pulled the biggest Con job in the History of this nation. Just wait until Blago starts getting squeezed...
Ice
February 5, 2009
12:06 AM
Iceman7 writes:
JW,
Take a breath! you write a little and cut and paste, write a little more and cut and paste with the end result being nothing said!
Try something like this which gets to an individuals point:
"Obama is Con-man"
See how easy that was! No?
It was easy for me...
Ice
February 5, 2009
8:02 AM
JW writes:
"Lol,now that's an ignorant statement."
Thats your opinion. Now back it up fuckwit. You cant. And ben, you actually ARE the stupidest MF'er on this blog.
"jw,
You are fine with constitutional suspensions if left wing liberals do them ain't ya boy?"
No.
"Socially liberal and fiscally conservative. That is an oxymoron and mix like oil and water."
Only if youre stupid. If youre not, socially liberal and fiscally conservative go hand in hand, because they represent the most freedom you can have both in your social life and your fiscal decisions.
Matt,
"Socially liberal in itself is fine but when you social liberals FORCE publicly funded programs on American citizens, it's only freedom for YOUR chosen people, not the ones who will be paying for or benefiting from your programs."
Youre mixing things up. Socially liberal has nothing to do with programs. Thats why you hate liberals, because you see the word in the framework of Rush's talking points. Socially liberal means that I dont want people making laws that make their belief system mandatory for everyone. Socially liberal means supporting the constitution, and believing Government has NO BUSINESS making laws that arent necessary SPECIFICALLY to suport those rights. Socially liberal means LESS legislation regarding personal behavior and choice, which means MORE Freedom for you to be who you want to be.
The programs you are talking about move into the FISCAL side, and there I am conservative.
"Your lying about what triggered my suspicions, I based it on the fact I give the guy credit for not being an idiot, because that’s what he's have to be to overlook 30k/month in income. Maybe you can try reserving judgment on me."
Fair enough. I still say you were making judgements without all the info, AND you were presuming guilt, which is BACKWARD. Youre supposed to presume innocence. Also, Im not sure Im bying the argument that you, as a die hard Republican, actually gave a Dem credit for not being an idiot. But if you say so, I can go with that.
"No, that's you putting words in my mouth and then declaring that I heard it from Rush. But at least you're being consistent in the way you deal with people who don't agree with you. "
No, Im being consistant with what Ive heard out of you. You seriously dont remember typing this? "Vote Democratic and Obama will steal other people's property so you can stay a lazy and unproductive member of society! "
Those are YOUR words. I didnt type them for you.
"Do you think the Dems will be the ones to do anything about the SPP, NAFTA or stopping illegal immigration? They will do nothing to stop any of that. Hell, they're even leveraging money away from American citizens to pay for their new pet Mexicans, and they want more."
Well, I think Illegals are another issue just like pork, only we just dont have the numbers to make smart decisions regarding them, because they are off the books for the most part and the data isnt there. That said, going with YOUR position on the issue, I fail to see why you only bash Dems. Republicans have been EQUALLY bad in terms of representing what you want.
"The FBI still needs to look into it so he can ultimately get a fine if he deserves it or go to jail if he deserves it."
He paid his back taxes and a fine. Additionally, why the FBI? Seems to me this is the IRS' job.
"Your knee jerk reaction was that he was innocent and this was somebody else's witch hunt but Tom Daschle not paying his taxes is Tom Daschle's problem"
No. My "knee jerk reaction" was to go with DUE PROCESS, and NOT MAKE knee jerk reactions. PRESUMPTION OF INNOCENCE IS EVERY AMERICAN's RIGHT. As the process unfolded, looks like Tom both did something he shouldnt have, and then paid the price. Im done with it at this point.
"we don't have to presume innocence"
Youre right. IF you dont believe in American values, you dont have to presume innocence. You can convict EVERYONE to your little hearts content, just like all the other ignorant, unwashed masses in the court of public opinion.
"Being a guy who loves raising other people's taxes, he should be held 100% accountable as this makes him a hypocrite."
THERE are those REPUBLICAN marching orders again! Hes a DEM! He MUST love to raise taxes! But...Clinton was a Dem. And he lowered taxes. Bush 1 was a Republican, and he RAISED taxes. Did you know REAGAN raised taxes! OMG!!!!
Marching orders are STUPID. They do not have any basis in reality.
"That’s 360,000 he 'forgot' to report. Not 30k. Apparently you're a human as well so I don't expect yo to lambaste anybody else for getting their facts slightly off."
Well, the 30k remark was meant as a joke, but I saw a breakdown of how much he didnt pay in taxes and 30K was the driver part you keep harping on. The total was in the low $100k, not mid $300k, BTW.
"You won't find many conservative fans of McCain either."
He wasnt the only Republican to vote for it. I just brought it up because I cant support ANYONE who did.
"True, some Republicans are trying to do the same thing but at least we have more people on our side who stick up for the common good of American citizens rather than being won over by lobbyist from the politically correct organization, La Raza"
Here is the problem with what youre saying; yes, Republicans vote against things regarding immigration. They get out and bitch and moan, and spin. They call a bill that doesnt fit the definition of amnesty "amnesty" because it resonates with ideologues of the Republican party, and they all line up to scream about it. They vote Republican. But...have the Republicans actually done ANYTHING other that vote against stuff? No. They have a lot to say about how bad the issue is, and they have a lot to say about how bad everyone else's solutions are, but they have nothing PRODUCTIVE to add to the issue. They are worthless. You may disagree with the people who wanted that immigration bill, but at least they were doing SOMETHING about it.
"JW, by your failure to provide an example of a better country than where you currently live and by the fact that you're in America now, I'll just assume that you are enjoying your life unlike the hoards of left wingers that have nothing except bad things to say about America. You can talk trash about your country but in the end, you know you really like it here."
Idiot. I didnt "Fail" to provide an example fo a better country. I straight up and in verry plain english AGREED WITH YOU. Damn man.
But agreeing that America is the best country in the world isnt the same as saying America is perfect. We have done some BAD shit over the last 8 years, and as a citizen it is my constitutional DUTY to dissent.
"If you can't agree, then where is there a better country to live in than America?"
There is no better country to live in than America, but that wasnt the issue. I couldnt agree with you that America has been doing better by their citizen's freedom than any other country over the last 8 years. Prior to that yes. But over the last 8 years? England comes to mind. They were attacked too. They had a knee jerk "Lets make a patriot act type of thing" but clearer heads prevailed and they managed NOT to make legislation out of fear that curtails civil liberties. They dont survail groups who have nothing to do with terrorism because they have a political agenda that conflicts with the administration in power. They dont lock people up without due process. They dont...TORTURE.
Again, you can spout platitudes about how great America is, but in the end the last 8 years have seen us do things that Stalin, Pol Pot, and Agustus Pinochet did. I dont think thats something to be proud of.
BUT! I still love my country. Enough that I can call out our mistakes and try to correct them. Cheerleading your country no matter what it does isnt loving your country. Its ideological faith regardless of reality.
"The one thing I will say is that we should never have had such an open door policy that we welcome untold numbers of our sworn enemies to move into the house."
WTF are you talking about Hogar?
"We have not tortured, (except allowing people like Blago to drone on incessantly on TV), and I cannot think of any US citizen who has been denied due process, except the dwindling ranks of US taxPAYERS."
See Matt, this idiot is one of those with ideological faith regardless. Its pretty damn clear we have tortured people at this point. Its also clear that we have denied people their constitutional rights. He thinks that them not being citizens means they arent entiteled to those rights because hes stupid. Hes also immoral POS because he actually argues FOR restricting rights on the basis of legal work arounds as if it was OK to do so. But then, hes a foreigner we allowed to come over. He doesnt really understand America. And the proof is both his arguments for undermining the constitution, and his desire to legislate his religious beliefs on the rest of us.
GFYS Hogar, you make me sick.
"Try something like this which gets to an individuals point"
Sure Ice.
GFYS Chump.
That straight to the point enough for you, ideologue idiot?
February 5, 2009
8:44 AM
Shaggy writes:
Some of the smartest people I know never graduated from High School and some of the dumbest people I have ever known hold several PHD's.
JW falls into the latter.
February 5, 2009
9:16 AM
JW writes:
"Some of the smartest people I know never graduated from High School "
LOL.
February 5, 2009
9:19 AM
JMH writes:
Hey shaggy... when you are proven right about anything, then maybe you can say something about someone's intelligence.
But you and the rest of the morons on here whinning about Obama, have been wrong consistantly for the past 8 years... Nothing you guys ever supported helped America, in fact most things you guys cheered for hurt us... None of your stupid predictions have ever come true... The fact that YOU are saying the Stimulus bill wont do any good makes me MUCH more comfortable with it!
But keep up the crying NeoCons... The only mistake Obama is making right now is letting the GOP think they matter... it only encourages them!
As for you Matt... GFYS! Really! I'm f*cking sick and tired on the nonsensical ramblings of you radicals... the above statemnets apply to you as well... You have no clue... If you did, you wouldn't ahve supported the destruction of the American economy & America's values and presige...
Why ANYONE is even listening to the GOP and it's radical rightwing anymore after they screwed everythnig up so bad is just amazing!
Your opinions are irrelevant... I appuad Obama for trying bi-partisanship and trying to talk and reason with the 22%ers in this country, but as he is finding out, you can't reason with radicals and the GOP isn't interested in doing any good for America, they are only interested in trying to get back in power!
If I have one major complaint about Obama, it should be that he should remember that the American public, for TWO straight elections, has tried to sideline the GOP and their failed policies! He would be wise to rememeber that we obviously don't want the same old garbage they are selling! Remember who won OBAMA!!! Dammit!
February 5, 2009
9:26 AM
JW writes:
BTW Shaggy,
I dont believe you know ANYONE with a SINGLE PhD, let alone people with multiples.
I do however believe that you hang out with high school drop outs on a daily basis. I wouldnt be surprised if YOU are a high school drop out.
February 5, 2009
9:34 AM
Iceman7 writes:
Jw,
I calls them the ways, I sees them! and try real hard not to use low life vulgarity.
Why don't you try finding a day job. It may keep your mind occupied on more important things than defending the Con-Man.
Ice
February 5, 2009
9:47 AM
Gunny Bob writes:
Gallup: With scandals, broken promises, humiliations, scams, etc., Dear Leader's favorability numbers plummet 14% in a few days (even before his "Terrible Tuesday") and the precipitous fall continues unabated.
Obviously, the god of the Left is quite some distance from infallible and flawless.
February 5, 2009
9:50 AM
JW writes:
"I calls them the ways, I sees them!"
And you have a right to your opinion.
"and try real hard not to use low life vulgarity."
Good for you. Im a vulgarian. I LIKE a well placed explitive. And I dont care if you like it or not.
"Why don't you try finding a day job. It may keep your mind occupied on more important things than defending the Con-Man."
A) I have a day job.
B) Why dont you drop your ideological adherance to Rush's talking points and LEARN something so you can make YOUR OWN decisions. Your ideology has been on parade for the last 8 years, and it is CLEARLY a FAILURE.
You understand what Im saying? Stop promoting failure as if it is success because you are ignorant and stupid.
February 5, 2009
9:56 AM
Shaggy writes:
"I dont believe you know ANYONE with a SINGLE PhD, let alone people with multiples."---W
Well it doesn't surprise me that you are dead wrong again because you are a stupid idiot and I really don't care wtf you think.
"I do however believe that you hang out with high school drop outs on a daily basis. I wouldnt be surprised if YOU are a high school drop out."---W
Actually, come to think of it, I think am the only one living in our gated community with only a HS degree.
I'll ask a few of my friends next time we play golf on our private GC and get back to you.
Would like to entertain you some more but I have a business to run.
I suggest you get back into your cubicle before the man see's you screwing off again.
February 5, 2009
10:16 AM
JW writes:
You make me laugh Shaggy.
I grew up in a family business. Im not impressed that you run your own. You are, which is good for you. But Im not.
Additionally, at this point I would have thought any idiot would know I dont have a boss looking over my shoulder all day. But, as usual, you continue to show that people can in fact be stupider than I imagine.
As for you being the only uneducated person in your gated community, I am so unsurprised. Youve done well with your limitations, but its clear that most people in your situation dont do as well.
People in MY situation DO.
But hey, I guess youd rather be lucky than good!
Me, Ill take BOTH!
February 5, 2009
12:58 PM
Shaggy writes:
Now I am just lucky that I have succeeded in the same business for over 30 years.
Your still an idiot and you still don't understand what stimulates the economy dweeb..hehehe
Yes JW, I do think you have someone looking over your shoulder because you have said you have to use IE and can't look at the facts I present to you because it isn't allowed by your boss dumbass.
So are you lying now or were you lying then?
Read my words carefully, I DON"T CARE WTF YOU THINK..Got it now chumpskies?
February 6, 2009
8:07 AM
Anonymous writes:
"Gallup: With scandals, broken promises, humiliations, scams, etc., Dear Leader's "
Gasp Gunny bob is a North Korean?
how did he get here?