February 23, 2009 7:42 AM
Unstimulated - Colorado ranks 49th in aid, tax relief
Honey, they shrunk our stimulus.
President Barack Obama signed the economic recovery package in Denver but, at first blush, we're on the short end of the stimulus stick.
Burt Hubbard reports:
Colorado will get $7.89 billion, the equivalent of $1,597 per resident. That ranks 49th among the 50 states, surpassing only Utah in per capita spending and tax savings, according to a Rocky Mountain News analysis of a state-by- state breakdown by the Center for American Progress in Washington, D.C.The top state: Alaska at $2,619 per person.
Evan Dreyer, spokesman for Gov. Bill Ritter, said one reason for the low ranking could be Colorado's relative economic health compared with the rest of the nation. The state has a low unemployment and poverty rate compared with other states.
"Colorado, for many reasons, is doing much better than most other states," Dreyer said.
But the governor's office will keep a close watch on funding, he said.
"I think it will lead us to ask questions of the administration and our delegations to ensure that Colorado is receiving its fair share," he said.
Kathy White of the Colorado Fiscal Policy Institute, a Denver think tank, said it's unclear why the state is in the basement.
Some stimulus funding is based on formulas; other funding levels, such as money for energy projects, are governed by existing state spending plans. Still other allocations will be influenced by proposals that states have yet to submit to the federal government, White said.
February 23, 2009
8:04 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
LOOKS LIKE RITTER AND SALAZAR DIDN'T ASS-KISS DEEP ENOUGH LAST AUGUST.
Since when is success measured in how much you get in a welfare check? True success is how little--not how much--wealfare is distributed.
February 23, 2009
8:10 AM
This is GOOD writes:
This is pretty good help from the Feds
http://www.colorado.gov/cs/Satellite/GovRitter/GOVR/1225627001806
This is the 2009 budget
BUDGET FAST FACTS
Total Budget: $19.2 billion
General Fund: $7.923 billion
you are adding 7.89 billion to help colorado.
thats a 40% increase in revenue.
This will help colorado retire some deficit and debt. Increase its reserve. And also increase spending.
to education , healtcare, public saftey transportation, economic stimulus job creation and development incentives. Veterans services.
February 23, 2009
8:16 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
FORCED WELFARE...
We now learn that State legislatures have the power to override Governors and spend the money by means of the adoption of "concurrent resolution," This is forced welfare even if the states don't want the welfare--a giant step into socialism and forced government control.
Every day we learn something new about the Obama administration.
February 23, 2009
8:28 AM
JMH writes:
...and cue the whinning from the NeoCons who will complain about not getting the money, even though they did nothing but complain about getting the money till now!
The fact of the matter (and the scary part) is that Colorado is actually doing much better than most of the other states in the union! Thus they wont get a huge share...
But getting back to the hypocracy of the GOP, does anyone else just marvel at the "stones" of Doug Lamborn? He votes against this bill... but after it passes, he askes for & receives the Lion's share of the Colorado money for Colorado Springs. Amazing!
What's funny is this somehow represents "princibles" to alot of the NeoCon sheep out there... WOW
February 23, 2009
8:30 AM
Anonymous writes:
http://www.blacktownshow.com.au/images/fruitcake.jpg
February 23, 2009
8:42 AM
Anonymous writes:
lets be honest here
Charlie Brown is a bald headed failure
even his dog hates him
most obviously a gop stooge
btw Bush just got offered a job better suited to his talents. (a store greeter)
February 23, 2009
9:05 AM
Shaggy writes:
I'm not sure if I should thank Owens for actually being responsible keeping Colorado financially healthy not.
Two years under tax Ritter and were already a Billion in the hole.
Any State that takes any of this handout is signing their sole over to the devil of Socialism.
The devil cloaked as the messiah.
February 23, 2009
9:16 AM
Shaggy writes:
"But the governor's office will keep a close watch on funding," --- butt sniffer Evan Dreyer
You mean as close as Congress did when they fabricated the porkulus?
The hypocrisy of the left never ceases to amaze me.
I guess NOW they are SERIOUS about keeping an eye on unnecessary spending.
What a joke, Barry and the Democrats becomes bigger idiots with each passing day.
February 23, 2009
9:36 AM
JW writes:
"The hypocrisy of the left never ceases to amaze me.
I guess NOW they are SERIOUS about keeping an eye on unnecessary spending."
Seriously Shaggy? You actually wrote this, then hit "submit" because you wanted other people to know that you wrote it?
I mean, WTF dude? Over the last 8 years Repubs racked up $5 trillion in debt. Now they are concerned with spending. THAT doesnt strike you as hypocritical, but Dems being concerned with how the stimulus funds are spent DOES?
WTF is wrong with you man?
February 23, 2009
9:45 AM
Larry C writes:
I'm not sure if I should thank Owens for actually being responsible keeping Colorado financially healthy not.
Owens was no help.
Two years under tax Ritter and were already a Billion in the hole.
What spending did Ritter do that put us a Billion in the hole exactly?
Any State that takes any of this handout is signing their sole over to the devil of Socialism.
Huh? you mean china is taking over colorado?
not to worry bush sold us out to china long ago.
The devil cloaked as the messiah
naaa the devil is getting a job as a store greeter in Dallas.
February 23, 2009
10:01 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
Yet another big day for Obama's stimulus plan. This time we are getting introduced to the nationalization (socialization) of our banking system via Citi.
Had enough?
February 23, 2009
10:22 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
OBAMA LIBDEMS: SHRINKING WELFARE IS BAD (FAILURE)...GROWING WELFARE IS GOOD (SUCCESS):
Reward the bad behavior of "victim" deadbeats and slackers...punish the "villains," corporate America, big business and those hard working taxpayers who play by the rules.
The libdem value system is as upside-down as their mortgages!
February 23, 2009
10:25 AM
Shaggy writes:
JW,
If you actually read what I wrote instead of reading what you want it to say you would see that I was clearly referring to the the way the Democrats are hypocritical in being careless in writing the porkulus and now want to be careful in the way it is spent.
Very typical of you though.
Larry C,
Who said we are getting the money from China?
Last I looked, they are needing to borrow too and are not loaning any more to us.
I think this money is nothing more than fabricated money out of thin air with an IOU attached to it that our children and grandchildren will have to pay back.
February 23, 2009
10:37 AM
JMH writes:
"Had enough?" - Charlie Brown
Yes Charlie Brown, we have had enough - enough of your "cut & pasting" from far right-wing publications, enough of you pimping the failed economic policies that have been proven not to work and we have had enough of your drunken rants about anyone who is bright enough to not buy the BS you are selling anymore...
Accept it Chralie Brown, you are a blockhead!
February 23, 2009
10:55 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
CORPORATE WELFARE IS ALIVE AND WELL.
CITI'S ASSETS WILL BE PUT TO WORK FOR THE GOVERNMENT AND NOT THE SHAREHOLDERS' IN EXCHANGE FOR BAILOUT MONEY.
Now take a look at Citi's price chart-its collapsed. There are other banks, like the BofA, that might be sent to slaughter as well--along with millions of jobs. Understand what the problem is now, libdems?
February 23, 2009
11:07 AM
Shaggy writes:
"The problem with Socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples money"--Margaret Thatcher
February 23, 2009
11:17 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
Robert Rubin, Clintion's Sec of Treas and Obama confidant and consultant, ran for a few years and got paid $115mil in 2007. This is what he accomplished:
http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/quickchart/quickchart.asp?symb=c&sid=0&o_symb=c&freq=1&time=9
Its a sneak-previwe of what to expect from THE EMPTY-SUIT in the next few years.
February 23, 2009
11:25 AM
am 760 writes:
"Generational theft", "socialism", "liberal", boy all those BS talking points rush has you memorize is paying off: good boy, sit, now roll over.
The gop is responsible for the greatest deficit in this countries history, and now 1 month in to obamas term and all of a sudden they care about being fiscal conservatives,lol, what a joke.
The weird thing is, that usually after one party loses an election, let alone two, they move more towards the middle or other party.
Yet the gop'ers have done the exact opposite. They have moved father to the right, completely ignoring the will of the american people, and continue to cater to the 25% crowd. Man, I wonder how many seats they will lose in 2010?
Keep up the good work you out of touch neo cons, it just makes it that much easier for the rest of us to progress the country forward, rather that backward, the gop way.
February 23, 2009
11:43 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
THE EMPTY-SUIT ADDRESSES HIS "FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY SUMMIT" consisting of hundres of the very same imbeciles and morons who engineered today's problems and by 5 P.M. he expects the study groups to report back to him with the solutions.
Global investors correctly view this as nothing but shovel-ready bullshit and the DJIA has just plunged another 150 points!
THE EMPTY-SUIT WITH THE FECAL TONGUE TALKS AND REDISTRIBUTES WEALTH AT THE SAME TIME!
HAD ENOUGH? DON'T BLAME ME!
February 23, 2009
11:59 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
CNN: 3 OUT OF 4 AMERICANS S-C-A-R-E-D:
A new national CNN/OPINION rESEARCH poll indicates that three out of four Americans are scared about the way things are going in the country today.
The EMPTY-SUIT'S fear mongering is working, just wait until the next poll.
February 23, 2009
12:03 PM
Shaggy writes:
Hate radio boy,,
Do you understand that this is the single biggest transfer of money from the people to the Government in history?
Up to three trillion when all said and done.
Is it your thinking that because Bush ran up a deficit because of the war it is therefore O.K. for Barry to spend three times the cost of the Iraqi war?
That sounds like how a child thinks.
Do two wrongs make a right in your world?
Cost of Iraqi war = 1 trillion over a ten year period.
Cost of porkulus = up to 3 trillion with interest.
Signed sealed and delivered before anyone even read it.
And talk of porkulus 2 in the makings.
But hey, I am so happy that the mouse in Cali will get thirty million of stimuli when we are all suffering.
February 23, 2009
12:07 PM
KingFishWatch writes:
SASQ is right, it should be a "Fecal Responsibility Summit."
When does this shit end?
February 23, 2009
12:17 PM
JW writes:
You know, if you havent been right in say, 8 years....
AND you cannot make a point without resorting to total and complete BS...
You might want to STFU.
But not Faggy, he just posts MORE.
Its amazing.
February 23, 2009
12:21 PM
SASQUATCH writes:
EMPTY-SUIT'S AUTO CZARS DON'T DRIVE AMERICAN:
Detroit News, Washington Bureau:
The vehicles owned by the Obama administration's auto team could reflect one reason why Detroit's Big Three automakers are in trouble: The list includes few new American cars.
Among the eight members named Friday to the Presidential Task Force on the Auto Industry and the 10 senior policy aides who will assist them in their work, only two own American models. Add the Treasury Department's special adviser to the task force and the total jumps to three.
BBWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
Had enough?
February 23, 2009
12:44 PM
Shaggy writes:
Rule #2 of the Liberal handbook:
"when you can't debate the facts, resort to personal attacks such as name calling"
February 23, 2009
12:58 PM
YEEE HAWWW writes:
"Shanghai Stock Market Up 27 Per Cent
The Shanghai Composite Index closed on Friday at 2,320.80 points, have gained 27 per cent so far in 2009. Traders say 'hot money' is pooring into the market, predominantly into the real estate industry. State media claims that property companies are staking their investments in the hope of a rumoured new 'stimulus' package that the government could announce soon. Chinese A shares eclipsed losers by 895 to 43, with over 30 A shares rising to their 10 per cent daily limits."
look at those communusts go
February 23, 2009
1:00 PM
am 760 writes:
me thinks I heard a sheep baaaing more right wing talking points. good boy, you can follow directions from your puppet master. Not a f#@#%ing thing you parrot is true, but at least you can be the parrot. You will get a smile face today.
BTW, thought you weren't reading my posts anymore. Can you make it through a day without lying?
February 23, 2009
1:04 PM
JMH writes:
God shaggy...
You just don't ever see your hypocracy, do you? LOL...
WOW!
But it's funny...
February 23, 2009
1:21 PM
SASQUATCH writes:
THE USS EMPTY-SUIT:
http://www.uscg.mil/history/gifs/Pendleton_Sinking_Ship.jpg
IT TOOK AFFIRMATIVE ACTION ONLY 4-WEEKS TO DELIVER IT!
February 23, 2009
1:55 PM
SASQUATCH writes:
EMPTY-SUIT SPEAKS WITH FECAL TOUNGE:
DJIA plunges 250 as President Fecal-Tounge holds his "FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY SUMMIT" while planning to take over the banking and auto industries--something he promised NOT do just yesterday.
Do I hear 5 billion peole laughing at this empty-suit or is that just empty's tounge wagging?
February 23, 2009
2:01 PM
Shaggy writes:
I will volunteer to be your tutor today JW.
Which "fact" are you still confused about.
And why do you hate gays so much?
I thought you were a stooge of the love all people party.
February 23, 2009
2:39 PM
FreeToChoose writes:
The Geithner appointment is starting to look like a mistake. He's hiding from Wall Street right now and leaking possible Citi plans to see what might gain public traction. Yikes. This stunning lack of a coherent plan for the banking system is undercutting the markets.
This is starting to look like a continuation of the Bush Administration's plan... which was to have no plan and just spend money to prop up banks on a situational basis... and that's not what people were expecting. In fact, it's getting worse since even when they have a bank targeted, they're not sure what to do!?!?!?!?
Geithner needs to find a microphone and start explaining what his plan is, instead of leaking trial baloon after trial baloon, or DOW 6000 here we come!
February 23, 2009
2:41 PM
Shaggy writes:
"Wall Street trades at worst levels since 1997"
I wonder why, couldn't be that Barry is running around scaring the hell out of everyone causing them to tighten their belts.
I wished we had a President that actually liked America and it's people and not degrade us every chance he gets to speak to foreign nations.
February 23, 2009
2:54 PM
am 760 writes:
Stocks will continue to fall, unemployment will continue to rise, more foreclosures etc... for at least another 3-6-12 months due to the pubs/bushs failed policies.
It took 8 years for the neo cons to destroy the middle class. It will take more than 1 month to fix the problems.
At least we have a president who has recognized the problem, addressed the public about it, and is now doing something to fix it.
Hell the right thought the fundamentals of the economy were sound and never did a thing to fix anything.
At least now we have a president who is actually doing his job and it freaks the right out, lol. I guess the right thinks he should probably be on vacation somewhere like georgie boy always was.
February 23, 2009
2:55 PM
FreeToChoose writes:
I understand why Obama picked Geithner.
He was an up-and-coming fed Governor with a decent track record on the surface. He is the same age as Obama and it would put a young and dynamic face on his economic policy. But there are reports that Geithner had a big hand in the pre-Obama banking policies and his current ad-hoc plans seem to be a continuation of the Paulson Plan he helped draw up! On the surface he looked like a new face, but as it turns out, he's just a part of the old face we never knew about!
Even at his advanced age, Paul Volcker would have been the steadier hand on the tiller. Heck, nearly 30 years ago Volcker showed he had the backbone to make the tough call when necessary and to stand up and take responsibility for it afterwards. Geithner has, so far, shown a reluctance to do either.
With the Fed and Bernanke pretty much sidelined for the moment, the Treasury Department has assumed the mantle of U.S. economic leadership. Geithner needs to make a stand here or his credibility will be shot within the first six weeks of his tenure. And that's not good for Obama.
February 23, 2009
3:36 PM
Anonymous writes:
"within the first six weeks". How about given them some time to figure out what to do, how to do it and than doing it. You didn't seem in much of a hurry when bush and the gop were destroying the middle class.
February 23, 2009
3:50 PM
Shaggy writes:
Hey anon,
I agree, why not let the experts figure out what to do before we sign the largest dept in history onto our children to pay, especially when it has been proven not to work.
Why not give the legislators time to read the damn thing before voting on it.
A stimulus plan is not suppose to include welfare and other expenses that will be recurring.
Once they open the flood gates they will not be able to close them.
hate radio boy,
Do you know who was putting pressure on the Banks to hand out sub prime loans?
Do you know who is behind high Unions wages making our Auto companies unable to compete with foreign markets?
Just keep blaming Bush because randi rhoads tells you to.
Dumbass.
February 23, 2009
4:13 PM
history buff writes:
People are starting to call, asking if they can refinance their mortgages under the stimulus plan. I tell them that we don't know how to go about doing that yet.
Why doesn't that damn empty suit send me instructions on how to solve these problems? Why doesn't Geithner return my calls?
Squat, and Shaggy, and Frito are right. Obama should be able to snap his fingers and things should be fixed. After all, he has been in office a month. A MONTH!!!!
Obama should lie to us like George Bush. That would keep the market from falling. Squat and Shaggy said so, so it must be true. I hear what Squat and Shaggy are saying. Let's all clap three times and recite, I believe in magic, I believe in magic.
Better yet, the White House should put out a statement that the recession is over. Then the market will stop falling, banks will start lending, housing prices will begin to rise and people can go back to work. That's it. That's the GOP solution. Then we can put up a banner that says, Mission Accomplished, and everything will be fine and dandy.
February 23, 2009
4:54 PM
am 760 writes:
baaaaaaaaa,I think I heard a sheep again. If rush/faux told you it was those darn liberals that caused the entire economy to tank, well by gosh, he must be right, and that's it. No debating facts, the messiah of right wing radio told you so thats the truth. BTW, what qualifies rush in anything. Does he have a degree in anything.
9 out of 10 talk radio shows are conservative, that damn liberal media.
February 23, 2009
5:57 PM
Tbone writes:
Shaggy spews forth:
"Is it your thinking that because Bush ran up a deficit because of the war it is therefore O.K. for Barry to spend three times the cost of the Iraqi war?"
Wrong shaggy. Bush wasn't even brave enough to include the iraq war accounting in the budget. Remember all those supplemental spending bills? Yea, that was so bush could say the deficit wasn't that bad. Cowardly, you may call it.
Bush didn't run up a deficit because of the war. The war was on top of his already record-setting deficit.
And speaking of the war/deficit, I thought wars were supposed to stimulate the economy?
Looky there shaggy, I pointed out you were lying and busted a neocon talking point, all in one post.
February 23, 2009
6:22 PM
am 760 writes:
Tbone, well said. its called selective memory, or no memory, for those on the right
February 23, 2009
8:54 PM
FreeToChoose writes:
AM 760:
Talk about a false choice argument! You write:
"Stocks will continue to fall, unemployment will continue to rise, more foreclosures etc... for at least another 3-6-12 months due to the pubs/bushs failed policies.
It took 8 years for the neo cons to destroy the middle class. It will take more than 1 month to fix the problems.
At least we have a president who has recognized the problem, addressed the public about it, and is now doing something to fix it."
Stocks aren't falling right now because the President has recognized the problem, addressed the public and is doing something... they're falling right now precisely because the man Obama picked to deal with the credit crisis, Geithner, has not recognized the problem, not addressed the public about it and appears to be creating policy via press leaks. Now two of the largest banks in the country are being crushed by short-sellers in the wake of Geithner's indecision and will fall soon if Geithner continues to waffle.
Geithner was the NY Fed Governor. It's not like he's coming into this situation cold. He's been a part of the decision-making since the beginning of the banking crisis. He should be more on top of it than this. All of your whining about taking time is no excuse for Geithner hiding from the media and leaving all the stakeholders in these institutions dangling in the wind. Heck, he's leaving the entire financial system dangling.
And that can't be blamed on the Bush Administration. This is Geithner and Obama's time to do the something. And so far the only thing Obama and Geithner have brought to the markets is a renewed sense of fear... and therefore selling. If investors truly believed things will be getting better in 3, 6 or 12 months, they wouldn't be selling right now, they'd be buying!
And yes, Geithner will indeed blow his credibility in this first 6 weeks if he doesn't stand up and take a stand soon. You only get one chance at a first impression. And Geithner is blowing it. That's not a partisan shot... I endorsed Geithner on this very page when he was picked. I thought it was an inspired choice at the time. But now I wish Obama had picked Volcker. At the very least, Volcker would have stood in front of the world and said exactly what he thought should be done... then he would do it. And that's all the markets need right now.
February 23, 2009
9:38 PM
history buff writes:
"Stocks aren't falling right now because the President has recognized the problem, addressed the public and is doing something... they're falling right now precisely because the man Obama picked to deal with the credit crisis,"
LOLOLOL.....
"The market can stay irrational longer than you can remain solvent." -- John Maynard Keyens
Good thing you don't have to support that with evidence. Hint: rumor, hearsay and innuendo are not evidence.
February 23, 2009
9:48 PM
history buff writes:
"Stocks aren't falling right now because the President has recognized the problem, addressed the public and is doing something... they're falling right now precisely because the man Obama picked to deal with the credit crisis,"
LOLOLOL.....
"The market can stay irrational longer than you can remain solvent." -- John Maynard Keynes
Good thing you don't have to support that with evidence. Hint: rumor, hearsay and innuendo are not evidence.
February 23, 2009
10:36 PM
rickg19611 writes:
This is GOOD writes:
"This is pretty good help from the Feds
This is the 2009 budget
BUDGET FAST FACTS
Total Budget: $19.2 billion
General Fund: $7.923 billion
you are adding 7.89 billion to help colorado.
thats a 40% increase in revenue. "
Wrong. You are comparing 4 years of Federal spending with the 2009 budget for Colorado.
Remember... less than 11% of the "stimulus" bill will even be spent this year, so Colorado stands to get only $800 million in 2009. So that is only a 4% increase in revenue.
And considering that most economists estimate that the economy will shrink by 5% in the first quarter alone... resulting in a 5% decrease in tax revenues for Colorado, the result is ZIPPO for 2009.
February 23, 2009
10:56 PM
history buff writes:
But, Rick -- if there were no federal stimulus, our net would be less than zippo. The stimulus is intended to stop the downward death spiral embraced by ideologues. If our net is zippo, at least we aren't losing ground.
See, it is like this. An airplane goes into a nose dive from 14,000, looking like it is going to crash into the ground. Well, the stimulus slows down the death spiral and gets the plane to level off at 4000. Now, some people will complain that the plane is now at 4000 instead of 14000, but a thankful person will be happy that the plane doesn't splat on the tarmac and kill everybody on board.
February 23, 2009
11:00 PM
RegLib writes:
Shaggy,
"Any State that takes any of this handout is signing their sole over to the devil of Socialism."
Why do Socialists need my dinner?
February 24, 2009
6:07 AM
ditto writes:
Wow, the GOP is responsible for the greatest deficit in this countries history. The Republicans lost the last to elections. Get the picture.
February 24, 2009
8:14 AM
JW writes:
"Stocks aren't falling right now because the President has recognized the problem, addressed the public and is doing something... they're falling right now precisely because the man Obama picked to deal with the credit crisis, Geithner, has not recognized the problem, not addressed the public about it and appears to be creating policy via press leaks. Now two of the largest banks in the country are being crushed by short-sellers in the wake of Geithner's indecision and will fall soon if Geithner continues to waffle."
Dude, STFU. Stocks arent falling because the Obama admin has failed to cheerlead the economy enough. Stocks arent falling because the Obama admin has failed to be confident enough about the state of the economy. If they had done the things you suggest with this idiocy, stocks would be LOWER because the market would think, "Oh, great. We have idiots in charge. They cant even see there is a problem!"
Stocks are falling because financial reports from ALL OVER THE WORLD SUCK!!!
This problem took years to create (and no, you cant just lay it at Bush's feet). You think a bit of confidence and some "Rah! Rah! Ive got a plan!" is going to fix it? Yea, because youre an ignorant chump.
BTW, that wasnt a false choice fallacy by AM. It was simply his opinion. He never came close to an "Its either this, or that" statement.
Damn, I almost wish I hadnt started pointing out fallacious argument from you tards. Youre too stupid to recognize them, so you dont stop using them, and then you start throwing around accusations of other people using them as if you had a clue.
Morons.
"And yes, Geithner will indeed blow his credibility in this first 6 weeks if he doesn't stand up and take a stand soon. You only get one chance at a first impression. And Geithner is blowing it. That's not a partisan shot... I endorsed Geithner on this very page when he was picked. I thought it was an inspired choice at the time. But now I wish Obama had picked Volcker. At the very least, Volcker would have stood in front of the world and said exactly what he thought should be done... then he would do it. And that's all the markets need right now. "
Then CALM DOWN. Youre hysterical. STFU and realize, this is a NASTY problem, and NO ONE is going to solve it with "confidence". We need to give it time.
February 24, 2009
8:58 AM
Shaggy writes:
From an e-mail that hits the nail on the head, pun intended:
"The government today announced that it is changing its national symbol to a CONDOM because it more accurately reflects the government’s political stance.
A condom allows for inflation, halts production, destroys the next generation, protects a bunch of pricks, and gives you a sense of security while you are actually being screwed."
Buff, Rumproast, hate radio boy,
Your posts don't even deserve a response.
Its all Bush's fault in your pea brains, I get it.
I understand you are not open to the truth, just blame Bush.
Barry is doing the same thing while he is scaring the hell out of the markets, even your idol Bill Clinton told him to knock it off if he expects people to go out and spend.
You say he isn't lying to the people like Bush did but you are from right.
Barry has done NOTHING but lie to the people from day one of his campaign.
BTW, The real reason behind him spreading doom and gloom is all Political. No matter to what degree the market makes a rebound he can claim credit and talk how we avoided a meltdown do to his stimulus.
FreeToChoose is spot on,
Problem is many Americans are skeptical about this bailout not working because it has never worked and the person who doesn't even know how to handle his own taxes is in charge of it.
The markets are proof.
People simply do not trust Barry or Geitner and now their is talk of Nationalizing the Banks and that has people running scared.
Government needs to stay away and let the free markets work. Government is the problem.
If you trust them to handle this just look what they did to our SS.
February 24, 2009
9:19 AM
JMH writes:
FreeToChoose,
You may want to reconsider your positions... you are making sense to shaggy!
February 24, 2009
9:34 AM
SASQUATCH writes:
AND NOW YOU KNOW WHERE IT WENT!
(Reuters) – The United States plans to offer more than $900 million to help rebuild Gaza after Israel's invasion and to strengthen the Western-backed Palestinian Authority, U.S. officials said on Monday.
EMPTY-SUITNOMICS
February 24, 2009
10:14 AM
am 760 writes:
Remember, Obama has spent 30+ days trying to fix the economic mess left to him by the pubs. Pubs didn't try to fix anything, they created the mess and said the fundamentals of the economy are fine.
REMEMBER! Put blame where it belongs and give credit to those who are trying to solve the problem.
After bush and his pubs have destroyed the middle class, robbed the treasury and enriched their cronies, they should have dragged out that banner again, MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. It is the one goal they had which they actually did accomplished so I will give them credit for destoying the middle class which is what they wanted.
February 24, 2009
10:38 AM
FreeToChoose writes:
Love all the "STFU" comments...
so somebody who threw that garbage at me please tell me why Geithner is:
1) Hiding from the press
2) Leaking contradictory policy regarding the bailout
Bernanke stepped in front of a microphone today and spelled out what's happening and what he can do and the markets stabilized. Get the picture Geithner?!?!?!?!
It's not like I'm trying to bait the Jays and History Buffs or JWs of the world... as I said, I was behind Geithner's appointment at first! I just want to see him stop hiding and start leading!!!
And I reject, out of hand, the argument that he needs more time. He was the NY Fed Governor and has been part of the decision-making team regarding the bank crisis from the beginning. He just needs to stop waffling and start leading...
And thanks for helping me make my point History Buff! That quote by Keynes regards irrational behavior. In this case, that irrational behavior is fear. Markets overeact irrationally to the upside on the basis of greed, to the downside on the basis of fear. The sooner Geithner takes steps to quell that fear, the less time the markets will stay irrational.
I'm not a huge fan of Bernanke, but at least he always appears willing and able to answers questions honestly and clearly... and that helped stem the fear today. Now it's Geithmer's turn. He just better not wait too long and he better have a clearer idea of what he plans to do than the last time he stepped in front of a microphone.
February 24, 2009
10:51 AM
Shaggy writes:
JMH,
I understand the need for personal attacks when you cannot debate the facts and truths.
Hate radio boy,
Why is it that you refuse to answer to these facts.
Do you know who was putting pressure on the Banks to hand out sub-prime loans?
Do you know who is always pushing for higher pay amongst Unions?
I am not saying Bush did a good job but putting all the blame on the GOP shows that you have no idea WTF you are talking about because it simply is not true.
Even JW is man enough to admit to this, why aren't you?
Are you so partisian that you think the Democrats in Congress had nothing to do with it?
If so, you are more of an idiot than I previously thought.
February 24, 2009
10:55 AM
history buff writes:
Sure, the market is plunging, lighten up. It's only money. The market today is sort of like the scene near the end of The Treasure of the Sierra Madre when the bandits think the gold is merely sand so they dump it out and it blows back from where it came. Don't kill yourself. You are still alive and its only money.
http://blogmaverick.com/2009/02/20/a-little-video-comedy/
February 24, 2009
11:00 AM
JW writes:
"1) Hiding from the press
2) Leaking contradictory policy regarding the bailout "
If hes hiding from the press, how do you know hes leaking contradictory policy regarding the bailout?
You dont. Youre just making ASSumptions.
"Bernanke stepped in front of a microphone today and spelled out what's happening and what he can do and the markets stabilized. Get the picture Geithner?!?!?!?!"
No he didnt. He said the most negative things hes EVER said about our outlook at the moment.
"It's not like I'm trying to bait the Jays and History Buffs or JWs of the world... as I said, I was behind Geithner's appointment at first! I just want to see him stop hiding and start leading!!!"
Fine. But blaming whats happening in the financial markets all on this guy because he isnt doing what YOU want is idiotic. I wasnt trying to bait you. I was just pointing the idiocy out!
"And thanks for helping me make my point History Buff! That quote by Keynes regards irrational behavior. In this case, that irrational behavior is fear. Markets overeact irrationally to the upside on the basis of greed, to the downside on the basis of fear. The sooner Geithner takes steps to quell that fear, the less time the markets will stay irrational."
Do you live in a cave? Do you just look for things that support what you already think?
Have you ever asked yourself if the current behavior on the stock market really is "irrational" or are you just ASSuming it is becasue it fits what you want to believe?
The financial picture WORLD WIDE is about as bad as it gets chumpsky. I dont think a bit of fear is "irrational".
Funny thing here is that everyone scoffs when that "irrational" label is put on overly POSITIVE behavior. But let the stock market tank and BAM!!! All you "Free Market" fairweather fans are out screaming for the government to save you.
Its pathetic.
"I'm not a huge fan of Bernanke, but at least he always appears willing and able to answers questions honestly and clearly... and that helped stem the fear today."
So you are a monkey, and it doesnt matter what someone says as long as they say it with confidence.
I mean seriously, Bernake got up there and said recovery will take YEARS, and you think that helped "stem the fear"?
Look, markets have COLLAPSED. Its going to take time to fix, and its not going to get all rosy just because someone comes out and says "I have a plan!" Deal with it.
February 24, 2009
11:29 AM
am 760 writes:
Even though the corporate conservative mainstream media is doing everything they can to discredit our President, its just not working, unless your a right wing partisian hack:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/24/us/politics/24poll.html?ref=washington
February 24, 2009
11:30 AM
Shaggy writes:
Wow JW, you are so much smarter than anyone I know.
You are my hero.
I am sure you are your own hero too.
Those Liberal Professors are doing wonders in the brainwashing department lately.
February 24, 2009
11:41 AM
am 760 writes:
Defining media moments of 08, that define the media as a bunch of conservative hacks:
http://www.motherjones.com/washington_dispatch/2009/02/reporters-behaving-badly.html
And don't bitch about the source. Again, if you can refute the facts presented please do.
shagsheep, why are you still reading my posts? You said you didn't.
For the last time the gop playbook of deregulation and no accountability caused this melt down. Remember, your side thinks government is the problem. My side thinks government can be part of the solution. I don't hate my government like those on the right.
February 24, 2009
11:59 AM
JW writes:
"Wow JW, you are so much smarter than anyone I know."
How can that be Shaggy? I have been wrong in the past. At the very least, Im not as smart as you are, because you have NEVER been wrong.
"Those Liberal Professors are doing wonders in the brainwashing department lately."
This is based on ignorance. You dont know my professors. You dont know if they are liberal or not. Ignorance, pure and simple.
February 24, 2009
12:48 PM
Shaggy writes:
"shagsheep, why are you still reading my posts? You said you didn't."---hate radio boy
Even us responsible fiscal conservatives enjoy a good comical at times.
"For the last time the gop playbook of deregulation"---hate radio boy
Please watch this video to educate yourself unless you want to keep looking and sounding the fool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs
Your right JW, I do not personally know who your professors are but I do see their bi-product and can reasonably assume they are Liberal.
Why don't you watch this video of the Democrats defending the structure of Freddy and Franny as stable when the Republicans were warning of a mortgage meltdown and to put tougher regulations on them.
February 24, 2009
1:53 PM
FreeToChoose writes:
Now you're putting me on positions I have never taken, JW, when you say:
"Funny thing here is that everyone scoffs when that "irrational" label is put on overly POSITIVE behavior. But let the stock market tank and BAM!!! All you "Free Market" fairweather fans are out screaming for the government to save you."
One, I'm not crying for the government to save me.
Two, it's the government that started down the road of intervention, but hasn't really stated how that intervention will manifest itself... which is the worst of all possible scenarios. The financial system is waiting around like a 16 year-old pining for a return phone call from the pretty girl who promised to go to the dance with him.
Three, I haven't stated what I want Geithner to say... I just want him to say SOMETHING! The FEAR in the market right now regards uncertainty. I believe JP Morgan recently cut its dividend and the stock jumped on the news. Bad news does not usually equal a positive move in price, but it removed uncertainty and in this case, the clarity was worth more than the lost dividend. The same thing is happening across the financial spectrum and there are only a handful of people in the world who can help to remove the uncertainty in the broader financial markets. The three biggest are Obama, Geithner and Bernanke. So far, Obama and Bernanke have been out there trying to alleviate the uncertainty, and doing a pretty good job of it. However, Geithner has been conspicuously absent and the leaks regarding Citigroup's future have been a jumbled mess.
The fact that the White House had to come out and declare the banks would not be nationalized is telling... because that's the sort of thing Geithner should be out front saying in person!
And, for the record, I think Geithner's stress test idea is a good one. But the uncertainty regarding our three largest financial institutions (Citi, B of A and Wells) is not acceptable. He's been in on this from the start and he needs to step up before the shorts take the decision out of his hands.
Also, since we're heading down the road of a highly restricted and highly regulated banking structure, I hope the government keeps going down this road and creates a utility-like oversight for a select few of these large lenders... then I hope it tells the rest that they're on their own and if they fail, tough! (maybe that's what will happen after the stress-test is appplied?) For the most part, I would love to see a couple of these banks fail to set the system straight, no matter how large.
But that's not the world we live in. The government continues to chant its "too big to fail" mantra, while still unsure how to proceed. It's neither letting the banks fail, nor helping them to move on! And that, as I said above, is the worst possible scenario...
These aren't assumptions, they are informed opinions. I've worked in the financial markets for 15 years, have a degree in Economics and an MBA in Finance so I think I've earned the latitude to make an informed opinion regarding these matters. You can confuse opinion with ASSumptions (so clever!) and tell me to STFU and insult me... but it doesn't change the argument.
Clarity of purpose is what the financial systems needs right now. Yet Geithner hides...
February 24, 2009
2:18 PM
JW writes:
"One, I'm not crying for the government to save me. "
Looks like it from here.
"Two, it's the government that started down the road of intervention, but hasn't really stated how that intervention will manifest itself... which is the worst of all possible scenarios. The financial system is waiting around like a 16 year-old pining for a return phone call from the pretty girl who promised to go to the dance with him."
I just dont think this is reality. I think the market moves on things that are a bit more concrete. The financials, for instance. Sure, they may not be gleaning any confidence from what the govt is putting out right now, but they are DAMN SURE crapping their pants because of what BALANCE SHEETS are telling them.
"Three, I haven't stated what I want Geithner to say... I just want him to say SOMETHING!"
Ok. Wont help but maybe in a short term, superficial sense.
"The FEAR in the market right now regards uncertainty."
I think its based on certainty. Certainty that we are in a HORRIBLE economy.
The rest I thought was fine, till you got to this:
"But that's not the world we live in. The government continues to chant its "too big to fail" mantra"
Thats not what the issue was. The issue was how intertwined their balance sheets were. One fell, two others would fall. This is why some people say letting Lehman fall was stupid. I personally dont know that Paulson could have known. Then again, maybe he could have, and he just couldnt get past his "moral hazzard" ideological argument until reality SLAPPED him in the face. Thats the problem with ideology, it cant adapt to FACT.
"These aren't assumptions, they are informed opinions. I've worked in the financial markets for 15 years, have a degree in Economics and an MBA in Finance so I think I've earned the latitude to make an informed opinion regarding these matters. You can confuse opinion with ASSumptions (so clever!) and tell me to STFU and insult me... but it doesn't change the argument."
Ill be graduating with my MBA in August and work for one of the healthiest banks currently left standing, and I can tell you...
If you really have an MBA they should have taught you the difference between IDEOLOGY and FACT.
February 24, 2009
2:38 PM
JW writes:
On the flip side FTC...
I appologize for all the STFU stuff.
I guess Im so used to dealing with ignorant Ideologes I ASSumed you were one too.
You do have a right to your opinion.
That said, I still think you are A) crying for government to fix this because you think financial decision makers will, for some reason, and against all real data to the contrary, suddenly become confident just because Geithner gets out there and tells them to be and B) are too reliant on Ideology rather than data. That stuff about "too big to fail" is IDEOLOGY. Reality was that they were just too interlinked financially. When Lehman fell, the shockwave nearly knocked a few others down. If they had let Bear Sterns go, same issue. Let two of them go? Hell, I dont know what would have happened, but it wouldnt have been pretty.
From what Ive read recently about BofA, they maybe should just push them into bankruptcy and sell off the good stuff. Dunno though, decisions like that are out of my league.
Anyway, great Frontline on this stuff recently. Check it out if you have time. They are all online.
February 24, 2009
2:50 PM
history buff writes:
According to the Wall Street Journal, yesterday's falling market began when the tech sector announced that computer sales are down and are projected to stay down through the year.
I don't dispute there is a role for Geithner, but I think the right wing is trying to personify the reasons for poor performance in the market. That makes it easier to blame Obama for things that he didn't cause and can't correct anytime soon.
And I think the expectation that reassuring words from Geithner will stop fear in the market is overrated. Hank Paulson put on a full court press, and I for one was singularly impressed by his performance. He is the epitome of the silver tongued salesman. The man who has all the answers. But he didn't stop the market from falling.
It looks like the administration is studying how to implement TARP II. There was no oversight to TARP I. (How can billions in bonuses from taxpayer funds be justified in this economy?) Obama is cautious. He acts like a lawyer. He wants to be prepared before he acts because an oversight or blunder would be much more harmful to the market than the delay experienced because of due diligence. Geithner could tell the press that the administration is studying the problem, but they should already know that.
I'm convinced most of the criticisms aimed at Geithner are for political and ideological reasons. And I also don't expect Obama or anyone else to come up with a miracle cure. Anyone who doesn't expect tough sledding can't be taken seriously.
February 24, 2009
3:09 PM
gr8fuldude writes:
Uhm, Shags...I don't get too worked up over the political blogs, but if JW is in an MBA program (I believe that he is), he is likely to NOT have all liberal profs. That is usually in more of the arts classes. I likewise have an MBA and didn't encounter too many raving leftists in the UCONN business program.
February 24, 2009
3:10 PM
am 760 writes:
"Republicans were warning of a mortgage meltdown and to put tougher regulations on them"
funny than, why didn't they do anything to stop it? Why didn't they adopt tougher regulations? They had the both houses and the presidency for almost 8 years, yet they did nothing to stop this, and even encouraged it. But it was the powerless dems who are at fault,lol. So where's the blame lay.
Still waiting for that one piece of legislation or law passed by pubs that benefited the middle class or poor.
JW, did you ever check into that book about greenspan i mentioned?
February 24, 2009
3:27 PM
Truth writes:
greenspan was a retard.
February 24, 2009
3:38 PM
JW writes:
"JW, did you ever check into that book about greenspan i mentioned?"
No, but no offence. I REALLY dont have time to read...well, ANYTHING but course work right now.
What was the name of it and Ill put it on my list.
February 24, 2009
3:39 PM
JMH writes:
AM760, I saw that poll too... Since the NeoCons on here wont bother to go to the link and read it (if they can read)... I figured I'd post the highlights...
To sum it up... Please keep doing what you are doing NeoCons, the public is against YOU! Read it and weep... The public sees what the GOP is doing and don't like it, the public supports Obama and his plans and the public doesn't seem to like the GOP very much right now (even some Republicans themselves)... This is what happens when you refuse to learn from your mistakes NeoCons... Keep believing the American public wants you to keep going FURTHER to the right... LOL... Pretty soon the Whig Party will need to make a come back...
Survey Reveals Broad Support for President
President Obama is benefiting from remarkably high levels of optimism and confidence among Americans about his leadership, providing him with substantial political clout as he confronts the nation’s economic challenges and opposition from nearly all Republicans in Congress, according to the latest New York Times/CBS News poll.
A majority of people surveyed in both parties said Mr. Obama was striving to work in a bipartisan way, but most faulted Republicans for their response to the president, saying the party had objected to the $787 billion economic stimulus plan for political reasons. Most said Mr. Obama should pursue the priorities he campaigned on, the poll found, rather than seek middle ground with Republicans.
Most Americans said the president was trying to make good on his promise to bridge the partisan divide. About three-quarters, including 6 in 10 Republicans, said Mr. Obama had been trying to work with Republicans. But only 3 in 10 Americans said Republicans were doing the same.
On the economic stimulus plan, 63 percent of poll respondents said Republicans opposed the legislation for political reasons, not policy ones. 79 percent said Republicans should now be working in a bipartisan manner rather than holding fast with their policies.
But 56 percent of those surveyed said Mr. Obama’s priority should be following the policies he proposed during the campaign last year, rather than working with Republicans.
February 24, 2009
3:51 PM
JW writes:
Hey Gr8 and FTC,
What do you guys think the effect of getting rid of the uptic rule has been?
Im thinking these drastic declines are partially exacerbated by it.
February 24, 2009
3:54 PM
JMH writes:
Here is another poll:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29358401/?GT1=43001
You know what is funny though... I can guarantee that all the NeoCons who don't like this will just cry "liberal media" and dissmiss all of this...
Probably why they never learn from their mistakes... they refuse to accept any critisim or accountablity... But I don't care... I hope they keep it up, they will be irrelevant for a long time until they do wise up and are willing to grow up and do some "self-evaluation"!
But hey, from these polls & using NeoCon logic, they will conclude that 2/3rds of Americans hate America and support socialism... right? LOL...
But here is goes:
WASHINGTON - Large majorities of Americans support President Barack Obama's plans to revive the economy and his efforts to work across party lines, according to a pair of public opinion polls released Monday.
One month into his presidency, a Washington Post-ABC News poll found 68 percent of Americans approve of Obama's job performance.
Sixty-four percent of respondents supported the administration's $787 billion economic stimulus package and the same percentage backed his proposal to prevent housing foreclosures, the Washington Post reported.
February 24, 2009
4:16 PM
gr8fuldude writes:
I think right now the elimination of the uptick rule is only hurting us, because it encourages short selling, which is what you do NOT want during times of high volatility. I think it appears to be a hinderance (note the emphasis on APPEARS) during a bull market, but it serves its purpose.
I think the purpose of regulating the sale of stock should be to alleviate some of the emotion-driven buying and selling, and to protect stockholders from the short term volatility (fwiw, I also thought the circuit-breakers were good, but should be adjusted to be a percentage of the index)
February 24, 2009
4:38 PM
am 760 writes:
JW, if you get a chance to read these let me know your take. The first one I heard Thom Hartman talking about, the 2nd one I just saw on www.amazon.com when I was looking up the first one.
"Greenspan Fraud: How Two Decades of His Policies Have Underminded the Global Economy" by Ravi Batra an economist and SMU
"Greenspands Bubbles: The Age of Ignorance at the Federal Reserve" by William Fleckenstein and Fred Sheehan
February 24, 2009
7:11 PM
Shaggy writes:
"funny than, why didn't they do anything to stop it? Why didn't they adopt tougher regulations? They had the both houses and the presidency for almost 8 years, yet they did nothing to stop this, and even encouraged it"
They did not encourage it as far as I know maybe you can provide me some proof like I provided you? hint hint
I agree with you that they should have done more to block the threat of a filibuster the Democrats promised to imposed if they put tougher regulations on F&F, which did happen btw, and bring it out into the spotlight that there was indeed a mortgage crisis in the making.
I lay blame on the Republicans for this.
Did you take the time to watch my link?
Have we laid to rest that was indeed the Dumbs that promoted risky loans?
February 25, 2009
10:41 AM
bill writes:
Greenspands Bubbles: The Age of Ignorance at the Federal Reserve" by William Fleckenstein and Fred Sheehan
Just to let you know Bill Fleckenstein is a stock market Bear who made his money betting on ecomomic decline. He was shorting stocks and was a bear even during the economic boom of the 90s.
and was blaming greespan on the tech bubble too.
The guy calls everthing going up a bubble.
February 25, 2009
1:45 PM
am 760 writes:
Bill, thats your opinion, maybe others who read it will have a different opinion
February 25, 2009
3:45 PM
FreeToChoose writes:
So, all you Geithner defenders...
I'm being hard on Geithner because he's not exactly an innocent player in this whole mess.
He was Governor of the NY Fed, and along with the Comptroller of the Currency, he had a large regulatory responsibility when it came to the Citigroups and Lehmans of Wall Street racking up leverage ratios of 20, 30 and 40 to buy swaps and mortgage derivitives. If you want to blame the Bush Administration for lax oversight, you better pencil Geithner in as a co-conspirator! Because most of the lax oversight of Wall Street happened under his very nose.
Then last fall he helped Paulson and Bernanke come up with the widely lambasted TARP idea... yet he gets off scott free in the criticism that the left heaped on the use of TARP funds????
Despite his relatively fresh face in national politics he was part of the mess from the beginning, and now he's in charge of it.
At first I believed his intimate involvement in the bailout from the beginning would be an asset, but the more I learn of his involvement in the early stages of the crisis and about his recent policy missteps with Citigroup, the more I'm starting to think his appointment was a mistake. Obama should have made a clean break with the old guard... but most people still don't realize that Geithner was actually a part of the OLD GUARD so they just give him a pass!!! And that's what's killin' me right now... the folks who heap blame on Bush and Paulson for lax oversight but say "Give Geithner a chance, he needs time!"
Still, he has time to get it right... and I don't want Geithner to come out as "just" a cheerleader, I want him to come out with a plan. He's not getting lambasted for hiding from the press for lack of cheerleading, he's getting lambasted for a lack of specifics. He's basically copying Paulson's ad hoc application of policy. But I guess that makes sense, since he was one of the three main architects of the first TARP that was sold as a troubled asset purchasing program, but ended up being a bank asset support plan. Go figure...